Watchtower: Jury Trial Day 4, Candace Conti v. Watchtower

8/20/2019 Watchtower: Jury Trial Day 4, Candace Conti v. Watchtower

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1 mi nor v i c t i m t hat was r epor t ed t o you i ndependent l y by

2 t he vi c t i m?

3 A. As I r ec al l , he k i nd of mi ni mi z ed what

4 o cc ur r ed.

5 Q. Based on t he s t a t ement s t ha t you t ook , di d

6 you make a r ecommenda t i on t o t he Di s t r i c t At t o r ney' s

7 Of f i ce?

8 A. Yes , I di d.

9 Q. What di d you r ec ommend?

10 A. I t ook t he c as e over t o t he Di s t r i c t11 At t or ney' s Of f i c e f or r evi ew.

12 Q. And di d you make a r ecommendat i on as t o t hat ?

13 A. Yeah. I f i l ed a f or mal c ompl ai nt .

14 Q. Do you know who t he di s t r i c t a t t or ney was who

15 was ass i gned t o t ha t case?

16 A. Yes , I do.17 Q. Who was t hat ?

18 A. Reg Saunder s .

19 Q. And do you know what capaci t y he ser ves i n

20 pr es ent l y?

21 A. Yes , I do.

22 Q. Wha t i s t hat ?

23 A. He i s a j udge i n Al ameda Count y.

24 Q. Now, i n t he c our s e of y our i nv es t i gat i on,

25 a f t er t a ki ng t he s e s t at ement s a nd bef o r e goi ng t o t he


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1 di s t r i c t a t t or ne y wi t h t hem, di d y ou hav e any ne ed t o

2 c ont ac t any one f r o m t he J ehov ah' s Wi t nes s e s

3 c ongr e ga t i on?

4 A. No.

5 Q. And di d y ou f eel y ou had s uf f i c i ent

6 i nf or mat i o n t hat y ou c oul d pr es e nt y our c as e t o

7 Mr . Saunder s of t he Di s t r i c t At t or ney' s Of f i c e?

8 A. Yes , s i r .

9 Q. You now wor k i n t he Di s t r i c t At t or ney ' s

10 Of f i c e as an i nves t i gat or .11 Wer e t her e i nves t i gat or s i n t he Di s t r i c t

12 At t or ney ' s Of f i c e ba ck i n t he 1994 t i me f r ame?

13 A. Yes .

14 Q. And i f - - ba s ed on y our ex per i e nc e i n t he

15 s ys t em f or al l t hes e year s , i f t he di s t r i c t at t or ney i n

16 t he c as e r equi r ed f ur t her i nf or mat i on, c oul d he as s i gn a17 di s t r i c t at t or ney' s i nves t i gat or t o go get i t ?

18 A. Yes , t hey c an. Onc e t he c ompl ai nt i s f i l ed,

19 i t t he n be co me s t hei r j ob t o do wha t ev er dut i e s or

20 wha t ev er e l s e ne eds t o be done af t e r t he f ac t .

21 Q. But t hi s was a pr e t t y c ompl et e c as e , j us t

22 wi t h what you t hought you had.

23 A. I t hought i t was .

24 MR. SI MONS: Thank you.

25 Not hi ng f ur t her .


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1

2 CROSS- EXAMI NATI ON

3 BY MR. SCHNACK:

4 Q. Of f i c er Davi l a, you wr ot e t he pol i c e r epor t

5 t ha t Mr . Si mons s h owed y ou; i s t hat c or r ec t ?

6 A. Yes , s i r .

7 Q. And I not i c e on t he s ec ond page i t c al l s i t a

8 c onf i dent i al r epor t ; i s t hat cor r ec t ?

9 A. Yes .

10 Q. And i t wa s c onf i de nt i a l why ?11 A. Wel l , bas e d on t he f ac t t ha t be ca us e t he

12 v i c t i m was a j uv eni l e at t he t i me, t her e wer e l aws t hat

13 pr ot ec t t hem f r om t hei r names bei ng on pol i c e r epor t s .

14 Q. And y our pol i c e i nves t i gat i on was i ni t i at ed

15 by a r epor t f r om t he Chi l d Pr ot ec t i ve Ser vi c es ; i s t hat

16 c o r r e c t ?17 A. Yes , s i r , i t was .

18 Q. And do you know who r epor t ed i t t o Chi l d

19 Pr ot ec t i ve Ser vi c es ?

20 A. I don' t r ecal l at t hi s t i me.

21 Q. And y our pol i c e r e po r t a l s o ment i ons t hat

22 when you conduc t ed t he i nt e r v i ews , t he r e was a Chi l d

23 P r o t ec t i v e Ser v i c es c as e wo r k er wi t h y ou?

24 A. Yes , s i r .

25 Q. And do y ou r ec al l t hat ?


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1 A. Yes .

2 Q. So you have s ome s peci f i c memor y?

3 A. Bas i c al l y. I t has been a l ong t i me.

4 Q. Yes .

5 A. I i nves t i gat ed a l ot of c as es i n t hat t i me

6 f r ame.

7 Q. But i t has been 18 yea r s .

8 And i s t her e any t hi ng i n t he r epor t t hat y ou

9 woul d s a y i s not ac c ur at e, es s e nt i al l y, now, 18 y ear s

10 l at er ?11 A. Yes . I di dn' t s ee anyt hi ng t hat i s

12 i nac cur at e.

13 Q. Ok ay. And a t t he t i me t hat y ou wr o t e i t , y ou

14 i nt ended i t t o be ac c ur at e?

15 A. Yes , s i r .

16 Q. So you wr ot e i n t he r epor t t hat t he vi c t i m - -17 and her name has been out her e, Andr ea i s what s he has

18 been c al l ed - - s he t ol d y ou t hat , quot e, s he t ook one

19 Vi c odi n f or her bac k pr obl em and l ai d down i n her r oom

20 a r o und 7: 00 or 8: 00 p. m. , c l o s e quo t e.

21 So i s i t your t es t i mony t hat t he vi c t i m t ol d

22 you t ha t she had t aken t he Vi codi n?

23 A. Yes .

24 Q. And s he di dn' t t el l y ou t hat Mr . Kendr i c k had

25 gi ven her t he Vi c odi n; i s t hat c or r ec t ?


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1 A. I don' t r ecal l .

2 Q. But you woul d have wr i t t en t ha t i n your

3 r epor t i f s h e ha d t o l d y ou t hat Kendr i c k had gi v en her

4 t he Vi c odi n.

5 A. I t ' s been a l ong t i me. I don' t k now.

6 Q. But y ou i nt e nded t he r epor t t o be a cc ur at e

7 when you r epor t ed i t ?

8 A. Yes , s i r .

9 Q. You a l so wr o t e t ha t Andr ea t o l d you t ha t

10 J onat han Kendr i c k had admi t t ed t he i nc i dent t o, quot e,11 t he el der s o f t he c hur c h, c l os e quot e.

12 Do you r ec al l wr i t i ng t hat ?

13 A. Yes , I do.

14 Q. And do y ou r ec al l her t el l i ng y ou t hat ?

15 A. Yes , s i r .

16 Q. And y ou di dn' t t al k t o t he el der s i n t he17 c hur c h at al l , di d you?

18 A. No, I di d not .

19 Q. And i f you had i nt er vi ewed t hem, you woul d

20 hav e wr i t t en t hat i n your r epor t , as wel l ?

21 A. Yes , s i r .

22 Q. Di d y ou ev er not i f y any of t he el der s or

23 anyone el se i n t he chur ch t ha t Kendr i ck had been cha r ged

24 wi t h a sex c r i me?

25 A. I don' t bel i eve s o.


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1 Q. Do you know what t he r esul t s of t he char ges

2 t ha t wer e br ought aga i ns t Mr . Kendr i ck wer e?

3 A. No, I do not .

4 Q. So y ou di dn' t t ak e any s t eps t o i nf or m any one

5 at t he c hur c h t hat Mr . Kendr i c k was a chi l d mol es t er ; i s

6 t h a t c o r r e c t ?


8 Q. Do you know i f anyone e l se a t t he po l i ce

9 depar t ment di d t ha t ?

10 A. I don' t k now.11 Q. And do y ou k no w i f t he Chi l d P r ot ec t i v e

12 Ser v i c es t ook any s t eps t o not i f y t he congr egat i on or

13 anyone a t t he chur ch t ha t Kendr i ck was a chi l d mol es t e r ?

14 A. I don' t k now.

15 Q. Do y ou k now i f t he DA' s of f i c e di d t hat ?

16 A. No. I don' t .17 Q. You don' t know i f t he pr oba t i on depar t ment

18 di d anyt hi ng i n t hat r egar d ei t her ?

19 A. No, I do not .

20 Q. I n f ac t , i n t he 1993 and 1994 t i me f r ame , was

21 t her e any t y pe of c ommuni t y not i f i c at i on r egar di ng c hi l d

22 mol es t er s ?

23 A. I don' t k now i f t her e was i n t hat t i me f r ame.

24 I don' t k now i f i t c ame out af t er t he f ac t s wi t h t he

25 Megan' s Law and al l t ha t .


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1 Q. But nonet hel es s , y ou di dn' t t ak e any s t eps

2 wi t h r egar ds t o c ommuni t y not i f i c at i on at t hat t i me; i s

3 t h a t c o r r e c t ?


5 MR. SCHNACK: Tha t ' s a l l I have , your Honor .

6


8 BY MR. McCABE:

9 Q. J us t a c oupl e ques t i ons , Of f i c er Davi l a.

10 You t oo k t hi s r e po r t s e ven mo nt hs a f t er t he11 i nc i dent ?

12 A. I r emember be i ng no t i f i ed sever a l mont hs

13 af t er t he i nc i dent .

14 Q. So t he i nc i dent t o ok pl a ce s o me t i me i n t he

15 s u mmer , i n J ul y ?

16 A. Yes , s i r .17 Q. And I bel i eve t he vi c t i m s ai d i t t ook pl ac e

18 r eal c l os e t o her bi r t hday on J ul y 16?

19 A. As I r ecal l , yes .

20 Q. And t he f ami l y had c ont i nue d t o l i v e t o ge t he r

21 dur i ng t he i nt er i m?

22 A. Yes , s i r .

23 Q. And do you know what happened t hough once you

24 r ef er r ed t he c as e t o t he Di s t r i c t At t or ney' s Of f i c e?

25 A. I k no w t he c as e wa s f i l e d, but as f ar a s wha t


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1 t he ul t i mat e out come was , I do not know.

2 Q. You wer e never c al l ed t o t es t i f y i n a t r i al

3 o r a ny t hi ng?

4 A. I don' t bel i eve s o.

5 Q. And j us t pr i or t o t he r e por t be i ng ma de t o

6 Chi l d Pr ot ec t i ve Ser vi c es a nd t hen t o your of f i c e, was

7 t he r e s ome k i nd of a l t e r c at i o n at t he Ke ndr i c k home?

8 A. I do r e ca l l be i ng adv i s e d t he r e was s o me t y pe

9 of al t er c at i on t hat had been r epor t ed t o t he pol i c e.

10 Q. T he n t hi s r e po r t was made s h or t l y t he r e af t er ?11 A. Cor r ec t .

12 MR. McCABE: I have no t hi ng f ur t he r .

13 Thank you.

14 THE COURT: May I have counsel up her e f or a

15 mi nut e.

16 ( Si debar di s c us s i on)17

18 REDI RECT EXAMI NATI ON

19 BY MR. SI MONS:

20 Q. Of f i c er , j us t t wo f ur t her t hi ngs .

21 Number 1, s i nce you wer e i nf or med by t he

22 v i c t i m t hat t he el der s of t he c hur c h wer e al r eady awar e

23 o f t he i nc i dent , woul d t her e ha ve been any pur po s e i n

24 your c ont ac t i ng t hem t o not i f y t hem of i t ?

25 A. At t hat poi nt , I di dn' t t hi nk i t woul d be


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1 necess ar y, based on what I had.

2 Q. And s e condl y, we t al k ed about c onf i dent i al i t y

3 of a mi nor v i c t i m.

4 But once t he cha r ges wer e f i l ed, t he r e was no

5 c onf i dent i al i t y as t o t he name of Mr . Kendr i c k , was

6 t her e?

7 A. I ' m not s ur e what t he r epor t i ng pr oc es s es or

8 t he r ec or ds wer e i n t hat t i me per i od. I don' t k now.

9 Q. Char ges ar e f i l ed i n c our t . Cor r ec t ?

10 A. Wel l , t hey wer e f i l ed wi t h t he DA' s of f i c e.11 Q. Yeah.

12 And t he c ompl a i nt i s f i l ed i n t he Al a me da

13 Count y Super i o r Cour t ?

14 A. Cor r ec t .

15 Q. And t ha t woul d be Peopl e ver sus J ona t han

16 Kendr i c k ?17 A. Cor r ec t .

18 MR. SI MONS: Thank you.

19 THE COURT: Anyt hi ng f ur t her ?

20 MR. SCHNACK: No, your Honor .

21 MR. McCABE: No, your Honor .

22 THE COURT: Al l r i ght . J us t f or a mi nut e t o

23 t he j ur y.

24 I ' m goi ng t o i nt r oduc e y ou t o t he c onc ept of

25 l i mi t i ng i ns t r uc t i ons .


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1 At t he s t ar t of t he c as e, we, c ouns el , and

2 c our t i ndi c at ed Mr . Kendr i c k i s a def endant i n t hi s

3 mat t er . And t he c onc ept of l i mi t i ng i ns t r uc t i on i s t hat

4 y ou ar e s i t t i ng her e cons i der i ng ev i denc e agai ns t eac h

5 and al l def endant s , i nc l udi ng Mr . Kendr i c k who i s not

6 her e bef or e us , phys i c al l y.

7 At t he c l os e , when I gi v e y ou t he s e

8 i ns t r uc t i ons , I wi l l gi ve you l i mi t i ng i ns t r uc t i ons as

9 t o c er t ai n evi denc e t hat i s bei ng of f er ed as t o a

10 s pec i f i c def endant .11 So t he ev i denc e you ar e al l l i s t eni ng t o i s

12 not nec es s a r i l y of f er ed agai ns t eac h and al l def endant s .

13 And when y ou del i ber at e, y our del i ber at i ons wi l l be

14 s ubj ec t t o t he l i mi t i ng i ns t r uc t i on I gi ve you as t o

15 whi ch de f endant s ce r t a i n evi dence has been o f f e r ed,

16 r el at i ve t o your c ons i der at i on.17 Does ever ybody under s t and t he concept t ha t a t

18 l eas t c er t ai n ev i denc e wi l l go per haps s o l el y t o one

19 def endant ? And I wi l l i ns t r uc t y ou ac c or di ngl y whi c h

20 evi denc e t hat i s f or t hos e del i ber at i ons as t o any

21 l i abi l i t y of ques t i ons .

22 Do we a l l under s t and each ot her on t hat

23 concept ?

24 J URORS: ( J ur or s i ndi c at e) .

25 THE COURT: Okay, t hank you.


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1 MR. SI MONS: May t hi s wi t ness be excused,

2 your Honor ?

3 THE COURT: Ever ybody agr ee?

4 MR. SCHNACK: Yes , your Honor .

5 MR. McCABE: Yes, your Honor .

6 THE COURT: Al l r i ght . Thank you f o r your

7 t i me .

8 MR. SI MONS: Next wi t ness i s Car o l yn

9 Mar t i nez .

1011 CAROLYN MARTI NEZ

12 WAS DULY SWORN TO TEL L THE TRUTH BY THE CLERK

13 AND TESTI FI ED AS FOLLOWS:

14 THE CLERK: Wi l l you pl ease s t a t e your name

15 and s pel l your f i r s t and l as t name f or t he r e c or d?

16 THE WI TNESS: Car o l yn Mar t i nez . My f i r s t17 name, C- A- R- O- L- Y- N. And t he l a s t name , Mar t i nez ,

18 M- A- R- T- I - N- E- Z.

19 THE CLERK: Thank you.

20

21 DI RECT EXAMI NATI ON

22 BY MR. SI MONS:

23 Q. Good mor ni ng, Ms. Mar t i nez .

24 Wher e do you l i ve a t pr esent ?

25 A. I n Car l s bad.


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1 Q. And t hat ' s down by San Di ego?

2 A. Yes . Nor t h o f San Di ego Count y.

3 Q. Was t he r e a t i me t ha t you l i ved up he r e i n

4 Al ameda Count y?

5 A. Yes .

6 Q. Wha t i s your occupa t i on?

7 A. I wor k i n account i ng i n a bi o t ech company.

8 Q. And when you l i ved up her e i n Al ameda Count y,

9 wer e you empl oyed out s i de t he home?

10 A. Yes .11 Q. What ki nd of wor k di d you do?

12 A. Ac c ount i ng as wel l .

13 Q. Wer e you ever a member of t he Nor t h Fr emont

14 J ehov ah' s Wi t nes s es ?

15 A. Yes .

16 Q. When di d you f i r s t become a member ?17 A. I bel i ev e I was bapt i z ed i n pr obabl y 1985.

18 Q. Was t ha t i nt o t he Nor t h Fr emont Congr egat i on?

19 A. I t was i n t he Cent r al Congr egat i on, but t hen

20 s hor t l y af t er , a year l at er , I bec ame a member of t he

21 Nor t h Congr ega t i on.

22 Q. And wer e you mar r i ed at t he t i me?

23 A. Yes .

24 Q. And t o whom wer e you mar r i ed?

25 A. Hi s name was Paul I nman.


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1 Q. Was he a l so i nvol ved i n t he Nor t h Fr emont

2 Congr ega t i on?

3 A. Yes .

4 Q. And what pos i t i on, i f any, di d he s er ve i n?

5 A. Wel l , e ve nt ual l y, he bec ame a n el de r i n t he

6 c ongr e ga t i on.

7 Q. You had c hi l dr en a s we l l ?

8 A. Yes .

9 Q. And wer e t he y al s o i nv ol v ed i n J e ho va h' s

10 Wi t nes s es a ct i vi t i es ?11 A. Yes .

12 Q. I n t he t i me pe r i od i n t he mi d- 1990s , 1993,

13 ' 04, ' 05, ' 06, i n t hat t i me per i od wer e you ver y ac t i ve

14 i n y our c ongr e ga t i on?

15 A. Yes .

16 Q. And des c r i be f or us , i f y ou woul d, t he l ev el17 of ac t i vi t y t hat you had i n c ongr egat i on ac t i vi t i es i n

18 t he mi d- 1990s.

19 A. Wel l , I was ver y ac t i ve, I was a member o f

20 t he Theoc r at i c Mi ni s t r y Sc hool , i n whi c h, y ou k now, y ou

21 par t i c i pat e by gi vi ng t al ks .

22 I was out i n f i el d s e r v i c e and, y ou k now, a

23 l ot of s oc i al ac t i vi t i es wi t h t he c ongr egat i on.

24 Q. And wer e s oc i al ac t i vi t i es wi t h t he

25 c ongr egat i on a par t of l i f e f or a J ehovah' s Wi t nes s es '


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1 f ami l y?

2 A. Yes .

3 Q. Di d you know J onat han Kendr i ck?

4 A. Yes .

5 Q. And how di d you meet hi m?

6 A. He was a member of our congr egat i on and

7 became a f r i end of my hus band' s .

8 Q. Can y ou des c r i be hi m f or us ?

9 A. Wel l , I woul d s ay - - I woul d s ay I was j us t

10 di sappo i nt ed t ha t my husband chose t o as s oc i a t e wi t h11 hi m, because he k i nd o f gr avi t a t ed t owar d peopl e t ha t

12 wer e a l i t t l e weak er and I t ended t o gr av i t at e t owar d

13 peo pl e who wer e s t r o nge r i n t he f ai t h.

14 Q. You ar e t al k i ng about f ai t h?

15 A. Yes , i n t he f ai t h.

16 Q. Do you r emember Mr . Kendr i ck havi ng a dog?17 A. Yes .

18 Q. What do you r emember about t he dog?

19 A. Sl obber i ng al l over .

20 THE COURT: You know, I have been t hi nki ng

21 about t hi s t hr oughout t he t r i al . And t her e was anot her

22 dog, r el at i v e t o t hat ot her dog, I was t hi nk i ng I needed

23 t o appoi nt a l awy er f or hi m. L et ' s s e e what happe ns

24 wi t h t hi s dog.

25


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1 BY MR. SI MONS:

2 Q. Di d you know Candace Cont i ?

3 A. Yes .

4 Q. And how ol d was Candace when you f i r s t met

5 her ?

6 A. I t hi nk s he was a baby. She was t he same age

7 as my ol des t daught er .

8 Q. And di d you know t he par ent s?

9 A. Yes .

10 Q. What do you r emember about Candace Cont i as a11 c hi l d?

12 A. Annoyi ng.

13 Q. Why?

14 A. J us t i n need of at t ent i on. She was j us t k i nd

15 of a l i t t l e br at t y. You k now, s he had s o me br i ght nes s

16 t o her , but mai nl y she was annoyi ng.17 Q. Now, i s i t t r ue t hat y our mar r i age t o

18 Mr . I nman came t o an end?

19 A. Yes .

20 Q. And di d you r emar r y?

21 A. Yes .

22 Q. Who di d you mar r y?

23 A. Candace ' s dad.

24 Q. Nea l Co nt i ?

25 A. Yes .


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1 Q. I n wha t yea r ?

2 A. 1998.

3 Q. And t hat mar r i age ended?

4 A. Yes .

5 Q. I n di vor c e?

6 A. Yes .

7 Q. Appr oxi mat el y when?

8 A. I t hi nk t he di vor c e was f i nal i n 2003, but we

9 separ a t ed i n 2002.

10 Q. Di d you have a good r e l a t i onsh i p wi t h Candace11 dur i ng t ho s e y ea r s ?

12 A. Not r eal l y, no. I t was ver y s t r ai ned. Ther e

13 was a l ot of di s t r ac t i ons - - a l ot of s t uf f goi ng on

14 wi t h ex- wi ves and - - you know, Neal ' s mom. And t her e

15 was a l ot of s t uf f goi ng on at t hat t i me, s o i t was v er y

16 s t r ai ned wi t h Candac e. I t was j us t a l ot of , y ou k now,17 di f f i c ul t i es t o deal wi t h.

18 Q. Af t er y our r el at i ons hi p wi t h Neal Cont i

19 ended, di d you cont i nue t o s t ay i n t ouch wi t h Candace?

20 A. Not at al l .

21 Q. Have you been i n t ouch wi t h he r a l l t hese

22 many year s ?

23 A. Not at al l .

24 Q. Back a t t he t i me t ha t Neal was mar r i ed t o

25 Kat hy Cont i , do you r emember havi ng an i mpr ess i on of


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1 Kat hy Co nt i ?

2 A. Yes .

3 Q. Wer e y ou ac qua i nt e d wi t h he r f r om t he Nor t h

4 Congr ega t i on?

5 A. Yes .

6 Q. What di d you see i n her ?

7 A. J us t - - I do n' t k now. May be l i k e s o me me nt a l

8 i l l nes s . That ' s j us t my i mpr es s i on.

9 Q. Now, wer e t her e t i mes t hat you saw J onat han

10 Kendr i ck t oge t he r wi t h Candace Cont i ?11 A. Oh, yes .

12 Q. And wher e do you r ecal l havi ng seen t hem

13 t oget her ?

14 A. Wel l , t hey wer e, at t i mes - - Neal Cont i , when

15 he was mar r i ed t o Ka t hy - - t hey wer e i n our book s t udy

16 whi ch was at our house . And J onat han was i n t ha t book17 s t udy as we l l . So I woul d see J ona t han a r ound Candace

18 t her e t oo.

19 Q. Di d y ou e ver s e e t he m t o get he r at t he Ki ngdo m

20 Hal l ?

21 A. Yes , al l t he t i me.

22 Q. Wha t do you r ecal l s ee i ng?

23 A. He j us t was ver y enamor ed wi t h her . He j us t

24 l oo ked a t he r i nappr opr i a t e l y. T ha t ' s wha t I r e me mber .

25 And, you know, I r emember t hem hol di ng hands . I


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1 r emember h i s ar m ar ound her . I r emember t hem bei ng out

2 i n s e r v i c e t oget he r . And t ha t ' s what I r e me mber .

3 Q. And when you s ay you r emember hi s ar m ar ound

4 her , was t ha t on mor e t han one occas i ons?

5 A. Yes .

6 Q. Was i t somet hi ng you saw f r equent l y?

7 A. Wel l , f r e que nt e no ugh t hat I r e me mber i t .

8 Q. Was t hat somet hi ng you s aw i n t he Ki ngdom

9 Hal l or ar ound t he Ki ngdom Hal l pr oper t y, at l eas t ?

10 A. Yes .11 MR. SI MONS: I s t her e an obj e ct i o n t o Ex hi bi t

12 30?

13 MR. McCABE: No.

14 MR. SI MONS: Your Honor , we ar e goi ng t o

15 of f er i nt o evi denc e, Exhi bi t 30.

16 THE COURT: Pl ai nt i f f ' s Exhi bi t 30?17 MR. SI MONS: P l ai nt i f f ' s Ex hi bi t 30 does not

18 have a cor r espondi ng number .

19 THE COURT: Any obj ec t i on f r om def ense

20 c ouns e l ?

21 MR. McCABE: No, your Honor .


23 THE COURT: Pl ai nt i f f ' s 30 i s i n.

24 ( Wher eupon, Pl ai nt i f f ' s Ex hi bi t Number 30

25 was admi t t ed i nt o evi dence )


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1 MR. SI MONS: I n f ac t , l e t me pe r haps gi ve a

2 c opy t o t he wi t nes s t o l ook at .

3 BY MR. SI MONS:

4 Q. Now, do y ou r e co gni z e t hi s as t he a er i a l

5 vi ew?

6 A. Yes .

7 Q. And i s t hi s t he Ki ngdom Hal l ?

8 A. Yes .

9 Q. What i s t hi s bi g ar ea her e?

10 A. That ' s t he par ki ng l ot .11 Q. And how a bout t hat k i nd of t r i a ngl e , br own

12 t r i angl e up t her e?

13 Do you r emember t hat ?

14 A. That ' s j us t an open ar ea.

15 Q. Was i t ac c es s i bl e?

16 A. I t hi nk i t was , but I hav e nev er been ov er17 t her e.

18 Q. Do you r ec al l i t bei ng us ed f or over f l ow

19 par ki ng somet i mes?

20 A. Up t her e, t hat t r i angl e?

21 Q. Yeah, t he di r t par t . Yeah.

22 A. Pos s i bl y.

23 Q. Do y ou r e cal l f r om t i me t o t i me may be k i ds

24 r unni ng ar ound t he par k i ng l ot , ei t her bef or e or af t er

25 s er vi c es ?


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1 A. You know, I don' t r eal l y r ec al l t hat , but i t

2 i s pos s i bl e bec aus e k i ds do t hi ngs .

3 Q. Do you r emember t hat t her e woul d be ki ds at

4 t he Ki ngdom Hal l on s er v i c e day s ?

5 A. Yes .

6 Q. And bef or e a nd a f t er , wo ul d t he r e be

7 s oc i al i z i ng i n and ar ound t he bui l di ng?

8 A. Of c our s e , y es .

9 Q. And y ou ment i o ne d f i el d s e r v i c e.

10 A. Yes .11 Q. Des c r i be f or us what f i el d s er vi c e i s .

12 A. T ha t ' s when we go of f i n pa i r s . They go of f

13 i n pa i r s , and t hey go and knock on peopl e ' s door s and

14 t hey t r y t o t eac h peopl e t he Bi bl e. So t hat ' s f i el d

15 s er vi c e.

16 Q. Does f i el d s er vi c e s t ar t wi t h a meet i ng17 s omewher e?

18 A. Yes .

19 Q. Wher e, bac k i n t he mi d- 1990s , di d f i el d

20 s er vi c e f or t he Nor t h Congr egat i on us ual l y s t ar t ?

21 A. I t de pe nded on t he day. I t c oul d be at

22 s o meone' s ho us e or i t c oul d be at t he Ki ngdo m Ha l l .

23 Q. And how woul d peopl e know wher e t o go f or

24 f i el d s er v i c e?

25 A. Because you wer e ass i gned by t he congr egat i on


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1 wher e t o go.

2 Q. Woul d t her e be an el der or s omeone who woul d

3 have made t hat ass i gnment ?

4 A. Uh- huh.

5 Q. I s t hat a yes ?

6 A. Yes .

7 Q. I ' m s or r y.

8 A. Sor r y.

9 Q. T ha t ' s ok ay.

10 And you s aw J onat han Kendr i ck and Candace11 Cont i t oget her i n f i el d s er vi c e?

12 A. Yes .

13 Q. And mor e t han once?

14 A. Yes .

15 Q. And t hat was dur i ng t he t i me t hat Candace was

16 s t i l l l i vi ng wi t h her par ent s ? They wer e mar r i ed17 t oget her ?

18 A. Yes .

19 Q. When di d you l ear n t ha t t her e was an

20 al l egat i on t hat J onat han Kendr i c k had s e xual l y mol es t ed

21 Candace dur i ng t he t i me t ha t t hey wer e i n t he Nor t h

22 Fr emont Congr egat i on?

23 A. When you cont ac t ed me.

24 Q. And how l ong ago was t hat ?

25 A. About t en mont hs ago.


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1 Q. Bef o r e t ha t , you had no i dea?

2 A. No i dea.

3 Q. Di d you know t hat J onat han Kendr i ck had

4 mol es t ed any chi l d bef or e you and I spoke a f ew mont hs

5 ago?

6 A. No. No knowl edge.

7 Q. And dur i ng t he t i me t hat you wer e a member of

8 t he Nor t h Fr emont Congr egat i on, wer e you awar e of any

9 al l egat i on of c hi l d s ex abus e agai ns t J onat han Kendr i c k ?

10 A. No.11 MR. SI MONS: Thank you, your Honor .

12


14 BY MR. McCABE:

15 Q. Good mor ni ng, Mr s . Mar t i nez .

16 You ment i oned i n your t es t i mony t hat you saw17 J onat han Kendr i c k hol di ng hands wi t h Candace Cont i .

18 Di d you eve r speak t o an e l de r about t ha t ?

19 A. No.

20 Q. You a l so ment i oned t ha t you saw hi m wi t h hi s

21 a r m ar ound her .

22 Di d you eve r speak wi t h an e l de r about t ha t ?

23 A. No.

24 Q. Di d you ever s ee Candace Cont i come t o

25 Ki ngdom Hal l wi t hout one or bot h of her par ent s ?


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1 A. No.

2 Q. Di d you eve r see Candace Cont i come t o f i e l d

3 s e r v i c e wi t hout one or bo t h o f he r p ar ent s ?

4 A. No.

5 Q. You ment i oned about t he gr ound ar ea of t he

6 exhi bi t s you wer e j us t shown.

7 Have you ever seen car s par ked t her e at

8 Ki ngdo m Ha l l mee t i ngs ?

9 A. I bel i eve s o. I t hi nk t her e wer e t i mes t hat

10 we had a memor i al and t her e woul d be a need f or over f l ow11 par k i ng.

12 Q. So t he me mor i a l , wha t ' s t ha t ?

13 A. That ' s a c el ebr at i on of J es us ' deat h onc e a

14 year .

15 Q. Okay. So once a year you s aw car s par ked

16 t her e?17 A. Yeah.

18 Q. And woul d t hat be f or a dayt i me meet i ng?

19 Ni ght t i me meet i ng?

20 A. Ki nd of r i ght bef or e i t t ur ns t o t he ev eni ng.

21 Q. Okay. When di d your f ami l y hos t a

22 congr egat i on book s t udy t ha t you t a l ked about ? What

23 y ea r s ?

24 A. Oh, boy.

25 Somewher e ar ound 1990 t o maybe ' 92.


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1 Q. Okay. And dur i ng t ha t ent i r e t i me pe r i od was

2 t he Cont i f ami l y at t endi ng t hat book s t udy ?

3 A. I bel i eve s o.

4 Q. And wha t about Mr . Kendr i ck , dur i ng t ha t

5 ent i r e t i me was he at t endi ng t he book s t udy?

6 A. Yes .

7 Q. But af t er ' 92 t hat s t opped?

8 A. Yes .

9 Q. And you s t opped havi ng t he Bi bl e St udy i n

10 your home?11 A. Uh- huh.

12 Q. How ol d i s y our ol des t c hi l d?

13 A. She i s 26.

14 Q. About t he same age as Candace , I t h i nk you

15 s ai d?

16 A. Yes .17 Q. When you mar r i ed Neal Cont i , di d your

18 daught er s get a l ong wi t h Candace Cont i ?

19 A. I t hi nk my ol des t daught er di d, but , y ou

20 know, t hey k i nd of p i cked on my youngest daught er , so

21 t hat was a pr obl em.

22 Q. They woul d gang up t oget her ?

23 A. Yes .

24 Q. How about you; di d you get al ong wi t h Candace

25 dur i ng your mar r i age t o Neal ?


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1 A. Wel l , i t was a l i t t l e bi t of a chal l enge

2 because at t ha t t i me I woul d want - -

3 You want a s t r a i ght answer ? No.

4 MR. McCABE: Tha t ' s a l l I have , your Honor .

5 MR. SCHNACK: Not hi ng, your Honor .

6 THE COURT: Anyt hi ng f ur t her ?

7 MR. SI MONS: Yes . J us t one f ur t her . I

8 negl ec t ed t o ment i on t hi s . I apol ogi z e.

9

10 REDI RECT EXAMI NATI ON11 BY MR. SI MONS:

12 Q. Di d you eve r see Candace Cont i s i t on

13 J onat han Kendr i c k' s l ap?

14 A. Yes .

15 Q. Mor e t han once?

16 A. I t hi nk s o, yes . Uh- huh.17 MR. SI MONS: Thank you.

18


20 BY MR. McCABE:

21 Q. Wher e?

22 A. Thi s woul d be a t our book s t udy.

23 Q. I n your home?

24 A. Yes .

25 Q. I n 1991 and ' 92?


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1 A. Yes , t o ' 92.

2 MR. McCABE: Thank you. Not hi ng f ur t her .

3


5 BY MR. SCHNACK:

6 Q. And Candace Cont i ' s par ent s wer e pr esent a t

7 t ha t book s t udy?

8 A. Her dad. Her mom was r a r e l y t he r e .

9 Q. But her dad was t her e?

10 A. Yes .11 Q. And your hus band was an el der at t he t i me?

12 A. Yes .

13 Q. And di d you t hi nk t ha t was s t r ange t ha t she

14 s a t on hi s l ap at t hat book s t udy ?

15 A. Wel l - - ok ay. I t was not ed. I n my mi nd, I

16 not ed i t . So I woul d s ay, yes , I t hought i t was17 s t r ange.

18 Q. And i t wa s i n t he pr es e nc e of Nea l Co nt i ?

19 A. Yes .

20 MR. SCHNACK: Not hi ng f ur t her .

21 MR. SI MONS: May t hi s wi t ness be excused?

22 THE COURT: Ms . Mar t i nez, t hank you ver y much

23 f or your appear ance . You ar e now excused.

24 MR. SI MONS: Dr . Anna Sal t er .

25


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1 ANNA SALTER, Ph. D.

2 WAS DULY SWORN TO TEL L THE TRUTH BY THE CLERK

3 AND TESTI FI ED AS FOLLOWS:

4

5 THE CLERK: Pl ease s t at e your name and spel l

6 i t .

7 THE WI TNESS: Anna Car ol Sal t er .

8 Anna, A- N- N- A. Sal t er , S- A- L - T- E- R.

9

10 VOI R DI RE EXAMI NATI ON11 BY MR. SI MONS:

12 Q. Dr . Sal t er , wher e do y ou l i v e?

13 A. I l i v e i n Madi s on, Wi s c ons i n.

14 Q. And wha t i s your cur r ent occupa t i on?

15 A. Wel l , I do s ever al t hi ngs .

16 I c ons ul t t o t he Depar t ment of Cor r ec t i ons17 hal f t i me. I al s o t r ai n l ot s of di f f er ent gr oups t hat

18 deal wi t h c hi l d s e xual abus e .

19 I hav e t r ai ned i n 50 s t at es and t en c ount r i es

20 o n c hi l d s e xua l abus e .

21 I al s o do c i v i l c ommi t ment ev al uat i ons f or

22 t he St at e of I owa. That i nv ol v es ev al uat i ng s e x

23 of f ender s t o det er mi ne how danger ous t hey ar e .

24 And I al s o, on oc cas i on, t es t i f y i n c our t

25 cases as an exper t wi t ness .


48/169


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1 about .

2 T he n of f e nde r s s t a r t ed c omi ng i n. And I k ne w

3 f or s ur e t hat I di dn' t have t he t r ai ni ng and exper i enc e

4 t o wor k wi t h o f f ende r s .

5 The v i c t i ms , you coul d use some o f t he

6 t echni ques we used wi t h non- v i c t i ms .

7 But of f ender s , I k new r equi r ed a di f f er ent

8 t y pe o f t r ea t ment .

9 So I obt ai ned a gr ant f r om t he St at e of

10 Ver mont , and I went a r ound t he count r y i n t he ear l y ' 80s11 l ook i ng f or pr ogr ams t hat t r eat ed s e x of f ender s , and I

12 f ound s ever al . One i n par t i c ul ar i n Seat t l e, Was hi ngt on

13 t hat had been t r eat i ng t hem r eal l y wi t h s t at e of t he ar t

14 t echni ques f or a number of year s i n Nor t hwest Tr eat ment

15 As s oc i at es .

16 And I s t a r t e d wr i t i ng my r e po r t f or Ver mo nt ,17 and I j us t k ept wr i t i ng, and t hat ended up my f i r s t

18 book , whi ch I br ought t oday, whi ch was publ i shed i n 1988

19 on t r eat i ng c hi l d s ex of f ender s a nd vi c t i ms .

20 I k i nd of got dr awn i nt o i t .

21 Dur i ng t hi s per i od of t i me, I was i nv i t ed by

22 Har v ar d Me di c al Sc ho ol t o s e r v e a s t he c ons u l t ant f o r

23 t hei r c hi l d abus e pr ogr am. Thi s was ac t ual l y a c hi l d

24 s exual abuse pr ogr am.

25 And t hi s was ac t ual l y bef or e I had done much


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1 wor k on t he book . And my i ni t i al r eac t i on was , I don' t

2 want t o de al wi t h c hi l dho od s e xua l abus e . I t ups e t s me .

3 They s ai d, y ou wi l l be deal i ng wi t h

4 c l i ni c i ans who deal wi t h i t . You wi l l be s uppor t i ng

5 t hem. You won' t be deal i ng wi t h i t di r ec t l y.

6 And t hat ' s how I got i nvol ved i ni t i al l y.

7 Ended up i n a f acul t y depar t ment , gr owi ng t wo

8 depar t ment s , wor k i ng i n a number o f a r eas , one was t he i r

9 chi l d abuse pr ogr am.

10 Q. As pa r t o f t he boo k t hat wa s publ i s h ed i n11 1988, di d y ou do a r es e ar c h pr oj ec t i nt o t he hi s t or y of

12 i nf or mat i o n and knowl edge av ai l abl e on t he s ubj e ct o f

13 chi l dhood sexua l abuse and i t s causes and pr event i on?

14 A. Yes . The f i r s t par t of t he book was a r evi ew

15 o f t he hi s t o r y of c hi l dho od s e xua l abus e and how i t had

16 been t r eat ed.17 Q. And your book was publ i s hed i n 1988.

18 When di d you compl et e t he r esear ch t hat was

19 nec es s a r y t o get i t out and publ i s hed i n ' 88?

20 A. I t hi nk t her e was al mos t a t wo- y ear wai t f or

21 publ i c at i on. So i t pr obabl y went out i n mi d- 1986, s o I

22 had t o have al l r e sear ch done by t ha t t i me .

23 Q. Have you cont i nued t o do r e sear ch and wr i t i ng

24 i n t he f i el d of c hi l d s exual abus e and i t s pr event i on

25 a nd unde r s t a ndi ng i t s c a us e s ?


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1 A. Wel l , i t ' s been my f i el d ever s i nc e. I have

2 publ i s h ed t wo addi t i ona l bo ok s , a nd I ' m wo r k i ng on my

3 f our t h book on chi l d sexua l abuse now.

4 Q. You ment i oned t r a i ni ng.

5 Wha t k i nd o f t r a i ni ng do you conduc t ?

6 A. Wel l , I c onduc t t r ai ni ng i n j us t about ever y

7 as pec t o f c hi l d s e xual abus e . I t r ai n on i mpac t o n

8 vi c t i ms . I t r ai n on char ac t er i s t i c s of of f ender s . I

9 t r ai n on way s we c an pr ot ec t o ur s e l v es . I t r ai n on

10 as s e s s ment and t r eat ment of of f ender s . I t r ai n on11 dec ept i on and how s ex of f ender s i nf i l t r at e or gani z at i ons

12 and - - f ul l or gani z at i ons and f ul l f ami l i es .

13 And I t r ai n on t he dec ept i on of det ec t i on.

14 And I have even made vi deot apes t ha t or gani za t i ons

15 us e - - I gues s t hey ' r e cal l ed DVDs now - - t hat

16 o r gani z a t i ons us e t o unde r s t a nd s e x of f e nder s be t t er and17 what t hey ar e up agai ns t . And t hose DVDs ar e compr i sed

18 o f i nt er v i ews wi t h s e x of f e nder s on ho w t hey f oo l e d

19 peo pl e , ho w t hey ope r at ed f or a s l o ng as t he y di d

20 wi t hout be i ng de t e ct ed. Ma ny o f t hem do o pe r a t e f or a

21 v er y l ong per i od of t i me wi t hout det ec t i on.

22 Q. Who a r e t he pe opl e t ha t r ec ei v e t he t r a i ni ngs

23 t ha t you conduc t ?

24 A. I t r ai ned - - l as t week, I was i n I daho

25 t r ai ni ng pol i c e and pr os ec ut or s . I have t r ai ned f or


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1 or gani z at i ons many t i mes . I hav e t r ai ned c hi l d

2 pr o t ec t i on wor k er s , t ea cher s , membe r s of o r gani z a t i o ns

3 t hat hav e ac t i vi t i es i nvol v ed wi t h ment al heal t h,

4 j udges . My t r ai ni ngs ar e al l f or pr of es s i onal s . I have

5 t r ai ned pr obat i on and par ol e. I have t r ai ned

6 c or r ec t i ons .

7 Most of my t r a i n i ngs ar e f or anyone who wor ks

8 i n t he f i el d of c hi l dhood s e xual abus e or has a need t o

9 under s t and about of f ender s i n or der t o pr ot ec t c hi l dr en.

10 Q. And wher e have your t r a i ni ngs been conduct ed11 o ve r t he yea r s ?

12 A. Wel l , j us t about ev er y wher e. I hav e been i n

13 al l 50 s t at es . Mos t of t hem s ever al t i mes .

14 Last week was I daho. Thur s day was Nebr aska.

15 The week bef or e t ha t was Sal t Lak e. I ' m on t he r oad a

16 f ai r a mount now. I hav e al s o t r ai ned i n Cos t a Ri c a, i n17 s i x c i t i es i n Aus t r al i a and s i x c i t i es i n New Zeal and

18 and Engl and and Fr ance and t he Net her l ands and Sweden,

19 i n Scot l and, and Canada many t i mes , and so f or t h .

20 Q. Ar e your books publ i shed i n l anguages o t he r

21 t han Engl i s h?

22 A. Yes , t hey ar e.

23 Q. And wi t hout t oot i ng your own hor n

24 nec es s a r i l y, c an y ou gi v e us a de s c r i pt i on o f s o me o f

25 t he ot he r l anguages t ha t your books have been publ i shed


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1 i n?

2 A. Yes , s i r .

3 I ' m not s ur e al l t he c ount r i es i t has been

4 publ i s h ed i n bec aus e I c an' t r e ad t he bo ok s .

5 I bel i e ve i t was publ i s h ed i n J apan, a numbe r

6 o f ot her c ount r i es t hat s p eak ot her l a ngua ge s ha ve

7 publ i shed t he books .

8 Q. Hav e y ou c ons ul t ed wi t h di f f er i ng

9 or gani z at i ons i nvol vi ng t he s ubj ec t of pr ot ec t i on of

10 y out h f r om c hi l d s e x abus e ?11 A. Yes . Ov er t he y ea r s I hav e c ons u l t ed wi t h a

12 number o f t hem. I hav e c ons u l t ed wi t h r es i dent i al

13 pr ogr ams f r equent l y f o r abused and non- abused k i ds . I

14 hav e done t r ai ni ng f or c hur c h or gani z at i ons . I di d a

15 vi deot ape f or an i nsur ance company t hat want ed t o

16 dev el o p a pr ot ec t i on pr ogr a m be ca us e t he y we r e i ns u r i ng17 chur ches .

18 L as t week I got a c al l f r om t he Madi s on

19 Sc hool Sy s t e m about c ons u l t i ng wi t h t hem.

20 I r egul ar l y c ons ul t bec aus e a l ar ge par t of

21 what I do has t o do wi t h pr ot ec t i ng c hi l dr en f r om c hi l d

22 sexual abuse .

23 Q. Wer e y ou c onduc t i ng t hes e v ar i o us t r a i ni ng

24 s e s s i o ns a nd c ons u l t at i ons i n t he mi d- 1990s ?

25 A. Yes , I was .


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1 Af t er my f i r s t boo k c ame out , I was doi ng

2 qui t e a l ot of t r ai ni ng and c ons ul t at i on.

3 Q. And have you become f ami l i ar wi t h t he

4 di f f er ent s t andar ds and pol i c i es of i ns t i t ut i ons and

5 or gani z at i ons , i nc l udi ng r el i gi ous or gani z at i ons , i n

6 whi c h t her e ar e ac t i v i t i es t hat ar e s pons o r e d or

7 pr o mot ed t ha t i nv ol v e c hi l dr e n and adul t s t o ge t her ?

8 A. Yes . The book I ' m f ami l i ar wi t h - - f i r s t of

9 al l , wi t h t he gener al publ i c , k new at t hat per i od of

10 t i me, and s e c ondl y, wha t or ga ni z a t i ons wer e do i ng i n11 r es p ons e t o t hat k no wl e dge, i n t wo di f f e r e nt dec ades .

12 MR. SI MONS: Your Honor , I woul d of f er

13 Dr . Sa l t er a s an e xper t i n c hi l dhoo d s e xua l abus e and

14 i t s c aus e s and pr e ve nt i on.

15 THE COURT: Gent l eman, want t o voi r d i r e

16 Dr . Sal t er ?17 MR. McCABE: No, your Honor .


19 THE COURT: Okay .

20 I f i nd Dr . Sal t er qual i f i ed t o gi ve exper t

21 opi ni ons f or t he r eas ons r eques t ed.

22

23 DI RECT EXAMI NATI ON

24 BY MR. SI MONS:

25 Q. Dr . Sal t e r , i n y our r e s ear c h and y our o wn


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1 exper i enc e, was t her e s i gni f i c ant i nf or mat i on av ai l abl e

2 by 1993 t o or gani z at i ons , i nc l udi ng r el i gi ous

3 or gani z at i ons , who wer e i nv ol ved i n ac t i vi t i es of yout h

4 a nd adul t s t oget he r o n t he s u bj ec t of pr ev ent i on o f

5 chi l dhood sexua l abuse?

6 A. Cer t ai nl y.

7 I n t he ' 90s , t her e was - - t her e was - - t her e

8 was mat er i al avai l abl e t o pr of es s i onal s l ong bef or e

9 t hat , but i t di dn' t hi t t he pr es s and i t di dn' t

10 r eal l y - - or gani z at i ons di dn' t have s uf f i c i ent awar enes s11 of i t unt i l , I t hi nk , t he mi d- ' 80s , and t hat was when

12 t he Cat hol i c Chur c h s c andal s f i r s t br ok e.

13 And t hose chur ch scanda l s l a r ge l y had t o do

14 wi t h t he f ac t t hat t he abus e wa s c ov er ed up, t he out r age

15 of i t seemed t o be as much about t he f ac t t hat

16 hi gher - ups knew about i t and di d not hi ng and moved17 pr i es t s f r om one pl ac e t o anot her as i t was a bout t he

18 ac t ual abus e i t s el f .

19 The f i r s t one was - - l oc at ed, i n 1984, i n

20 L af ayet t e, L oui s i ana. And t hat was t he f i r s t t i me t hat

21 evi dence t hat a bi s hop who had done t he abuse had become

22 publ i c . Tur ns out t hat he r epor t ed t he abus e t o t he

23 bi s h op s ev er al t i mes s i nc e 1997.

24 I n 1992, t he P or t e r c as e s br o ke i n Bo s t on.

25 And Por t e r had numer ous pr i e s t s , and bi shops and


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1 di oces es had known about hi m, and had not war ned t he

2 congr ega t i ons i n whi ch he was a pr i e s t . And he admi t t ed

3 abusi ng mor e t han 200 chi l dr en.

4 Now, t hi s hi t t he pr es s s o bi g t hat I

5 act ual l y f ound i n my r ecor ds a San J ose Mer cur y News

6 f r om 1987 t hat was e nt i r el y dev ot ed t o t he c hur c h' s

7 s e c r et c hi l d abus e di l e mma and ha d ar t i c l e s o n:

8 " Chur c h hus h es up c hi l d mol es t e r c as e s . "

9 " Hi di ng mol e s t er s ens u r e s mor e v i c t i ms . "

10 T hi s wa s a nat i o nwi de ex pos e . And I t hi nk11 t hat was r eal l y war ni ng i n t he ' 80s , or gani z at i ons got

12 war ni ngs t hat c hi l d mol es t er s c oul d and woul d i nf i l t r at e

13 or gani z at i ons t hat had ac t i vi t i es t hat i nvol ved yout h.

14 They had c l ear war ni ng on t hat . I n f ac t , t he

15 Bapt i s t s , I bel i ev e when t hey pas s e d t hei r 1997 pol i c y,

16 sa i d t ha t we had had no t i ce s i nce 1984 o f t hi s p r obl em.17 So, y es , by t he mi d- ' 90s , t hi s pr obl em was

18 f r ont and c ent er on t he nat i onal s t age. And t he pr obl em

19 t hat was par t i c ul ar l y - - peopl e wer e par t i c ul ar l y

20 concer ned about was c over i ng up abuse and not war ni ng

21 congr egat i ons about abuse .

22 Q. Had t he ma j o r yout h gr oups and r e l i gi ous

23 or gani z at i ons t hat i nvol ved ac t i vi t i es t hat had yout h

24 and adul t s t oget her adopt ed pol i c i es o f t r ans par enc y

25 r egar di ng known sexual abuser s by 1993?


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1 A. Yes , t hey ha ve . T he r e wer e a l ot o f

2 or gani z at i ons t hat had t al k ed about t he pr obl em i n

3 gener a l . F or e x ampl e, t he Amer i c an Ca nc er As s o c i a t i on

4 i n 1982 t al k ed about adopt i ng a pol i c y about c hi l d

5 sexual abuse and sc r eeni ng.

6 But t he i s s ue her e i s n' t s c r eeni ng. The

7 i s s ue i s s p eak i ng out about abus e or k eepi ng i t s e cr et .

8 And t he 1992 Uni t ed St a t e s Conf e r ence of Ca t ho l i c

9 Bi s hops publ i s hed f i ve pr i nc i pl es i nvol vi ng r ec ei vi ng

10 ac c us a t i ons o f c hi l d s e xual abus e .11 And t he f i r s t i s t o r es pond pr ompt l y, r el i eve

12 t he al l eged of f ender pr ompt l y of hi s mi ni s t er i al dut i es .

13 Ther e ar e ot her s . And t he l as t was one was wi t hi n t he

14 c onf i nes of pr i vac y f or t he i ndi vi dual i nvol ved, deal as

15 openl y as poss i b l e wi t h t he member s of t he communi t y.

16 I t hi nk t hat t he Cat hol i c Chur c h, at l eas t17 t hey knew t ha t cover i ng t hi s up was no t go i ng t o he l p

18 t hem.

19 I n 1992, t he Uni t ed Met hodi s t Chur ch put out

20 a pol i c y. And t hey s ai d t he c hur c h i s an ent i r el y

21 appr opr i at e pl ac e f or t hes e i s s ues t o be addr es s e d. And

22 t he f at her s a i d bef or e t hat i n 1988 t hat t he Uni t ed

23 Met hodi s t Chur c h s hal l uphol d t he r i ght s o f c hi l dr en t o

24 speak out when abuses occur and advoca t e f o r v i c t i ms i n

25 s t r i c t enf or c ement of t hes e r i ght s .


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1 The Uni t ar i an Uni ver s al i s t As s oc i at i on, as

2 ear l y as 1977, put out a pol i c y t hat s ai d t hat t he

3 gener a l as s e mbl y ur ges a l l pe r s o ns t o s u ppor t t he

4 Nat i onal Cent e r f o r Chi l d Abus e and Ne gl ec t , a nd t he y

5 s h oul d r epor t i nc i de nc es o f c hi l d a bus e and ne gl ec t and

6 t ha t t hey shoul d pr omot e and suppor t i nt e r - agency

7 c oor di nat i on of s er vi c es by c our t s , pol i c e, l egal

8 c ouns el , s oc i al r ehabi l i t at i on agenc i es , medi c al

9 s cr eeni ng f ac i l i t i es , f os t er f ami l y s er vi c es and ot her

10 agenc i es . I n ot her wor ds , t hat t hey s houl d not k eep11 t hi s s ec r e t , but t hat t hey s houl d r epor t t hi s .

12 So t her e wer e a number of pr ogr ams t hat

13 over t l y sa i d t ha t t hese cases need no t be cover ed up.

14 They need t o be r epor t ed and t hey need t o s peak out .

15 I n f ac t , I bel i ev e t hat t he Wat c ht ower had a

16 l e t t e r t ha t was sent out a mont h be f o r e t hey wer e ac r oss17 t he 1993 c as e. I n f ac t , i n t hat l et t er , t hey t al ked

18 about t he need not t o hush t hese cases up, but t he need

19 t o deal wi t h t hem openl y.

20 Q. Now, have you r evi ewed i nf o r mat i on t ha t i s

21 s pec i f i c t o J onat han Kendr i c k , Candac e Cont i and t he

22 Nor t h Congr ega t i on o f F r emont J ehovah' s Wi t nesses?

23 A. Yes .

24 Q. And can you gi ve us a gener a l over vi ew of t he

25 i nf or mat i o n, t ha t y ou hav e r e vi ewed?


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1 MR. SCHNACK: Your Honor , can we have a s i de

2 bar pl ea s e.

3 ( Si debar di s c us s i on)

4 BY MR. SI MONS:

5 Q. Dr . Sal t e r , c an y ou gi v e us a n ov er v i ew o f

6 t he i nf or mat i on t hat y ou r e vi ewed i n c onnec t i on wi t h

7 t hi s s pec i f i c cas e?

8 A. I r ev i e we d t he s c h oo l r e cor ds o f Ca ndac e

9 Cont i . I r evi ewed t he Nat i onal Hol i s t i c I ns t i t ut e

10 r ec or ds , t ax r ec or ds , Super i or Cour t of Cal i f or ni a, t he11 Pet i t i on t o Revok e Pr obat i on, c r i mi nal r ec or ds ,

12 depos i t i on of Kat hl een Cont i , Cl audi a Fr anc i s , Neal

13 Cont i , J onat han Kendr i c k' s c r i mi nal r ec or ds , depos i t i on

14 of Lawr ence Lamer den - -

15 MR. SCHNACK: Your Honor , can we have anot her

16 s i debar , pl eas e.17 ( Si debar di s c us s i on)

18 THE COURT: To t he j ur y, we wi l l t ake a

19 20- mi nut e br eak.

20 ( Wher eupon, t he f o l l owi ng pr oceedi ngs

21 wer e he ar d out s i de t he pr e s enc e o f j ur o r s )

22 MR. SCHNACK: I t bot her s me I have t o j ump up

23 a nd do wn. I t l o ok s l i k e we a r e hi di ng s o met hi ng. And

24 Mr . Si mons knows bet t e r t han t hi s .

25 We br ought up i s s ues of c r edi bi l i t y t hat


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1 happened t wi ce wi t h Lewi s . Thi s i s happeni ng he r e . And

2 i t bot her s me t hat t hi s i s i nt ent i onal .

3 T HE COURT: I ' m no t go i ng t o agr e e wi t h t hat ,

4 but I want ed y ou t o t al k t o mak e s ur e t hi s i s wi t hi n

5 bounds . And I wi l l al s o t al k t o t he j ur y.

6 ( Wher eupon, t he f o l l owi ng pr oceedi ngs

7 wer e he ar d i n t he pr es e nc e of j ur or s )

8 THE COURT: Back t o t he j ur y f or a mi nut e .

9 I won' t do t hat t oo of t en. I t i s j us t t he

10 c our t admi ni s t er i ng t he pr o ce s s o f t he c as e t o mak e s ur e11 i t goes ac c or di ng t o t hat r ul e empl oy ed, t he Ol d Engl i s h

12 r ul e.

13 And agai n, i n t er ms of al l of t hat , i t i s my

14 dec i s i on when and under wha t c i r cums t ances - - you ar e t o

15 mak e no i nf er enc e what s oever . I t ' s j us t t hi s j udge

16 a dmi ni s t er i ng t o wha t I s e e a s t he nee ds o f t he c as e at17 t hat t i me.

18 So ho pe f ul l y we do n' t do t hat t oo o f t en.

19 Back t o you, Mr . Si mons .

20 BY MR. SI MONS:

21 Q. Dr . Sal t e r , no w, we we r e t a l k i ng about

22 mat er i al s r e vi ewed.

23 You r ev i e wed s e ver al depos i t i ons i n t he c as e .

24 Cor r ec t ?

25 A. Yes , I di d.


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1 Q. And you r evi ewed t he medi cal r ecor ds of Ms.

2 Cont i ?

3 A. Yes .

4 Q. And you r evi ewed t he depos i t i on o f Laur a

5 F r a s e r ?

6 A. Yes .

7 Q. And y ou r ev i ewed, I bel i ev e - - y ou s a i d t he

8 F r e mont Pol i c e r epor t f r om Of f i c er Davi l a?

9 A. Yes .

10 Q. And you r evi ewed s ome of t he cor r espondence11 t hat was i nv ol v ed as ex hi bi t s t o t hes e depos i t i ons .

12 Cor r ec t ?

13 A. Yes .

14 Q. Now, based upon your t r a i ni ng and exper i ence

15 and mat er i al s t hat y ou r ev i ewed i n t hi s c a s e, di d y ou

16 f or m an opi ni on as t o whet her or not t he J ehov ah' s17 Wi t nes s e s me t t he appl i c abl e s t anda r ds o f c ar e f or

18 or gani z at i ons who s pons o r or pr omot e ac t i v i t i es t hat

19 i nv ol v e adul t s and c hi l dr en t oget her i n t hei r handl i ng

20 o f t he J onat ha n Ke ndr i c k r e po r t o f abus e i n 1993?

21 A. Yes .

22 Q. And i n y our opi ni o n, di d t hey mee t t hat

23 s t andar d?

24 A. They di d no t meet t ha t s t andar d.

25 Q. And woul d y ou t el l us , pl eas e , t he bas i s f or


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1 y our opi ni on?

2 A. By t he mi d- ' 80s , i t wa s wel l k nown t hat y ou

3 c annot e i t he r mo ve s ex of f e nder s f r om one co ngr e ga t i on

4 t o ano t her , or l ea ve t hem i n a c ongr egat i o n unawar e,

5 wher e t hei r peopl e ar e unawar e .

6 I t was wel l k nown t hat - - wel l , i n my t er ms ,

7 s ec r ec y i s t he l i f e bl ood of s exual aggr es s i on. And i t

8 was we l l k no wn t ha t t hi s po l i c y was a c ompl e t e f ai l ur e

9 and t ha t you needed t o r epor t t hese cases .

10 St andar d of c ar e was - - by t he ' 90s . I n t he11 ' 90s i t was t oo l at e f or an or gani z at i on t o s ay we

12 r eal l y di dn' t know wha t happened i f we t ur ned t hem

13 l oos e.

14 But i n t he ' 90s , t he s t andar d of c ar e

15 i nv ol v ed r epor t i ng t hes e cas es a nd i t i nvol v ed not - -

16 no t maki ng peopl e awar e of - - i f t hey had a sex of f ender17 i n t hei r mi ds t .

18 Q. Now, have you pr epar ed some s l i des t hat go

19 t hr ough t he bas i s of t hi s opi ni on and t he i nf or mat i on

20 t ha t was k no wn t o or gani z a t i o ns a t t ha t t i me ?

21 A. Wel l , t he s l i des t hat I pr epar ed ar e mai nl y

22 on r el at ed t opi c s . One was - - t her e i s a s et of

23 s l i des - - when exper t s knew, when i t was known i n t he

24 f i el d. And t hi s i s - - and s ome ot her t hi ngs . Thi s i s

25 t he pr ev al enc e.


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1 When I di d t he 1988 book , I l ooked a t t he

2 r es e ar c h av ai l abl e at t hat t i me. And by t hat t i me,

3 t her e was a s i gni f i c ant amount of r es e ar c h t hat I c oul d

4 s ummar i z e.

5 So what you see her e ar e j us t some pr eval ence

6 s t udi es t ha t wer e done back i n ' 84. And wha t t hese

7 s t udi e s di d i s t he y t r i ed t o de t e r mi ne how many chi l dr e n

8 wer e bei ng sexual l y abused, mal e and f emal e .

9 Cont i nui ng t o t he next l i ne.

10 As y ou c an s e e, t her e wa s s i gni f i c ant11 l i t er at ur e out t her e by t he ' 80s . The wat er s hed f r om

12 t hi s l i t er at ur e was s o mewher e i n t he mi d- ' 70' s , and t hat

13 was wher e you begi n t o get usef ul dat a on t he pr eval ence

14 o f s e xua l abus e and t he pr e da t o r y of f e nder s .

15 The nex t s l i de.

16 So I had no t r oubl e f i ndi ng s t udi es at t hat17 poi nt i n t i me. I t woul d not be c or r ec t t o s ay t hat

18 t he r e wa s no i nf or ma t i o n out t her e.

19 The nex t s l i de.

20 And t he book I wr ot e i n ' 87 - - ' 88, I had 257

21 r ef er e nc es . I c oul d ha ve had qui t e a l o t mo r e .

22 So t hat ' s what t he exper t s knew. Now, what I

23 hav e t al k ed about - -

24 Coul d you go t o t he next l i ne and see wha t i t

25 i s .


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1 Sor r y. I t hi nk t hat ' s a pr evi ous one.

2 What I t al k ed about i s t he f ac t t hat t hi s

3 body of knowl edge t hat t he exper t s had became publ i c

4 knowl edge when t hese cases br oke . No t j us t t he Ca t ho l i c

5 Chur ch scanda l , but i n 1991, t he r e was a huge r evi val o f

6 t he se r i e s o f t he Boy Scout s , and how many chi l dr en had

7 been abus e d bef or e t hey i ns t i t ut ed t hei r new c hi l d

8 pr ot ec t i on pol i c y. And t he number s wer e r eal l y

9 s t agger i ng on how many chi l dr en had been abused. Wel l

10 over a t housand.11 That was t r ue, even t hough t he Boy Scout s had

12 s t ar t ed by t he ' 20s , t hey had s t ar t ed devel opi ng a l i s t

13 of i nel i gi bl e vol unt eer s , peopl e who c oul d not v ol unt eer

14 t o be ar ound c hi l dr en i n t hei r pr ogr am bec aus e t hey

15 wer e c hi l d mol es t e r s .

16 So t he Boy Scout t hi ng came out i n ' 91. The17 Cat ho l i c Chur ch came out i n ' 84.

18 Ot he r scanda l s - - t he Geor ge Rear don case

19 came out i n ' 92. And t ha t was t he case o f t he

20 endocr i no l ogi s t who had t aken 60, 000 por nogr aphi c

21 pi c t ur es of hi s chi l d pat i ent s . And when i t c ame out i n

22 ' 92, he was i mmedi at el y r el i eved of hi s l i c ens e, s o t hat

23 he was not abl e t o be ar ound chi l dr en anymor e .

24 By t he ' 90s , peopl e knew what t he r i sk was

25 when you had a chi l d mol es t er . And t he s t andar d of


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1 pr ac t i c e was not t o k eep i t s e cr et and l et t he per s o n

2 c ont i nue i n t he s a me ac t i v i t i es wi t h t he s a me ac c es s t o

3 c hi l dr en. That was not t he s t andar d of c ar e.

4 Q. L et me mo ve t o a di f f e r e nt s u bj ec t no w, i f we

5 c oul d.

6 You r evi ewed Candace Cont i ' s medi ca l r ecor ds?

7 A. Yes .

8 MR. SI MONS: Your Honor , Exhi bi t 55 has

9 pr evi ous l y been mar ked. I woul d move i t i nt o evi dence

10 at t hi s t i me.11 THE COURT: Pl ai nt i f f ' s 55?

12 MR. SI MONS: Yes. No cor r espondi ng number .


14 MR. SCHNACK: Your Honor , I t hi nk t ha t

15 c ont ai ns hea r s a y. T her e ha s be en no doc t o r t o bas i c al l y

16 t es t i f y t o t he doc t or ' s r epor t . So we woul d obj ec t .17 MR. SI MONS: Wel l , may we?

18 ( Si debar di s c us s i on)

19 THE COURT: Al l r i ght . Mr . Si mons .

20 MR. SI MONS: May Exhi bi t 55 be admi t t ed?

21 THE COURT: I t may be admi t t ed. I wi l l make

22 a r ec or d l at er about i t .


24 ( Wher eupon, Pl ai nt i f f ' s Ex hi bi t Number 55

25 was admi t t ed i nt o evi dence )


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1 BY MR. SI MONS:

2 Q. Now ar e y ou f ami l i ar , Dr . Sal t er , wi t h t he

3 c onc ept of del ay ed di s c l os ur e as i t appl i es t o v i c t i ms

4 o f c hi l dho od s ex ua l abus e ?

5 A. Yes , s i r .

6 Q. Now, f i r s t of al l , c an you expl ai n f or us

7 wha t t ha t c onc ept i nv ol v es ?

8 A. I t i s r eal l y j us t mor e - - has t o do wi t h

9 r es e ar c h f i ndi ngs a nd bei ng a c onc ept .

10 When r esear ch has been done on chi l dr en who11 wer e sexua l l y abused, t hey have pr e t t y much - - t he

12 s t udi es h av e pr et t y muc h uni v er s a l l y f ound t hat t he

13 maj or i t y of c hi l dr en do not r epor t r i ght away.

14 Ther e i s s omet hi ng c al l ed del ay ed di s c l os ur e.

15 And I br ought j us t a s a mpl e of t hi s r es e ar c h, but t her e

16 i s r eal l y qui t e a number of s t udi es on t hi s t opi c .17 That ' s t he next s l i de.

18 Ok ay. Thi s i s a s u mma r y of 11 r e t r os p ec t i v e

19 s t udi es . And t hey di s c ov er ed t hat one- t hi r d of t he

20 chi l dr en who wer e sexua l l y abused r eveal ed i t t o anybody

21 dur i ng c hi l dho od, and t ha t onl y 10 t o 18 per c ent o f

22 t hos e cas es e ver got t o aut hor i t i es .

23 The maj or i t y of s exual abus e j us t i s n' t

24 di s c l os ed, per i od. And when i t i s di s c l os ed, i t i s

25 t ypi c al l y not di s c l os ed i mmedi at el y.


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1 Nex t s l i de.

2 T he s e a r e ot he r s t udi e s , 6 t o 12 pe r c ent ev er

3 got t o aut hor i t i es .

4 Nex t s l i de.

5 Thi s i s a s t udy i n 2000 by Smi t h. Wha t t hey

6 f ound i n an exampl e of 388 chi l dr en o r adul t s who had

7 bee n s e xua l l y abus e d as c hi l dr e n, was t hat o nl y

8 18 per c ent r epor t ed i t wi t hi n t he f i r s t 24 hour s . 4 t o

9 7 pe r cent t ook mor e t han f i ve yea r s . And 28 pe r cent

10 nev er t o l d any bo dy bef o r e t he r es e ar c her a s k ed t he m on11 t he phone or i n pe r son.

12 And c ons i s t ent l y up t o a t hi r d of adul t

13 su r v i vor s o f sexua l abuse , when t hey have done su r veys

14 on t hem, t hey t ol d t he r es e ar c her , y ou ar e t he f i r s t

15 per s on I hav e ev er t ol d about i t .

16 Nex t s l i de.17 Thi s shows how l ong we have had t hi s

18 knowl edge . Back i n 1989, Sauz i e r d i d a s t udy and

19 di s c ov er ed t hat of t he c hi l dr en who wer e s ex ual l y

20 abused, 24 pe r cent r epor t ed wi t hi n a week , 21 pe r cent

21 r epor t ed wi t hi n l es s t han a y ear , 17 per c ent r epor t ed

22 mor e t han a year , and 39 pe r cent never r epor t ed, dur i ng

23 c hi l dhoo d, t he s e xua l a bus e .

24 Nex t s l i de.

25 I j us t br ought a f ew of t hes e s l i des . T her e


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1 i s muc h bi gger , br oa der r es e ar c h on t hi s .

2 I n 1990, i mmedi a t e l y boys , 40 pe r cent .

3 Femal es , 40 per cent .

4 L at er , 14 pe r c ent ma l e s , 24 per c ent f emal es .

5 Never a s chi l dr en, 42 pe r cent ma l es and 32

6 per cent f emal es .

7 Nex t s l i de.

8 Del ay ed di s c l o s er , Gomes - Sc hwar t z , et a l ,

9 ' 92, wi t hi n a we ek , 24 pe r c ent .

10 El l i ot t and Br i er e, i n ' 94, mor e t han one a11 year , 75 pe r cent . Mor e t han 5 yea r s , 18 pe r cent .

12 Nex t s l i de.

13 Pi pe, et al , 2007, t he del ay s i nc e t he l as t

14 i nc i dent , l es s t han a mont h, 43 per c ent . One t o s i x

15 mont hs , 19 per cent , and so on.

16 So t he po i nt bei ng t ha t I hav e y et t o s e e a17 s t udy, I hav e ne ve r s e en a s t udy t hat f o und t hat t he

18 maj or i t y of c hi l dr en who we r e s ex ua l l y abus e d r e po r t ed

19 i t r i ght away. I t i s one of t he r ar e c as es i n whi c h t he

20 r es e ar c h i s i n agr ee ment .

21 I t hi nk t hat ' s t he l as t one.

22 Q. Now one of t he t hi ngs you wer e asked t o do i n

23 t hi s c a s e wa s t o t ak e a l oo k at t he r e po r t pr e pa r e d by a

24 Dr . Mar t i n Wi l l i ams . Cor r ec t ?

25 A. Yes .


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1 Q. And do y ou r ec al l t he r epor t of f er i ng t he

2 o pi ni o n t hat Canda ce Co nt i wo ul d l i k el y t o hav e be en

3 addi c t ed t o dr ugs i n a subs t ance abuse r because o f he r

4 mot her ' s addi c t i on?

5 A. Yes . I do r ec al l t hat .

6 Q. Do you agr ee wi t h t ha t opi ni on?

7 A. No, I don' t agr ee wi t h t hat opi ni on.

8 Al t hough i t i s t r ue t hat t he c hi l dr en of addi c t s hav e a

9 hi gher r at e of addi c t i on t han ot her peopl e.

10 But t ha t doe s n' t mea n a maj or i t y of t he m ar e11 addi c t i ve. At l eas t 50 per c ent of t he var i ant s i s due

12 t o t he env i r onment i n t hese cases .

13 You c oul d have - - l et ' s s ay t he r at e of

14 popul at i on of peopl e addi c t ed i s 2 per c ent . Wel l , y ou

15 c oul d ha ve , ma ybe ev en a f o ur - t i me i nc r e as e i n c hi l dr en

16 of addi c t s t o 8 per c ent . That does n' t mean i t i s t he17 maj or i t y o f t hem.

18 I ' m not awar e of s t udi es . And I hope he

19 pr oduc es t hem i f t hat ' s a c l ai m he i s goi ng t o mak e t hat

20 s h ows t hat a maj or i t y of c hi l dr en o f a ddi c t s b ec ome

21 addi c t s t hemse l ves . Ther e i s a huge env i r onment a l

22 f ac t or i nvol ved.

23 Q. And addi t i onal l y, i n r ev i ewi ng t he ques t i on

24 of t he r epor t wi t h Dr . Wi l l i ams - - and we hav en' t hear d

25 f r om hi m y et , s o we ar e k i nd of doi ng t hi s i n a v ac uum,


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1 but he pe r f o r med ce r t a i n t e s t i ng on Candace Cont i .

2 Cor r ec t ?

3 A. Yes .

4 Q. And y ou r ev i ewed hi s r epor t of t hat t es t i ng?

5 A. Yes .

6 Q. Di d you agr ee wi t h t he t e s t i ng appr oach as a

7 met hod of di agnos i s i n t hi s k i nd of c as e ?

8 A. Wel l , y ou c an us e t es t i ng i n s uppor t f or y our

9 t e s t i mony. But i f you a r e go i ng t o eva l ua t e someone who

10 i s c l ai mi ng t o be a s ur v i v or of s e xual abus e , y ou hav e11 t o us e t he r i ght i ns t r ument s . And I don' t h av e hi s

12 r epor t i n f r ont o f me . But my memor y t e l l s me t ha t t he

13 i ns t r ume nt s h e us e d had t o do wi t h gener al per s o na l i t y

14 t r a i t s .

15 But t oday t he as s e s s me nt of a dul t s u r v i v or s

16 i s much mor e spec i a l i zed. So you woul d use t e s t s t ha t17 s pec i f i c al l y pi c ked up t r auma. Tes t s f or PTSD. Tes t s

18 f or di s a s s oc i at i on. Tes t s f or t r auma- r el at ed s y mpt oms .

19 I f y ou ar e goi ng t o us e t es t s , y ou s houl d us e

20 t he t e s t s t hat hav e t o do wi t h t he t r a uma, not gener al

21 per s onal i t y t es t s t hat wer e not des i gned t o pi c k up

22 t r auma o r addr ess i s s ues o f t r auma . And he di dn' t do

23 t h a t .

24 MR. SI MONS: Thank you, your Honor .

25


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2 BY MR. SCHNACK:

3 Q. Dr . Sal t er , f i r s t of al l , you ar e not awar e

4 of any l aws t hat exi s t ed i n 1993 t hat r equi r ed r el i gi ous

5 or gani z at i ons o r t hei r mi ni s t er s t o i nf or m member s o f

6 t hei r c ongr egat i on of a one- t i me c hi l d mol es t er ; i s t hat

7 c o r r e c t ?

8 A. Wel l , I bel i ev e t hat t her e was a l aw i n pl ac e

9 t ha t r equi r e d pe opl e who we r e i nv ol v ed wi t h c hi l dr en t o

10 r epor t . But i t was not s pec i f i c t o t he c l er gy unt i l a11 l at er per i od of t i me. They di dn' t s i ngl e out c l er gy

12 unt i l a l at er per i od of t i me.

13 Q. Ri ght .

14 So mi ni s t er s wer en' t r equi r ed t o r epor t i n

15 Cal i f or ni a unt i l J anuar y 1s t of ' 97; i s t hat c or r ec t ?

16 A. That ' s c or r ec t . Ther e was not a l aw t hat17 s pec i f i c al l y addr es s ed mi ni s t er s .

18 Q. Yeah.

19 T he e ar l i er l a w addr es s e d s c h oo l t e ac he r s and

20 heal t h pr of es s i onal s and t hi ngs l i k e t hat . Cor r ec t ?

21 A. Wel l , I bel i eve i t was a l i t t l e bi t br oader .

22 I don' t have i t i n f r ont of me. But t her e was a s ec t i on

23 t al ked about i ns t i t ut i ons t hat i nvol ved c hi l dr en.

24 Q. Ok ay. But not mi ni s t er s or c l er gy. Cor r ec t ?

25 A. Di dn' t ex cl ude mi ni s t er s or c l er gy. My


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1 bel i ef i s t hat i f t hey pr obabl y made i t - - s i ngl ed t hem

2 o ut i n ' 97 t o ma ke i t s u r e t hat peo pl e under s t oo d t hat

3 mi ni s t er s a nd c l er gy s houl d be r e por t i ng c hi l d s e xual

4 abus e, unl es s i t was i n t he c ont ex t of ot her

5 pr of es s i ons .

6 Q. Wel l , mandat ed r epor t i ng i s n' t " s houl d. " I s

7 i t ? I t ' s r equi r ed. I s n' t mandat ed r epor t i ng r equi r ed?

8 A. Yes .

9 Q. Okay. And c l er gy and mi ni s t er s wer e not

10 r equi r ed t o r epor t unt i l J anuar y 1 of ' 97 i n Cal i f or ni a.11 Cor r ec t ?

12 A. Cl er gi es and mi ni s t er s wer e not s i ngl ed out .

13 I t hi nk t her e wa s a que s t i o n about whe t her t he c as e l aw

14 appl i es t o t hem, and t hey c er t ai nl y made i t c l ear t hat

15 i t appl i ed i n 1997.

16 Q. Okay. Let ' s t al k a l i t t l e bi t about t he17 c onc ept of c onf i dent i al i t y.

18 Ar e y ou f ami l i ar wi t h t he c onc ept t hat

19 mi ni s t er s who pr ov i de s p i r i t ual hel p hav e an o pe n

20 c onf i dent i al i t y wi t h r egar d t o what t hey l ear ned i n

21 c onc ept wi t h mi ni s t er s ? Ar e y ou f ami l i ar wi t h t hat ?

22 A. I ' m f ami l i ar wi t h t he c onc ept t hat t hey ar e

23 r equi r ed t o keep t hi ngs c onf i dent i al i f i t i s i n t he

24 f or m of a di s cus s i on.

25 You k now, I ' l l be hones t . For i ns t anc e, t he


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1 Cat hol i c pr i es t t aki ng c onf es s i on. I ' m not awar e t hat

2 i f a mi ni s t er l ear ns i t f r om any s our c e or i n any

3 c ont ext , t hat he i s r equi r ed t o k eep i t c onf i dent i al .

4 Q. So what i s your f ami l i ar i t y wi t h t he pr ac t i c e

5 of t he J ehov ah' s Wi t nes s e s i n t hat r egar d?

6 A. Wel l , t hei r pr ac t i ce i s def i ni t el y t o keep i t

7 c onf i dent i al and not t o r epor t i t at t hat t i me, you

8 k now, and k eep t hat s af e, not t o al er t t he c ongr egat i on

9 t o t he f ac t t hat t hey hav e a c hi l d mol es t er i n t hei r

10 mi ds t .11 Q. My ques t i on di dn' t i nv ol v e c hi l d mol es t er s ,

12 ma' am.

13 A. Okay.

14 Q. So ar e y ou f ami l i a r wi t h t he c onc ept of

15 c onf i dent i al i t y wi t hi n communi c at i ons t hat ar e made t o

16 t he mi ni s t er s ?17 A. Yes .

18 Q. And wi t hi n t he J ehov ah' s Wi t nes s e s , how i s

19 t hat d one i n pr ac t i c e? What i s your f ami l i ar i t y wi t h

20 t h a t ?

21 A. I c an onl y ans wer i t i n r el at i on t o c hi l d

22 s e xual abus e bec aus e I di dn' t s t udy t he gener al pol i c i es

23 of t he J ehov ah' s Wi t nes s e s . The onl y mat er i al I

24 r evi ewed was havi ng t o do wi t h t hi s case .

25 Q. As a ps y c hol ogi s t , do y ou hav e an o bl i gat i on


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1 of c onf i dent i al i t y when y ou l ear n s o met hi ng i n

2 c onf i denc e f r om a pat i ent ?

3 A. Yes and no.

4 I r evi ewed sever a l . The APA Code o f

5 Conf i dent i al i t y. I n f ac t , I l ook ed at t he APA Amer i c an

6 P s y cho l o gi c al As s o c i at i on Code i n t he 1992 e t hi c s c ode

7 compar ed t o t he 2002 et hi cs code. And what I f ound was

8 what eve r y psychol ogi s t knows and i s t aught , and t ha t

9 i s , y ou c annot k eep ev er y t hi ng c onf i dent i al . You c annot

10 k ee p t hi ngs c o nf i dent i a l i n whi c h t he pe r s o n may har m11 t hemsel ves or may har m someone el se.

12 Gi v e me a s e cond. I wi l l f i nd t he pl ac e

13 wher e i t s a ys t hat . That i s t r ue t oday. That was al s o

14 t r ue - - I ' m s or r y. Thi s i s a l ar ge et hi cs s ec t i on.

15 That was t r ue t hen and i t i s t r ue t oday.

16 I al s o r evi ewed t he c onf i dent i al i t y c odes17 f r o m s o me ot he r or ga ni z a t i o ns , and I f ound t he s a me

18 t hi ng, t hat t her e ar e exc ept i ons t o c onf i dent i al i t y and

19 t hos e ex cept i ons hav e t o do i f a per s on i s a r i s k t o

20 t hemse l ves o r a r i sk t o someone el se .

21 Q. L et ' s t ur n t o t he publ i c at i ons t hat you

22 t es t i f i ed about i n - -

23 Ar e you f i ni shed pagi ng t hr ough, ma ' am?

24 A. I was t r yi ng t o f i nd i t and I gues s I di dn' t

25 hi ghl i ght i t . But I di dn' t ent i r el y f i ni s h my ans wer .


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1 Q. Wel l , y ou we r e t al k i ng a bout

2 non- psychol ogi s t s . So t ha t ' s why I a s sume you wer e

3 non- r espons i ve t o my ques t i on.

4 A. I f ound i t . Pl eas e as k your ques t i on agai n.

5 Q. L et ' s t ur n t o t he publ i c at i ons t her e t hat you

6 r ef er enc e i n y our depos i t i on.

7 You r e f e r enced a number o f publ i ca t i ons on

8 c hi l dhoo d s e xual a bus e publ i s h ed by r e l i gi ous a nd ot her

9 or gani z at i ons .

10 Do you r ec al l t hat i n your depos i t i on?11 A. Yes , I do.

12 Q. And you r ef er enced t he Amer i can Bapt i s t

13 publ i c at i on i n 1993.

14 Do y ou r ec al l t hat ?

15 A. I r ec al l ment i oni ng t he Bapt i s t s .

16 Q. Ar e y ou pagi ng, s t i l l , f or t he et hi c s , ma' am,17 or what ar e you doi ng?

18 A. No. I was l ook i ng f or t he ac t ual s t at ement

19 t hat t hey made.

20 My memor y i s t hat t hey had a pol i cy t hat came

21 out i n, I bel i ev e, ' 97. But what t he pol i c y s ai d was

22 t hey hav e been s e r v ed not i c e of t hi s pr obl em s i nc e ' 84.

23 Q. And i n 1993 di d t he Amer i can Bapt i s t s have a

24 pol i c y of i nf or mi ng t hei r c ongr egat i ons a bout a

25 congr egat i on member who was a one- t i me chi l d mol est er ?


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1 A. Wel l - -

2 Q. Di d t hey? Yes or no, ma' am.

3 A. I am not awar e of t he pol i c i es .

4 Q. And nei t her di d t he Uni t ed Me t hodi s t s a t t ha t

5 t i me, i n 1993, di d t hey ?

6 A. I bel i eve t hey di d.

7 Q. Di d t hey hav e a pol i c y of i nf or mi ng t hei r

8 congr egat i on about a congr egat i on member who was a

9 o ne - t i me c hi l d mol es t er i n 1993?

10 A. Wel l , i n 1988, t he pol i c y was t o s p ea k out11 whe n a bus e s oc c ur r ed. And s o I t ak e t ha t a s a pol i c y - -

12 Q. Wi t hi n t he c onf i nes of pr i v ac y. Cor r ec t ?

13 A. No.

14 I t s ays , t he s t at ement i s :

15 " Be i t r es ol v ed t hat t he Uni t ed

16 Met hodi s t Chur c h s hal l uphol d t he r i ght s of 17 ch i l dr en t o speak out when abuses occur and

18 adv oc at e f or t he s t r engt heni ng and s t r i c t

19 e nf or c eme nt - - "

20 Q. So i t adv oc at es f or t he c hi l dr en t o s peak

21 out . Cor r ec t ?

22 A. No.

23 Q. T ha t ' s what y ou j us t r ea d.

24 A. Wel l , I don' t be

Watchtower: Jury Trial Day 4, Candace Conti v. Watchtower

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