Thesis Note Chinese Translation

Draft by 27.5.14 Thesis Notes 25.5.14

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Introduction (20.4.14)

Harmonising the voice of Li Ch’ing-chao: the four translations as (overtons/harmonies/version) of the original Translation is a struggle with impossibility… -- Mirra Ginsburg, Russian Translator Reimagining the voice of Li Ch’ing-chao: the ‘reality’ between the Literary Chinese and English language. Finding the voice of Li Ch’ing-chao: A case study of 4 different translations of Sheng Sheng Man. Introduction (1500 - 2000 words) The thesis deals with the multi-faceted relationship between the translated poem and its original, as well as the relation between different translated poems on the same original poem. The thesis takes James Holmes’ proposition as the starting point, where he defines:

The poem intended as a translation of a poem into another language, which as one type of meta-literature we may call a ‘metapoem’, is from this point of view a fundamentally different kind of object from the poem from which it derives. This difference is perhaps best defined in the following proposition:

MP:P :: P:R － the relation of the metapoem to the original poem is as that of the original poem to ‘reality’.

(Holmes, 1968: 10) Holmes considers creative literature, like poetry, fiction and drama, as the writer makes use of language to formulate certain statements which are usually extra-linguistic and ‘might, with some hesitation be called the “realities”’ (ibid), and he refines the concept of ‘meta-language’ suggested by Barthes and suggests the translated poem would be better described as ‘metapoem’, which its relation to poem is ‘similar to that of an analysis or explication of a poem to that poem’ (ibid). Holmes further refines his statement in another essay, suggesting the metapoem is a nexus of a complex bundle of relationships converging from two directions: from the original poem, in its language, and linked in a very specific way to the poetic tradition of that language; and from the poetic tradition of the target language, with its more or less stringent expectations regarding poetry which the metapoem, if it is to be successful as poetry, must in some measure meet.

“the world” → Poem -------→Metapoem Holmes’ point of view is subjected to readers who can understand the translated and original poem, whilst in reality, the majority of readers, with little knowledge of the source language, can only rely on translation(s) to appreciate the original poem. The aim of the thesis to test whether Holmes’ proposition is tenable. Holmes conducts his study mainly with European languages (Dutch, and one example, German) into English. The thesis does not aim to dispute or disprove the ‘MP:P :: P:R’ proposition entirely, but seeks to add to the claim by exploring whether the metapoem can be in direct relation with ‘reality’. It is the thesis interest to see if the proposition can be restated as ‘MP:R :: R:P’, where the ‘reality’ as a pivotal point for translation. When starting to write the thesis, the following questions arose: 1) Is it necessary to define the value of the metapoem based entirely on its relation with the original poem? 2) When there is more than one metapoem, do they still reflect the same ‘reality’? The thesis shall investigate see if the same case applies when translating from Literary Chinese into English. To achieve this, the thesis tries to identify impediments in translating from literary Chinese into English language. Holmes in his essay points out four impediments when translating from Dutch into English (although one example was demonstrated through using German), in which Dutch is a closer language to English and literary Chinese. Even though a lot of translators (Raffel, 1986: XX; Balcom, ; Pan, ) have attempted to highlight the difficulties when translating from Chinese into English as translation criticism, the thesis is identifying the impediments to show, such constraints between English translation of Literary Chinese highlights the problem of comparing MP:P. Instead, it suggests translator may better start with analysing how Chinese constructs the reality, then reconstruct it with English language. The huge cultural gap between the Chinese and English proposes challenges to translators, where in the relationship further defined by Holmes:

“the world” → Poem -------→Metapoem This proposes more problems into Holmes’ proposition, since Chinese has a rather different poetic tradition than the English.


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The case study subject is going to be the tz’u Sheng Sheng Man written by the Song Dynasty poetess Li Ch’ing-chao. I choose this tz’u because it is the most representative among Li’s works, and it is regarded as one of the most important Song Tz’u where it is always included in Literary Chinese pedagogic canon. It is one of the tz’u that has been translated by many notable translators, Analysing the tz’u will provide series of impediments, whilst analysing four translations attempted by both native Chinese and native English speakers will provide data that shows how Literary Chinese constructs the reality differently from modern English language does. Suggesting Holmes may not be accurate, in Chinese context, to define and restrict the notion of MP only to the relationship between MP:P. The thesis suggests, may be we can look at MP:R, using R as a pivotal point for linking both the metapoem and its original. It also aims to provide explanations for the discrepancies between the metapoems on the same poem. Since the reality constructed by literary Chinese is fairly different, it is implicit (or ambiguity), it has its own tradition, cultural reference, form, morphology and phonology. Using analysis, not just adding onto the lists of Holmes’ impediments, but this is to prove, better to start with R when we are translating poetry. Ultimately this thesis aims to enrich what has be said by James, and it is a plea for a translation gain: by looking at many translations, what we should imagined about Li Ch’ing-chao. Ultimately in search of the kinship of translation. reality = voice in the case study At the end of the study the thesis is not going to prescribed, but trying to study what kind of voice of Li Ch’ing-chao has been created.

A useful example = literal meaning in Chinese differs a lot from what we actually mean, hence English can’t do a literal translation, but a creative way of translating it, which seemingly not faithful to the ST.

Introduction (13.4.14) A metapoem or a Frankenstein? and should we be satisfied? Introduction (2500 words) Justified by André Lefevere, one doesn’t need to know the source language from which the poet So Dongpo （蘇東坡） has been translated, they will notice it’d be problematic to pinpoint what is the image of So Dongpo. Andre Lefevere in his article title asks an interesting question, ‘Excuse me, is This the Same Poem?’, when he was reading different English translations of the same poem by So DongPo. He highlights the differences between translation as reader who doesn’t know any Chinese, and illustrates the power of translation towards readers who do not know Chinese. A similar study was conducted to show there are nineteen ways of looking at the poet Wang Wei （王維）. The more famous the poet was, the more translations were published. At the conclusion Lefevere does not come up with any solution and concludes he should not come up with any solution about how should Chinese poetry be translated into English, but he sets a framework for my research, in which I would like to start with the same question, ‘Is this the same poem?’ As I read more translated poems, some successful translations are another poems, and I begin ask the same question ‘Excuse me, is This the Same Poem?’ Hence I would like to research what is the relationship between the many translated poems and their relationship with the original.

Define what is Metapoem and introduce the argument proposed by James Holmes 500 The main purpose of this thesis is to explore the multi-faceted relationship between the translated poem, or called ‘metapoem’ and its original, by comparing different versions of the same poem ‘Shen Shen Meng’ written by the Song Dynasty poet Li Ch’ing-chao. Taking James Holmes’ essay as a starting point, the thesis is going to explore and rethink about the relationship between the translation and its original. By metapoem, as it is defined by James Holmes, he defines,

The poem intended as a translation of a poem into another language, which as one type of meta-literature we may call a ‘metapoem’, is from this point of view a fundamentally different kind of object from the poem from which it derives.


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In Holmes’ words, the ‘metapoem’ is something ‘derived’ from the original and the two share a ‘severed umbilical cord’. When explaining the difference between a metapoem and a poem, he suggests,

This difference is perhaps best defined in the following proposition: MP:P :: P:R - the relation of the metapoem to the original poem is as that of the original poem to ‘reality’.

This paper is going to analyse a few metapoems (i.e. the translators translate poem using a poem form instead of a form of verse or prose), and explore further the proposition proposed by Holmes on the relationship between the metapoem and its original. Does the ‘value’ or significance of a metapoem has to rely on its relationship with the original, instead of the reality (i.e. MP:R :: P:R)? In other word, can the metapoem be directly reflecting the ‘reality’? What metapoem does, according to Holmes, is to criticise the original. Different from criticism, which is another kind of meta-literature, ‘the metapoem, on the other hand, interprets, as William Frost has pointed out, not by analysis, but by enactment.’ It is important to note that Holmes pointed out himself the ‘impediments’ he identified ‘may vary greatly in emphasis according to the languages and the cultures concerned’, where his study was focusing on creating a metapoem in one specific language, English, on the basis of a poem in another specific language, Dutch. Hence this becomes the aim of the thesis, to test whether his claim will be the same when translating a poem in Classical Chinese. The thesis is not going to dispute what Holmes has suggested, but through further exploration the first part of the paper attempts to show there should be more factors (than acumen as a critic, craftsmanship as a poet, and skill in the analysing and resolving of a confrontation of norms and conventions across linguistic and cultural barriers) in making of appropriate decisions. Through this we can rethink about the relationship of metapoem and its original. elaborate the first part of the thesis can be enhanced by Susan’s view or Snell-hornby’s (500) link to the main Research Question I am going to answer When translation become a discipline in academic studies, there is a tendency to fall into the binary categorisation, ‘which operate with rigid dividing-lines, binary opposites, antitheses and dichotomies’ (Snell-Hornby, XXXX: 450). Following the suggestion of Snell-Hornby’s third hypothesis, the first part of the thesis is going to re-examine the notion of metapoem, and suggest it’s relationship with the original is more like a ‘spectrum’. With Holmes Besides if one considers on a practical level, when the translator is translating poetry, certain decisions have to be made in order to finalise a translation. It is a sustaining thought, as suggested by Susan Bassnett, ‘translation is inevitable, all translations are originals and all originals are translations.’ (Bassnett, XXXX: ). It is counter-arguing with Holmes’ notion of metapoem as a derivative from the original, as a subversion. In fact, translators, especially Chinese translator, in translating classical Chinese poetry tend to use a hybridization of style when dealing with Classical Chinese poetry. The thesis suggests, drawing data from the text analysis, that the trend of translating Chinese poetry is now very seldom to use only either, domesticating or foreignising; or modernising or historicising; ___or ___ technique, but usually a mixture of blend. ambiguity as emptiness. Learning from Linder and her article, what the thesis is concerned with is not the ‘accuracy’ of the translation, but rather how each text (metapoem) adds to the meaning of the original. By identifying the relationship between the metapoem and its original, versus the ‘reality’, the thesis hopes to answer what we gain through the many translations, and see how it helps us in understanding Li Ching-chao in general? Since after all we have to translate it from classical Chinese to modern Chinese in order to understand. Further elaborate the study is going to be conducted under the context of translating Chinese poetry, this scope can test/enrich the proposition suggested by Holmes (500) When John Balcom highlights the question, _____ not only that is the problem for translating modern Chinese literature, it is even more problematic when it comes to translating Classical Chinese poetry. The thesis is going to argue, by highlighting the discrepancies between different translations, an English metapoem of a Classical Chinese poetry does not show the relationship MP:P::P:R, since the P:R is problematic to analyse, and it is due to the implicitness, which in turn creates the ‘poetics’, in Chinese poetry. Therefore it is only through a hybridisation of the two languages, ambiguity as ____? to reflect the reality Highlight how MP:P is so contrasting, since English is inevitably explicit in order to work, whilst Chinese is First part of the thesis is going to discuss Translating poetry is perhaps the most problematic among all other kinds of literary translation, and translators have their own view on how to translate poetry and never agree with one another. It is not the aim of this paper to prescribe the solution for translating poetry, as there is no such thing as the perfect translation. Instead, the paper attempts to compare different translations of the same poem,


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Restating Hypothesis clearly and what we may expect from the case study? 500 When one considers the writing system of the Chinese language, the cultural and the tradition in Chinese literary history, translating from Classical Chinese into English language seems impossible. Due to the distance between the East and West, the methods different translators came up in the past to bridge between the two cultures are therefore providing a scope to study the difference. The different translations of the same poem could tell us more about The second part of the thesis is going to deal with [the structure of the thesis/ demonstration 500]/ a very useful example

‘However when translation and creativity are mentioned in the same breath, the issue of faithfulness to the original immediately imposes itself. If a translator is being creative, does that imply that he or she is being unfaithful to the author and his or her work?’

(John Balcom 2006: 119)

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Research Question (that I can’t decide, but I have a direction) • How do we construct Li Ch’ing-chao in English? • Englishing Li Ch’ing-chao • Is the translation of Li Ch’ing-chao a version of the original or is ….Translation as a (sub)version or

Translation as the original • Gain or Loss, Alive or Dead, Original or subversion of original: → the only way to make Li Ch’ing-chao

lives again is to set it alive again, through translating and translating and make the translation become the ‘original’ even though the notion of ‘original’ is rather problematic.

• James Holmes p.10 ‘the poem intended as a translation of a poem into another language, which as one type of meta-literature we may call a ‘metapoem’ [MP:P::P:R - the relation of the metapoem to the original poem is as that of the original poem to ‘reality’.] → To what extent the translation of Li Ch’ing-chao is a ‘metapoem’?

• What do we leave behind when failing to translate…. • how can we explain the discrepancy? p.174 (translating for Chinese from Chinese to Chinese) • When one poem has been translated many times, what does it bring to the …. • What is Li Ch’ing-chao to us now? after being translated again and again. • Reimagining the voice of Li Ch’ing-chao: how poetry translation is a process of re-creation? → a study of

translating from implicit to explicit • Translating, Rewriting, or Recreating? Reimagining the voice of Li Ch’ing-chao. • what the actual practise V.S. the academic debate: First artwork , later criticism

What we learn from the many translations? Towards a hybridisation Testing if the translation of Li are metapoem? MP:P :: P:R → this is an explanation to answer the discrepancy of different translation. in support of translating more more more, the more it is translated the more it will come to life??? What is the afterlife of Li? Towards a pure language of Li? A plea against the loss in translating Li

Aim binary systems: the translator-writer continuum When we look at the translation of poetry, no two translators could come up with the same translation. This is Rationale of doing the thesis → Vincent Venuti’s translator’s invisibility??? Who decides the voice of Li C’hing-chao


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→ Translation compensation: this is what everyone has been doing → re-examine the role of translators during poetry translation → the difficulties of translating Chinese (implicit) to English (explicit) → What are the difficulties from translating implicit to explicit? → what is the task for translators when translating poetry? success = becoming a literature on its own ? what is the point of translating poetry? Who do you think you can translate? can the translation done by Xu Yuanchong be counted as the literature or conclusion → the only way to make Li Ch’ing-chao lives again is to set it alive again, through translating and translating and make the translation become the ‘original’ even though the notion of ‘original’ is rather problematic.

What to do for the actual Analysis/Case Study 1→ on translating emotions 2→ on translating the sounds/ phonology 3→ on translating the imagery 2&3 actually constituate to form the emotions

Quotes Rethinking Translation ‘with his British collaborator in order to create a young Frankenstein, Three Trapped Tigers, a version more than a translation or - as all translations are - another book.’ towards a hybridisation of Poetics - Chinese and English As translators can pretty much agree a translation is good (a translated text), they may not be able to come to consensus about how to achieve such translation. [i.e. disagree on the explanation about how to come up with the translation]

p.10 Poem and Metapoem: poetry from Dutch to English James S Holmes ‘It would seem to be worth our while to consider a third approach to the problem of verse translation, one which steers midway between the unattainable ideal of equivalence and the desperate counsel of impossibility. Over against the creative literature of poetry, fiction, and drama, in which the writer makes use of language to formulate certain statements about matters, situations and emotions which are themselves usually extra-linguistic (in short, about what might, with some hesitation be called ‘reality’), one can distinguish a body of ‘meta-literature’, writing which makes use of language to communicate something about literature itself. Literary criticism and explication are obvious examples of such meta-literature, but so, too, is literary translation. The poem intended as a translation of a poem into another language, which as one type of meta-literature we may call a ‘metapoem’, is from this point of view a fundamentally different kind of object from the poem from which it derives. This difference is perhaps best defined in the following proposition: MP:P :: P:R - the relation of the metapoem to the original poem is as that of the original poem to ‘reality’.’ ‘The metapoem, on the other hand, interprets, as William Frost has pointed out, not by analysis but by enactment.’


(John Balcom 2006: 119)

‘A successfully translated poem is always another poem.’


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Definition of terms Translation is ‘of course, a rewriting of an original text’ because it involves re-writing the message from one language to another (Lefevere, 1992: vii). Translating poetry is ‘All rewritings, whatever their intention, reflect a certain ideology and a poetics and as such manipulate literature to function in a given society in a given way. Rewriting is manipulation, undertaken in the service of power, and in its positive aspect can help in the evolution of a literature and a society. Rewritings can introduce new concepts, new genres, new devices and the history of translation is the history also of literary innovation, of the shaping power of one culture upon another. But rewriting can also repress innovation, distort and contain, and in an age of ever increasing manipulation of all kinds, the study of the manipulation of all kinds, the study of the manipulation processes of literature as exemplified by translation can help us towards a greater awareness of the world in which we live.’

(Lefevere, 1992: vii) Rewriting may sound very similar to recreating, yet the latter focuses more on the creativity during the writing process, whilst the former focuses more on the finished product. It is a poetry - yet in Chinese, there are the distinction between ‘詩’ and ‘歌’. Even though it’s not the literature history should not be compared, the ‘musical quality’ should not be lost through translation.

Susan Bassnett: It is a sustaining thought: translation is inevitable, all translations are originals and all originals are translations.

Translation is inferior to the original writing? The recent ‘creative turn’ in translation studies has challenged notions of translation as a derivative and uncreative activity which is inferior to ‘original’ writing. Commentators have drawn attention to the creative processes involved in the translation of texts, and suggested a rethinking of translation as a form of creative writing. Hence there is growing critical and theoretical interest in translations undertaken by literary authors. https://www.tinhouse.com/blog/4204/recreate-or-re-create-creativity-and-translation.html p.2 translating literature ‘Intricate Pathways:’ ‘many distinguished translators have explored and sought to elucidate the difference between creating an original text and creating a translation.’ Qian Zhongshu (1995: 257) in his book Collection of Prose by Qian Zhongshu,recalls his experience when reading the translation by Lin Shu, the eminent literary translator in the end of the Qing Dynasty, as preferring the translation to the original (the original Chinese reads 我发现自己宁可读林纾的译文, 不乐意读哈葛特的原文). This is proof positive that the translation can in some sense surpass the original with the translator's creative rewriting skill for the translated version has now gained a life of its own. Fry ‘All we have are words’.

Walter Benjamin p.75 The translator’s task - translated by Steven Rendall And we never get beyond this, so long as translation claims to serve the reader. However, if translation were intended for the reader, then the original would also have to be intended for the reader. If the original is not created for the reader’s sake, the how can this relationship allow us to understand translation? Even the original may not be intended for the reader,

Literature review perhaps! Anthony Pym in his essay eloquently argued that the translator as ‘non-author’. Then who are the translator when they are translating poetry, and when they finished translating, what are their relationship with the text When Lawrence Venuti is promoting the visibility of translator and Susan Bassnett argues translator as write in support with recreation in the literary translation (taking a creative turn), Pym suggests the translator as non-author

https://www.tinhouse.com/blog/4204/recreate-or-re-create-creativity-and-translation.html


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because ‘the original is not writing for a reader and the translation should not be written with a reader in mind’ and Benjamin claims the

Introduction (2500 words) Lit review (3000 words) Methodology (1000 words) Analysis (3000 words) Discussion (4000 words) Conclusion (1500 words) total = 15000 words Introduction x (deleted) How do we construct Li Ch’ing-chao in English? Englishing Li Ch’ing-chao ‘with his British collaborator in order to create a young Frankenstein, Three Trapped Tigers, a version more than a translation or - as all translations are - another book.’ Is the translation of Li Ch’ing-chao a version of the original or is

The thesis aims to study the differences between translated poems and learn from the translators by evaluating their translations. It is going to be a case study on the English translation of the Tz’u by Li Ch’ing-chao (李清照) from the Song Dynasty. Through contrasting the differences (and similarities) in the three different translations, it shows different translators would have different priority in making translation decision, and they all have a different answers to the question, ‘can one translate a poem?’.

studying the different versions of translation → is it a translation or is it an original or completely irrelevant It is a sustaining thought: translation is inevitable, all translations are originals and all originals are translations. → this is true, only under the Translation as a version or Translation as the original Gain or Loss, Alive or Dead, Original or subversion of original → the only way to make Li Ch’ing-chao lives again is to set it alive again, through translating and translating and make the translation become the ‘original’ even though the notion of ‘original’ is rather problematic. explore the notion of translating creatively see if they can still be faithful to the original and What is the translator’s task when they are translating poetry?

Anthony Pym in his essay eloquently argued that the translator as ‘non-author’. Then who are the translator when they are translating poetry, and when they finished translating, what are their relationship with the text When Lawrence Venuti is promoting the visibility of translator and Susan Bassnett argues translator as write in support with recreation in the literary translation (taking a creative turn), Pym suggests the translator as non-author because ‘the original is not writing for a reader and the translation should not be written with a reader in mind’ and Benjamin claims the Translator is not writing

what the actual practise V.S. the academic debate First artwork , later criticism

p.75 The translator’s task - translated by Steven Rendall


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And we never get beyond this, so long as translation claims to serve the reader. However, if translation were intended for the reader, then the original would also have to be intended for the reader. If the original is not created for the reader’s sake, the how can this relationship allow us to understand translation? Even the original may not be intended for the reader,

Translating, Rewriting, or Recreating? Reimagining the voice of Li Ch’ing-chao. What is Li Ch’ing-chao to us now? after being translated again and again. Reimagining the voice of Li Ch’ing-chao: how poetry translation is a process of re-creation? → a study of translating from implicit to explicit Who decides the voice of Li C’hing-chao ‘All we have are words’. The main purpose of this thesis is to explore the intricate relationship between translation and creative writing through studying the translated poetry and the original poetry. By comparing different version of translations of the same poetry by Li Ch’ing-chao, as an aspect of languages to capture poetics and When we are asking ourselves how should we translate poetry in order to capture the nuances of emotions from one language in another When one considers the writing system of the Chinese language, the cultural and the tradition in Chinese literary history, translating from Classical Chinese into English language seems impossible. Due to the distance between the East and West, the methods different translators came up in the past to bridge between the two cultures are therefore providing a scope to study the difference. The different translations of the same poem could tell us more about towards a hybridisation of Poetics - Chinese and English As translators can pretty much agree a translation is good (a translated text), they may not be able to come to consensus about how to achieve such translation. [i.e. disagree on the explanation about how to come up with the translation] Hypothesis:


(John Balcom 2006: 119) 1) when John Balcom highlights the question, _____ not only that is the problem for translating modern Chinese literature, it is even more problematic when it comes to translating Classical Chinese poetry. 2) since it is more or less justified by a few writers (in lit review?) like Raffel, saying it’s only possible to re-create the poetry, using poetry to translate poetry 3) we came to the same question asked by Lefevere ‘is this the same poem?’ Lefevere provides a framework for comparing 4) at the conclusion of the thesis, it is not going to prescribe the best solution for poetry translation, but more like through the discussion in the paper, we can evaluate what has been translated and what images they have created for Li Ch’ing-chao, thus translators in the future, should anyone is going to attempt to translate Li’s again could use the findings of this paper as guidelines. see if it works. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Intro (aim at 1500 - 2000 words) linking the spectrum - Translator-author-writer ultimately gives us some insights re creativity


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AIM: what the hell is the thesis about? Context: a lot of translations, are they the same poems? from a pure English reader point of view no ‘perfect’ version. Can’t find one ‘replace’ the original. But if we are not ‘replacing’ what is the point of having these ‘rewriting’ or even, ‘recreation’? Structure of the thesis

literature is reviewed to show set out the conceptual framework for analysis - outline how this ‘research is being conducted’, sections of what-so-ever hypothesis the actual analysis conclusion - here link back to what the thesis is trying to explore ------------------------------------------------------- When one poem has been translated many times, what does it bring to the The same poem may have more than one translation, and usually there is no ‘official’ translation of one poem. how can we explain the discrepancy? p.174 (translating for Chinese from Chinese to CHinese) ------------------------------------------------------ Comparing the different versions of the poems - justify why Tzu not Shih -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Context/reality/Phenomenon When we look at the translation of poetry, no two translators could come up with the same translation. This is Qian Zhongshu (1995: 257) in his book Collection of Prose by Qian Zhongshu,recalls his experience when reading the translation by Lin Shu, the eminent literary translator in the end of the Qing Dynasty, as preferring the translation to the original (the original Chinese reads 我发现自己宁可读林纾的译文, 不乐意读哈葛特的原文). This is proof positive that the translation can in some sense surpass the original with the translator's creative rewriting skill for the translated version has now gained a life of its own. Translation is inferior to the original writing? The recent ‘creative turn’ in translation studies has challenged notions of translation as a derivative and uncreative activity which is inferior to ‘original’ writing. Commentators have drawn attention to the creative processes involved in the translation of texts, and suggested a rethinking of translation as a form of creative writing. Hence there is growing critical and theoretical interest in translations undertaken by literary authors. https://www.tinhouse.com/blog/4204/recreate-or-re-create-creativity-and-translation.html p.2 translating literature ‘Intricate Pathways:’ ‘many distinguished translators have explored and sought to elucidate the difference between creating an original text and creating a translation.’ Questions in mind??? What is poetry translation? → what is the task for translators when translating poetry? → re-examine a series of translation theories, as every theory stems from literary translation → reflect on the criteria of evaluating poetry translation, whether it is a successful translation or not? success = becoming a literature on its own → the difficulties of translating Chinese (implicit) to English (explicit) →

• ‘A successfully translated poem is always another poem.’ • What are the difficulties from translating implicit to explicit? • What do we leave behind when failing to translate a Chinese dead metaphor? • what is the point of translating poetry? A study of the functions of poetry translation. • Who do you think you can translate? can the translation done by Xu Yuanchong be counted as the literature

or

https://www.tinhouse.com/blog/4204/recreate-or-re-create-creativity-and-translation.html


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What to do for the actual Analysis/Case Study 1→ on translating emotions 2→ on translating the sounds/ phonology 3→ on translating the imagery 2&3 actually constituate to form the emotions Product-oriented models of translation Involves analysis of (part of) one target text – or comparative analysis of several target texts (e.g. re-translations, translations produced under different circumstances, etc.) – with reference to the applicability of a particular theoretical model. Theoretical models e.g. shifts

Why am I doing this Thesis? Translation compensation: this is what everyone has been doing → Vincent Venuti’s translator’s invisibility??? ***) re-examine the role of translators during poetry translation. 1)When reading a English translated poem, frequently I have to guess what is that poem in Chinese source text. Most of the time I have that ‘Ah-ha’ moment, surprised by how different it sounds in English, providing I have learnt the Chinese poem by heart. If the poem in English that is so different, can we still claim they are the ‘same poem’? This leads to the study of the nature and philosophy of translation. ‘Are we meaning the same’? 2) Translator’s role in translating poetry. Is he the translator trying to be faithful to the author (who is likely to be dead and no one knows what s/he thought 1000 years ago…), or is he the writer himself? This leads to the definition of translation and transcreation. 3) Translation criticism. Through studying different versions of the translated poetry… cover a period of 80 years, from Bing Xin to Xu to Rexroth. Compare different strategies used in translating ‘culturally bound’ terms… be it culturally speaking or linguistically speaking. (no cultural equivalence and linguistic equivalence) → may end up just doing a criticism on ONE translated version. Like the paper by Xavier Lin. 4) if translation process is a process of creation (with creativity), would translation theories help? Xu has proposed quite a lot of theories re poetry translation. 5) through Translation as a culture studies → since we would never be able to overcome the cultural boundary between the East and the West, therefore through translation we can learn more about one another.

Literature Review (16.4.14)

LITERATURE REVIEW (3000 words) Lit Review::: Starting from against his contemporaries in the 60s, which either argue poetry is untranslatable, or completely sets off from the original, like a Frankenstein, (e.g. Erza Pound) hence, James restricts the notion of MP by the relationship between MP:P. The translatability of poetry - a plea to focus on the growth The controversies about the translatability of poetry are all based on the notion of ‘equivalence’: many different views and methods or models/theories were proposed. People argue and argue over the same issues but never agree with one another (Pym). Holmes stated ‘those concerned primarily with verse translation are inclined to despair of any such thing In face what Holmes was trying to answer, is through suggesting a different notion of ‘equivalence’, not measuring the metapoem with the ‘stick of the original’.

No it couldn’t translated - bullshit, since it’s inevitable Yes it is translated, when we are looking at the issue with a more Yes we can certainly re-create something as good, and it will live its afterlife No can’t translate but only recreate


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the answer to translatability is forced into a binary system too: yes it is translatable and no it is not translatable. It is inevitable to have translation. Intro - what is the main/fundamental issues of translatability of poetry 500 context of translating Chinese poetry? When translation become a discipline in academic studies, there is a tendency to fall into the binary categorisation, ‘which operate with rigid dividing-lines, binary opposites, antitheses and dichotomies’ (Snell-Hornby, XXXX: 450). However on a practical level when one is translating poetry, besides choosing between Englishing Li Ch’ing-chao, or forcing the reader to read a literal word-to-word rendering of Li’s poem, are there are third way/approach of retelling the what was sung by Li Ch’ing-chao around a thousand year ago? (Towards a hybridization of translating Classical Chinese poetry). it is very seldom for one to use only one technique but usually a mixture of blend. ‘(3) Translation studies has been hampered by classical modes of categorisation, which operate with rigid dividing-lines, binary opposites, antitheses and dichotomies. Frequently these are mere academic constructs which paralyse the finer differentiation required in all aspects of translation studies. In our approach the typology is replaced by the prototypology, admitting blends and blurred edges, and the dichotomy gives way to the concept of a spectrum or cline against which phenomena are situated and focussed.’ p.450 Mary Snell-Hornby Taking a step further from Snell-Hornby’s third hypothesis, this paper will like to demonstrate Translation: The focus of the growth of literary knowledge p.7 in 1978, Andre Lefevere tested the following hypothesis: that translation, as a metaliterary discipline, is better suited to make literary products accessible, and can claim a higher degree of scientificity, than the other metaliterary activity, commentary.

Some general problems in translating poetry How to explain the discrepancies of the many version hence lead onto the study of the Some specific problems we face when translating Chinese Poetry problems created by translating from Chinese into English How we view reality is rather different, [not that we veiw the reality differently, but how we express what we see may be differently?]’ from the language and cultural perspective → nature of Chinese contrasting with English → punctuation → plurals → terms do all these discrepancies suggest a different ‘reality’? if using the proposition of James Holmes as a standard/measure for good poetry translation, it may become problematic → should allow creativity and subjectivity??? ejuculation of prejudice…

in search of the pure language, this is more like mind reading, when human do not need to use verbal communication

METHODOLOGY (1500 words) To gather the data, I have chosen four translations on Li Ching-chao’s Sheng Sheng Man. It was written in Song dynasty in the poetry form tz’u (詞), which was a form differs from the shih (詩). differences between Shih and Tzu Look at the form of the metapoem Text analysis - highlighting features CHAPTER I: (2500 words)

INTRODUCTION AND HYPOTHESES This chapter introduces the idea of the research, how it arose, the main concepts framing the theoretical approach to the


12

analysis and the methodology and attempts to give an account of terrorism as a subject itself. CHAPTER II: (2000 words) METHODOLOGY This chapter summarises the methodology and the approach used in the research along with the gathered data. CHAPTER III: (3000 words) THE THEORETICAL FRAMEWORK / Literature review This Chapter discusses the basic concepts on which this research is based in two different parts, according to the form of the hypothesis. CHAPTER IV: (6500 words) THE ANALYSIS CHAPTER V: (1000 words) CONCLUSIONS AND FINAL THOUGHTS

p.76 - 77 ‘Translation as (sub)version’ The history and trend of translating Chinese poetry into English - very briefly There are 5 / 6 directions of studying the issues of translating poetry, namely, different schools of translating CHINESE poetry into English, highlights problems emerged what is translation and creativity Translator’s responsibility in translating poetry http://hantown.bokee.com/1115313.html Define what is Ci?

literature review structure: review the history of translation theories on poetry translation For around two-thousand years w Xu and his theories in particular? David Bellos: Is that a fish in your ear? Xia: Translation Compensation Raffel: Translator’s responsibility Looking at how translation Chinese Poetry into English is Translating UP, whilst it should be more equal????

Analysis Structure linguistic: Gender, plural, tenses, punctuation Culturally inequivalence: pipa → Guitar

p.94 3.2, But obviously translation is multi-dimensional; moreover, it’s manifold dimensions and levels are interwoven and reinforce each other, and therefore its full description can only be achieved by weighing the findings concerning its various levels. Gideon Toury The Nature and Role of norms in literary translation p.97 but at least one thing is now clear in view of the major role that norms play in translation, namely that an appropriate position should be assigned to them in translation theory as well.

http://hantown.bokee.com/1115313.html


13

Translation: The focus of the growth of literary knowledge p.7 in 1978, Andre Lefevere tested the following hypothesis: that translation, as a metaliterary discipline, is better suited to make literary products accessible, and can claim a higher degree of scientificity, than the other metaliterary activity, commentary. p.19 the third main concept to be introduced is that of metalanguage: if we want to speak about the correspondence of a statement to a fact, we need a metalanguage in which we can state the fact (or the alleged fact) about which the statement in question speaks, and in addition can also speak about the statement in question’ (Popper 1972:46). I now propose to introduce the following distinction which may, I hope, serve to clarify the way we speak about literature. I would like to reserve the term ‘literature’ for the non-scientific discipline that produces literary works. The term ‘ metaliterature’ will, from now on, be used in this paper to refer to the discipline which makes statements about ‘literature’. There is no reason why this discipline could not aspire to the scientific. Metalanguage, as we have seen, speaks about both statement and fact. p.20

--------------------------------------------------------------- When you should annotate? → like when you are doing maths, you have to show how you come up with the answer. → it’s good because you can learn about the theories and shut people up when you are at work. → when it is not immediately direct; probably a good idea to talk about it. but avoid ‘so-what’ idea. The chosen solution therefore reduces the SL title to sense, at the expense of evoked meaning. This represents a translation loss, defined by Hervey and Higgins [1992:24] as ‘ any failure to replicate a ST exactly, whether this involves losing features in the TT or adding them.’ translation loss is something that Hervey and Higgins regard as inevitable: ‘Once one accepts the concept of inevitable translation loss, a TT that is not, in all important respects, a replica of its ST is not a theoretical anomaly...the translator can concentrate on the realistic aim of cutting down on translation loss, rather than unrealistic one of seeking the ultimate translation of the ST.’ http://www.xinghui.com/big5/yilin/duiyizhejieru.htm New ideas on Translator’s interposition

Literary Translation: A Practical Guide, Clifford E. Landers. ‘Some notes on translating poetry’ p.97 Clement Wood, editor of The complete Rhyming Dictionary, has stated flatly, ‘Poetry cannot be translated; it can only be recreated in the new language.’ This suggests another criterion for juding a translation solely on the basis of its target language: a mastery of stylistic and grammatical standards must be supported by a familiarity with idiomatic usage. Theories behind translating poetry: Xu Yuanchong: The art of translation

Whether by virtue of an imposed pattern, as in Le Roman de Renart, or dynamic tension, as in Rimbaud, or the four-dimensional complexities of Mallarme, the language of poetry will always be farther from that of normal speech than even the most elaborate prose. It is more formal, more artificial, and more precise. The translator, inevitable accustomed to hearing that his project is impossible, may find, in fact, that poetry, by its very eccentricity, presents itself as a series of discrete problems to which there seem to be, however temporarily, solutions. Words long sought may suddenly fit themselves into places like pieces of a puzzle, and ultimately one may feel that a translation is ‘finished’ because to change any part of it would mean changing the whole. The more complex the project, the more this has to be true. Even if one is seeking a unicorn or the Questing Beast, it has, or will assume, a shape in the mind where, accordingly, it will be, once found, joyfully recognised. p.65-66 Patricia Terry ‘The Invisible Difference: Notes on the Translation of Poetry’, Translation

Rethinking on Translating Classical Poetry:

http://www.xinghui.com/big5/yilin/duiyizhejieru.htm


14

Classical Poetry translation has been done a lot of times and nothing more could be added. The case is more like, no, there will not be any re-translation, but just a constant study in the academia about what was good and what was not good about the translated poems. There will never be something called the English Poetry of Li Ch’ing-chao. If a translator is being creative, does that imply that he or she is being unfaithful to the author and his or her work? John Balcom p.117 The Translator as Writer

In the introduction of the book by Susan Bassnett outline one of the most fundamental questions for literary translation. S Bassnett explains Borges has ‘questioned the notions of distinctiveness of original and copy, or of writer and translator’. p.2 it has often been argued that there is no such thing as a ‘perfect’ translation. the ORGANIC image contrasts with the negative rhetoric of accusations of betrayal One of the most frequently asked questions in literary translation is the Bassnett outlines one of the most important questions in literary translation,

Xavier Lin: then translation is no longer about looking for the solution; rather it is about creating solutions. Western Translator tends to create? Chinese Translator tends to Is it a translation? or just re-writing the entire poem? Good thesis = a good set-off point serves as a pilot for more extensive study + strong and interesting, preferably original, argument (thesis). Case studies example: 1） very Chinese influenced 2) very much westernised 3) Read like English but retain the Chinese flavour

Flow: 1) historical debate of ‘equivalence’ in Translation. very likely Stemming from literary translation [insert proof] (Baker’s In Other Words) + (Pym’s Exploring Translation Theories) 2) No absolute equivalence, hence different approaches in translating Poetry [quoting arguments in academia: Thinking Chinese Translation/ 英漢比較翻譯教程] 3) Translation theory and historical movement in China (link to Poetry/ Literary Translation) 4) Translator’s role in translating Poetry, how to use translation compensation → Raffel → Xu Zhongyuan → Other various???? The problem of untranslatability and ‘the Sapir-Whorf hypothesis’ Bellos: p.168 he proved how flawed the hypothesis is using the NASA examples (155); yet a more sophisticated version of the same question: some thing in French, can never be expressed in English, and vice versa. ‘Thinking in French’ (proved: different personality by speaking different languages) Xia: p.31 the untranslatability is in fact linked to the study of translation compensation. It is just how you look at the issue and see how to compensate for it. A study on Translation Compensation

Evaluation of the translated poems: Jeremy Munday: Evaluation in Translation: Critical points of translator decision-making

*The reader-author relationship


15

The definition of ‘Poetry’ It is a literary form in most of the cultures. Yet the definition of poetry is different from one culture to another. [perhaps an OED definition] i) Raffel: no similar literary history, suggesting the literary genres are different from cultures to cultures. iia) Chinese word for 詩歌，詩詞， from [chapter 5 p.453 漢英比較] iib) further discussion about 意境 suggesting the word 試 shouldn’t be translated as ‘poem’ iic) the different genres of Chinese poetry should probably be treated differently (e.g. 詩經，古詩，唐詩，宋詞，元

曲，現代詩) → 《中國審美文化史》唐宋卷陳炎 p.385 iid) the focus on ‘詞’ and ‘詩’; and probably why it shouldn’t be translated using the same tactics? iii) English poetry, and what is it to English native reader, from an English perspective

The history of translating Chinese Poetry - relating to the development of translation theories *形音意（xing yin yi) the theory of 3 beauties -_- what a name... *http://www.translationdirectory.com/articles/article2062.php the issue of direction of translation in China: a Historical overview The History of translating Li Ch’ing-chao http://www.sinoss.net/uploadfile/2012/0611/20120611043752101.pdf

What is Transcreation? About Transcreation or Recreation in translation when translating poetry p.33-34 translation and creativity: Perspectives on creative writing and translation studies ‘if translation is necessarily a fiction, then it must go out to meet its fictionality.’ p.1 The translator as writer ‘choosing the next symphony concert to go to, the names of the composers, conductor and orchestra will be key to whether we buy the tickets.’ http://www.soas.ac.uk/literatures/satranslations/Gopin.pdf Sujeet Mukherji (1981) prefers to call it ‘Translation as New writing’. But ‘Transcreation’ seems to be a better word to express this literary tradition of India. Transcreation can offer the best possible solution for the problems of culturally oriented literary texts. Transcreation in this context can be understood as a rebirth or incarnation (Avatar) of the original work. In a general sense, it can be defined as an aesthetic re-interpretation of the original work suited to the readers/audience of the target language in the particular time and space. This re-interpretation is done with a certain social purpose and is performed with suitable interpolations, explanations, expansions, summarising and aesthetic innovations in style and techniques.

Thinking Chinese Translation, ch. 13 Translation of traditional poetry[Valerie Pellatt] p.154 ‘Translation is at the heart of literary experience [...] would modern English poetry be what it is without Cathy, the translations of Chinese which Ezra Pound published in 1915?’ Xu: says that ‘the point is how to make what is beautiful in one language appear as beautiful in another’. Pellatt: But this is not the whole story!!!!! → a lot of the poems are not to do with beauty. I: Well beauty in terms of language. Not about the content??? poems of Pound’s Cathay → verge on transcreation or recreation rather than strict translation p.156 More tricky from Chinese into English: From implicit to Explicit (Pan) Pan: ‘recreation is not only attractive but, on many occasions, necessary’ when working from Chinese to English (pan 2002: 59). Pan concentrates on ‘mistranslation’ → but what the HELL is mistranslation??? It’s just ‘untranslatability’! e.g. in Chinese it’s meant to be implicit (Hannah: yeah it’s two….dogs); who cares if you are talking to the dog, or whether the dogs are what genders...etc Wenguo Pan Singular or Plural? A Case Study of the Difficulty and Charm in Rendering Chinese Poems into English

http://www.translationdirectory.com/articles/article2062.php

http://www.sinoss.net/uploadfile/2012/0611/20120611043752101.pdf

http://www.soas.ac.uk/literatures/satranslations/Gopin.pdf


16

http://www.llc.manchester.ac.uk/ctis/activities/papers/

Pictorial elements/quality in Chinese. ‘詩中有畫，畫中有詩’. Chinese characters as a poetic medium → Erza Pound. It is Ecphrastic (Ecphrasis is manifest in Chinese poetry not only through the images the poet creates, but also in the absence of grammatical links. → characters as pictures are not quite valid: as a Chinese person, when I heard the word 馬, i would not visualise the character itself but instead a picture of horse, even though the character looks like a horse… Plus poetry are sung/recited more than read. Pallett: above all, translators need to avoid McGonagallism. Yet i do find Xu sounds a bit like him… with the rhymes every two sentences…comical effect? Rhyme works differently in English than Chinese? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_McGonagall Find a pilot point to set off, demonstrate why you have done this piece of research.

Creative translation, translating creatively: a case study on aesthetic coherence in Peter Stambler’s Han Shan http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yan_Yu_(poetry_theorist) *an aesthetic coherence in the translated text is an indispensable basis, and explores how this basis may involve creativity in translating. *The notion of Gestalt The translator as writer p.134 ‘To make a work of literature in Chinese language come to life in English is a complex process that involves a scholar’s knowledge of Chinese language and culture as well as a profound knowledge of an creative flair in English.’ John Balcom A Study on Translation Compensation p.189 the theory from the western translators are focusing more on linguistics but not the aesthetic p.243 culturally bound items and concepts in Chinese poetry translated into English Books that I am going to Review:

• In others words • Thinking Chinese Translation, ch. 13 • 英漢比較翻譯教程, Ch. 5 Poetry • The translator as Writer • The art of translating poetry • exploring translation theories • Lawrence Venuti’s translator invisibility • Can theory help translator • a study on translation compensation

CHAPTER I: (1500 words) INTRODUCTION AND HYPOTHESES This chapter introduces the idea of the research, how it arose, the main concepts framing the theoretical approach to the analysis and the methodology and attempts to give an account of terrorism as a subject itself. CHAPTER II: (3000 words) METHODOLOGY / Literature review This chapter summarises the methodology and the approach used in the research along with the gathered data. CHAPTER III: (3000 words) THE THEORETICAL FRAMEWORK


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_McGonagall

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yan_Yu_(poetry_theorist)


17

This Chapter discusses the basic concepts on which this research is based in two different parts, according to the form of the hypothesis. CHAPTER IV: (6500 words) THE ANALYSIS CHAPTER V: (1000 words) CONCLUSIONS AND FINAL THOUGHTS Lit Review (16.2.14)

p.76 - 77 ‘Translation as (sub)version’ The history and trend of translating Chinese poetry into English - very briefly There are 5 / 6 directions of studying the issues of translating poetry, namely, different schools of translating CHINESE poetry into English, highlights problems emerged what is translation and creativity Translator’s responsibility in translating poetry http://hantown.bokee.com/1115313.html Define what is Ci?

literature review structure: review the history of translation theories on poetry translation For around two-thousand years w Xu and his theories in particular? David Bellos: Is that a fish in your ear? Xia: Translation Compensation Raffel: Translator’s responsibility Looking at how translation Chinese Poetry into English is Translating UP, whilst it should be more equal????

Analysis Structure linguistic: Gender, plural, tenses, punctuation Culturally inequivalence: pipa → Guitar

p.94 3.2, But obviously translation is multi-dimensional; moreover, it’s manifold dimensions and levels are interwoven and reinforce each other, and therefore its full description can only be achieved by weighing the findings concerning its various levels. Gideon Toury The Nature and Role of norms in literary translation p.97 but at least one thing is now clear in view of the major role that norms play in translation, namely that an appropriate position should be assigned to them in translation theory as well.

Translation: The focus of the growth of literary knowledge p.7 in 1978, Andre Lefevere tested the following hypothesis: that translation, as a metaliterary discipline, is better suited to make literary products accessible, and can claim a higher degree of scientificity, than the other metaliterary activity, commentary. p.19



18

the third main concept to be introduced is that of metalanguage: if we want to speak about the correspondence of a statement to a fact, we need a metalanguage in which we can state the fact (or the alleged fact) about which the statement in question speaks, and in addition can also speak about the statement in question’ (Popper 1972:46). I now propose to introduce the following distinction which may, I hope, serve to clarify the way we speak about literature. I would like to reserve the term ‘literature’ for the non-scientific discipline that produces literary works. The term ‘ metaliterature’ will, from now on, be used in this paper to refer to the discipline which makes statements about ‘literature’. There is no reason why this discipline could not aspire to the scientific. Metalanguage, as we have seen, speaks about both statement and fact. p.20

--------------------------------------------------------------- When you should annotate? → like when you are doing maths, you have to show how you come up with the answer. → it’s good because you can learn about the theories and shut people up when you are at work. → when it is not immediately direct; probably a good idea to talk about it. but avoid ‘so-what’ idea. The chosen solution therefore reduces the SL title to sense, at the expense of evoked meaning. This represents a translation loss, defined by Hervey and Higgins [1992:24] as ‘ any failure to replicate a ST exactly, whether this involves losing features in the TT or adding them.’ translation loss is something that Hervey and Higgins regard as inevitable: ‘Once one accepts the concept of inevitable translation loss, a TT that is not, in all important respects, a replica of its ST is not a theoretical anomaly...the translator can concentrate on the realistic aim of cutting down on translation loss, rather than unrealistic one of seeking the ultimate translation of the ST.’ http://www.xinghui.com/big5/yilin/duiyizhejieru.htm New ideas on Translator’s interposition

Literary Translation: A Practical Guide, Clifford E. Landers. ‘Some notes on translating poetry’ p.97 Clement Wood, editor of The complete Rhyming Dictionary, has stated flatly, ‘Poetry cannot be translated; it can only be recreated in the new language.’ This suggests another criterion for juding a translation solely on the basis of its target language: a mastery of stylistic and grammatical standards must be supported by a familiarity with idiomatic usage. Theories behind translating poetry: Xu Yuanchong: The art of translation

Whether by virtue of an imposed pattern, as in Le Roman de Renart, or dynamic tension, as in Rimbaud, or the four-dimensional complexities of Mallarme, the language of poetry will always be farther from that of normal speech than even the most elaborate prose. It is more formal, more artificial, and more precise. The translator, inevitable accustomed to hearing that his project is impossible, may find, in fact, that poetry, by its very eccentricity, presents itself as a series of discrete problems to which there seem to be, however temporarily, solutions. Words long sought may suddenly fit themselves into places like pieces of a puzzle, and ultimately one may feel that a translation is ‘finished’ because to change any part of it would mean changing the whole. The more complex the project, the more this has to be true. Even if one is seeking a unicorn or the Questing Beast, it has, or will assume, a shape in the mind where, accordingly, it will be, once found, joyfully recognised. p.65-66 Patricia Terry ‘The Invisible Difference: Notes on the Translation of Poetry’, Translation

Rethinking on Translating Classical Poetry: Classical Poetry translation has been done a lot of times and nothing more could be added. The case is more like, no, there will not be any re-translation, but just a constant study in the academia about what was good and what was not good about the translated poems. There will never be something called the English Poetry of Li Ch’ing-chao. If a translator is being creative, does that imply that he or she is being unfaithful to the author and his or her work? John Balcom p.117 The Translator as Writer

http://www.xinghui.com/big5/yilin/duiyizhejieru.htm


19

In the introduction of the book by Susan Bassnett outline one of the most fundamental questions for literary translation. S Bassnett explains Borges has ‘questioned the notions of distinctiveness of original and copy, or of writer and translator’. p.2 it has often been argued that there is no such thing as a ‘perfect’ translation. the ORGANIC image contrasts with the negative rhetoric of accusations of betrayal One of the most frequently asked questions in literary translation is the Bassnett outlines one of the most important questions in literary translation,

Xavier Lin: then translation is no longer about looking for the solution; rather it is about creating solutions. Western Translator tends to create? Chinese Translator tends to Is it a translation? or just re-writing the entire poem? Good thesis = a good set-off point serves as a pilot for more extensive study + strong and interesting, preferably original, argument (thesis). Case studies example: 1） very Chinese influenced 2) very much westernised 3) Read like English but retain the Chinese flavour

Flow: 1) historical debate of ‘equivalence’ in Translation. very likely Stemming from literary translation [insert proof] (Baker’s In Other Words) + (Pym’s Exploring Translation Theories) 2) No absolute equivalence, hence different approaches in translating Poetry [quoting arguments in academia: Thinking Chinese Translation/ 英漢比較翻譯教程] 3) Translation theory and historical movement in China (link to Poetry/ Literary Translation) 4) Translator’s role in translating Poetry, how to use translation compensation → Raffel → Xu Zhongyuan → Other various???? The problem of untranslatability and ‘the Sapir-Whorf hypothesis’ Bellos: p.168 he proved how flawed the hypothesis is using the NASA examples (155); yet a more sophisticated version of the same question: some thing in French, can never be expressed in English, and vice versa. ‘Thinking in French’ (proved: different personality by speaking different languages) Xia: p.31 the untranslatability is in fact linked to the study of translation compensation. It is just how you look at the issue and see how to compensate for it. A study on Translation Compensation

Evaluation of the translated poems: Jeremy Munday: Evaluation in Translation: Critical points of translator decision-making

*The reader-author relationship The definition of ‘Poetry’ It is a literary form in most of the cultures. Yet the definition of poetry is different from one culture to another. [perhaps an OED definition] i) Raffel: no similar literary history, suggesting the literary genres are different from cultures to cultures. iia) Chinese word for 詩歌，詩詞， from [chapter 5 p.453 漢英比較] iib) further discussion about 意境 suggesting the word 試 shouldn’t be translated as ‘poem’


20

iic) the different genres of Chinese poetry should probably be treated differently (e.g. 詩經，古詩，唐詩，宋詞，元

曲，現代詩) → 《中國審美文化史》唐宋卷陳炎 p.385 iid) the focus on ‘詞’ and ‘詩’; and probably why it shouldn’t be translated using the same tactics? iii) English poetry, and what is it to English native reader, from an English perspective

The history of translating Chinese Poetry - relating to the development of translation theories *形音意（xing yin yi) the theory of 3 beauties -_- what a name... *http://www.translationdirectory.com/articles/article2062.php the issue of direction of translation in China: a Historical overview The History of translating Li Ch’ing-chao http://www.sinoss.net/uploadfile/2012/0611/20120611043752101.pdf

What is Transcreation? About Transcreation or Recreation in translation when translating poetry p.33-34 translation and creativity: Perspectives on creative writing and translation studies ‘if translation is necessarily a fiction, then it must go out to meet its fictionality.’ p.1 The translator as writer ‘choosing the next symphony concert to go to, the names of the composers, conductor and orchestra will be key to whether we buy the tickets.’ http://www.soas.ac.uk/literatures/satranslations/Gopin.pdf Sujeet Mukherji (1981) prefers to call it ‘Translation as New writing’. But ‘Transcreation’ seems to be a better word to express this literary tradition of India. Transcreation can offer the best possible solution for the problems of culturally oriented literary texts. Transcreation in this context can be understood as a rebirth or incarnation (Avatar) of the original work. In a general sense, it can be defined as an aesthetic re-interpretation of the original work suited to the readers/audience of the target language in the particular time and space. This re-interpretation is done with a certain social purpose and is performed with suitable interpolations, explanations, expansions, summarising and aesthetic innovations in style and techniques.

Thinking Chinese Translation, ch. 13 Translation of traditional poetry[Valerie Pellatt] p.154 ‘Translation is at the heart of literary experience [...] would modern English poetry be what it is without Cathy, the translations of Chinese which Ezra Pound published in 1915?’ Xu: says that ‘the point is how to make what is beautiful in one language appear as beautiful in another’. Pellatt: But this is not the whole story!!!!! → a lot of the poems are not to do with beauty. I: Well beauty in terms of language. Not about the content??? poems of Pound’s Cathay → verge on transcreation or recreation rather than strict translation p.156 More tricky from Chinese into English: From implicit to Explicit (Pan) Pan: ‘recreation is not only attractive but, on many occasions, necessary’ when working from Chinese to English (pan 2002: 59). Pan concentrates on ‘mistranslation’ → but what the HELL is mistranslation??? It’s just ‘untranslatability’! e.g. in Chinese it’s meant to be implicit (Hannah: yeah it’s two….dogs); who cares if you are talking to the dog, or whether the dogs are what genders...etc Wenguo Pan Singular or Plural? A Case Study of the Difficulty and Charm in Rendering Chinese Poems into English http://www.llc.manchester.ac.uk/ctis/activities/papers/

Pictorial elements/quality in Chinese. ‘詩中有畫，畫中有詩’. Chinese characters as a poetic medium → Erza Pound. It is Ecphrastic (Ecphrasis is manifest in Chinese poetry not only through the images the poet creates, but also in the absence of grammatical links.

http://www.translationdirectory.com/articles/article2062.php

http://www.sinoss.net/uploadfile/2012/0611/20120611043752101.pdf

http://www.soas.ac.uk/literatures/satranslations/Gopin.pdf



21

→ characters as pictures are not quite valid: as a Chinese person, when I heard the word 馬, i would not visualise the character itself but instead a picture of horse, even though the character looks like a horse… Plus poetry are sung/recited more than read. Pallett: above all, translators need to avoid McGonagallism. Yet i do find Xu sounds a bit like him… with the rhymes every two sentences…comical effect? Rhyme works differently in English than Chinese? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_McGonagall Find a pilot point to set off, demonstrate why you have done this piece of research.

Creative translation, translating creatively: a case study on aesthetic coherence in Peter Stambler’s Han Shan http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yan_Yu_(poetry_theorist) *an aesthetic coherence in the translated text is an indispensable basis, and explores how this basis may involve creativity in translating. *The notion of Gestalt The translator as writer p.134 ‘To make a work of literature in Chinese language come to life in English is a complex process that involves a scholar’s knowledge of Chinese language and culture as well as a profound knowledge of an creative flair in English.’ John Balcom A Study on Translation Compensation p.189 the theory from the western translators are focusing more on linguistics but not the aesthetic p.243 culturally bound items and concepts in Chinese poetry translated into English Notes 18-3-14

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=d3Ys4WfDIf0C&q=bassnett#v=snippet&q=bassnett&f=false p.113 A variant on the case study involves the detailed comparison of existing translations, rather than the production of a new piece of translation work. This type of research will also include notes and commentary. Often such research involves the study of translations that have been made at different points in times, so the weighting is likely to be towards the commentary, with the translations used as illustrative material. p.117 The old hierarchies are dismissed and the translation, as Walter Benjamin so beautifully tells us, gives life to texts that otherwise would have rotted away into oblivion. Planet words - forward by Stephen Fry But next time you speak or write, do not try to work out what is going on socially, culturally, neurally, intellectually or physiologically. This effort is beyond us all and you might just explode. Instead...celebrate. Words are all we have. Certainly, reader, words are all we have, you and I, as you sit with this book or reading device in front of you and I sit and tap at my keyboard. You have no idea where i am as I do this, and I have no idea who, where or what you are as you cotinue to read. We are connected by a filament of language that stretches from somewhere inside my brain to somewhere inside yours. There are so many cognitive and cerebral processes involved simply in the act of my writing and your reading these words that not all the massed ranks of biology, genetics, linguistics, neurology, computational science or philosophy can properly describ, let alone understand or explain, how it all works.

Miss Cui Takes a Hermeneutic Turn Richard Trappl has pointed out that translations from the Chinese in particular are part of the history of sciences in that they

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_McGonagall

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yan_Yu_(poetry_theorist)

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=d3Ys4WfDIf0C&q=bassnett#v=snippet&q=bassnett&f=false


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Reflect viewpoints, theories, paradigms and aesthetic perspectives of the era in which they were written. They selectively and structurally influence the multi-layered process of intercultural communication, often guilty of misinterpretation and distortion, but always a necessary medium for the reflection of self and other between cultures and people. Although we all might very well wish for a pre-Babelic rendition of the tale, the many translational interpretations of ‘Yingying Zhuan’ invite the open-minded reader to reflect on cultural and literary norms and human possibilities far beyond the source text. Of course, had Scholar Zhang been more careful in his youthful passion, we would not have to ponder the question of how to treat each other properly and respectfully, then and now, and here and there. As it is, however, his mistake and its amendment give all of us a hermeneutic turn at meaning construction and deconstruction twelve hundred years later, and Miss Cui might spin in the hermeneutic circle for a while yet. Introducing translation studies: Theories and Applications, Jeremy Munday p.253 According to Benjamin, what translation does is to ‘express the central reciprocal relationship between languages’. It reveals inherent relationships which are present but which remain hidden without translation. It does this not by seeking to be the same as the original but by ‘harmonising’ or bringing together the two different languages. In this expansive and creative way, translation both contributes to the growth of its own language (by the appearance in the TL of the new text) and pursues the goal of a ‘pure’ and higher language. This ‘pure language’ is released by the co-existence and complementation of the translation with the original. The strategy to achieve this is through a ‘literal rendering’ which allows the ‘pure language’ to shine through: ‘by a literal rendering of the syntax which proves words rather than sentences to be the primary element of the translator’. → test this claim ‘achieve this is through a ‘literal rendering’? really? how about translating from Classical Chinese into English? The capacity to release this ‘pure’ language is singular to translation: It is the task of the translator to release in his own language that pure language which is under the spell of another, to liberate the language imprisoned in a work in his re-creation of that work. For Benjamin, liberation only occurs if the translator allows the TL to be ‘powerfully affected by the foreign tongue’. Literalness of syntax and the freedom of pure language come together in interlinear translation. That is, a word-for-word Target Language gloss inserted above the words of the original. The ‘ideal’ translation, in Benjamin’s opinion is an interlinear version of the Bible which allows the divine Word to appear. Support the idea of foreignisation.

Translated! Papers on Literary Translation and Translation studies p24 there is a graph explaining what is poem and Metapoem p.49 a graph explaining historicising-modernising, re-creative-retentive, exoticising-naturalising

http://hantown.bokee.com/1115313.html 李清照《声声慢》最重要的语言特征是"全用赋体"。朱熹说："赋者，敷陈其事而直言之者也。"全用赋体，就是不

用比喻、典故等修辞手段。那么，从理论上说，这个特点利于表现这首词的风格，而翻译这首词最为关键的问题是

如何表现其情调、意境——个人不可名状而又无法排遣的极度空虚寂寥。声声慢寻寻觅觅，冷冷清清，凄凄惨惨戚戚。乍暖还寒时候，最难将息。三杯两盏淡酒，怎敌他、晚来风急？雁过也，正

伤心，却是旧时相识。满地黄花堆积。憔悴损，如今有谁堪摘？守著窗儿，独自怎生得黑？梧桐更兼细雨，到黄昏、点点滴滴。这次第，

怎一个、愁字了得！从实际操作来说，翻译这首词的第一个要点是：这首词写的是一天（从早到晚），还是黄昏时的心境情绪？其次，

如何表现这首词独特的艺术魅力及其语言风格。第一个问题事关译文的整体，最重要。现存两种版本。它们的不同点就在于：一种为"三杯两盏淡酒，怎敌他、晚

来风急？"；另一种为"三杯两盏淡酒，怎敌他、晓来风急？"前者容易导致译者把原文视为描写"黄昏"或"夜晚"的一

首词。后者更合理。俞平伯《唐宋词选释》注云："晓来"，各本多作"晚来"，殆因下文"黄昏"云云。其实词写一整天，非一晚的事，若

云"晓来风急"，则反而重复。上文"三杯两盏淡酒"是早酒，即《念奴娇》词所谓"扶头酒醒"；下文"雁过也"，即彼

词"征鸿过尽"。



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赵朴初《唐宋词鉴赏辞典》也说"晓来"是"对的"，并提出另外一个理由："‘晓来风急'正与上文‘乍暖还寒'油合"（唐·五代·北宋卷》第 919 页）。其实，词中还可以找到证据，尤其是"这次第"云云。"这次第"，就是这一连串的

情况。 "赋体"即"直言"之体。这对于译者来说是好事。然而，尽管是"直言"，但一味死板地按字面翻译，却未必能传达作

者的意思。翻译这样的古词，当然离不开解释。但仅仅倚赖字面，恐怕难以解释准确。想要表现原文的语言风格，

仅仅做到字面准确更是远远不够。唐宋散文家以散文为赋，像李清照这样的词人却以"慢词"为"赋"。"慢词"具有赋

的铺叙特点，而且蕴藉流利，匀整而富有变化。这首《声声慢》的独创性，还体现在作者用仄声韵且屡用叠字，所

获得的艺术效果，与押平声韵而节奏较舒缓的《声声慢》相比，显得急促，节奏更快；所体现的风格是凄厉，而不

是哀婉。所以，解这首词的专家说："此词以豪放纵恣之笔写激动悲怆之怀，既不婉约，也不隐约，不能列入婉约

体"（赵朴初，《唐·五代·北宋卷》第 919 页）。李清照的这首《声声慢》，是作者南渡之后写出的一首震动词坛的名作。最能反映这首词绝妙之处的是开篇的十四

个叠字。梁启超《中国韵文里头所表现的情感》说："那种茕独栖惶的景况，非本人不能领略；所以一字一泪，都

是咬着牙咽下的。"开篇的十四个字，既有孤独寂寞，又有忧郁，还隐隐透出出主人公内心的动荡不安。开篇十四

个字，是整首词的气氛和意境之所系，也是译者必须面临的第一道难关。要顺利渡过第一道难关，最为关键的是选

词精确而能传神。林语堂在他的"论译诗"一文中说：我译李安的《声声慢》，那"寻寻觅觅，冷冷清清，凄凄惨惨戚戚"十四字，真费思量。须知全阕意思，就在"梧桐

更兼细雨"那种"怎生得黑"的意境。这意境表达，真不容易。所以我用双声方法，译成 so dim, so dark, so dense, so dull, so damp, so dank, so dead 十四字（七字俱用定母）译出，确是黄昏细雨无可奈何孤单的境地，而最后一

字最重，这是译诗的人苦处及乐处，煞费苦心，才可译出（《诗词翻译的艺术》，第 53 页）。译者说自己煞费苦心，自然不错。译者的自我感觉也不错。当然，这样的译文水平，也不一般。翻译这十四个字的

关键首先是选用精确的英语词，去传达原文的意思和意境、气氛。然后才是力图表现原诗的语言风格。林语堂先生

的译文，事实上并非译者想象的那样"理想"。原文的确用的是"叠韵、双声"，但 so dim, so ... 并非"叠韵"，而更像

英诗里的"半谐音"(assonance) 或"头韵"(alliteration)。"双声"一般指："声母相同的两个字或几个字叫双声，例如

‘公共'（gōng gòng）"（《高级汉语词典》）。原文十四个字念起来的声韵效果是单调、急促，而这十四个字所表示的意思是孤寂、百无聊赖的苦闷心情，也就是

这首词的意境。所谓"美"应是指这样的音韵效果，与这十四个字和词的意境很合拍。连用七个 so 和七个 d- 开头的

单音节词，获得的音韵效果甚至显得更单调、沉闷。以音韵效果论，虽然改变了原文叠字的结构，仍是成功的翻译。

美中不足的是，so...的句式使节奏缓慢、滞重，不是原文"蕴藉流利，匀整而富有变化"的节奏效果。这七个形容词

当然像散文，主要问题出之着意去解释，而解释往往使诗（意）丧失，解释又不完全。说诗不可译，就是说经不起

解释性的翻译。原文朴直，刻意阐释往往适得其反。《诗镜总论》指出："诗不患无材，而患材之扬；诗不患无情，

而患情之肆；诗不患无言，而患言之尽；诗不患无景，而患景之烦。知此台可与论雅。" 参考文献辜正坤《中西诗鉴赏与翻译》，长沙：湖南人民出版社，1998。许渊冲 1 许渊冲《中诗英韵探胜》，北京：北京大学出版社，1988。

许渊冲 2 许渊冲英译，张秋红、杨光治今译《汉英对照·文白对照·宋词三百首》，长沙：湖南出版社，1992。

赵朴初《唐宋词鉴赏辞典》，上海：上海辞书出版社，1999。作者简介：穆诗雄（1945-），江西师范大学外语学院教授；研究方向：翻译理论、英美诗歌、诗歌翻译 p.6 literature and Translation: new perspectives in literary studies I hope this colloquium will help us to face up to these problems, which are anything but marginal. Perhaps we shall discover alternative views to replace the everlasting charge of traduttore/traditore. Perhaps we can decide that the traditional distinction between ‘original writier’ and ‘translator’ should be set aside, since a translator can be both poetic and original. Translations can teach us how to transcend disjunctive opinions with regard to literature as a whole. When we manage to clarify our ideas of literary translation, the ill-framed traduttore/traditore may perhsap be restated into traduttore/Scrittore, or traduttore/autore.

When Chinese translate Chinese to Chinese - Russell Maeth, Elcolegio de Me(/)xico Traslation East and West: A cross-cultural approach p.172 In June 1984, Eliot Weinberger, a protege of Nobel laureate Octavio Paz, published a lengthy examination of nineteen translations of a single poem of Wang Wei (c.700-761) in the Mexican magazine Vuelta (no.91) under the title ‘Diecinueve maneras de ver a Wang Wei’ (Nineteen Ways of looking at Wang Wei). There then ensured a brief but heated polemic that centered on the adequacy, both philological and linguistic, of certain detailed features of Weinberger’s analysis. p.176


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Professor David Hawkes of Oxford puts the matter even more succinctly (A Little Primer of Tu Fu, Oxford, 1967, 207): ‘The result of compressing so many mental happenings into so exiguous a form is that the actual wording of the poem becomes a kind of shorthand from which the poet’s full meaning has to be reconstructed. Poetry like this, in short, invites us to share some of the process of composition with the poet.’ To conclude, it would seem that the practice of Chinese translators, of which we have just reviewed five examples, reconfirms these observations, whereas Weinberger’s do’s and don’t’s fail to take account both of the nature of the text and of the genre. Far from constituting an error or a blemish, seeming amplification or reconstruction of the poet’s full meaning is a duty imposed by the very nature of the taks, for, as Robert Carter observes in The Tao and Mother Goose: Of all the forms of verbal expression poetry alone offers the greatest potential for economy: it can transmit the maximum message with the most minimal means. Or, to put it another way, poetry can evoke the greatest inner richness through the greatest outer simplicity. The translator who, beguiled by a poem’s apparent simplicity, ignores its inner richness does so at his own and his reader’s peril.

------------ Chapter 3 Poetics Translation/History/Culture: A sourcebook p.27 1st, the translator must understand to perfection the meaning and the subject matter of the author he translates. 2nd, What was missing What was interpret What was meant to be ambiguous - emptiness

The Undefinitive Translation of Poetry - Anne Born Writing on the problems of translation has any sense at all only if it contributes to our knowledge of the agents which influence the translator’s work and its quality, if it contributes to our knowledge of the way in which the resulting effect on the reader is dependent on the methods chosen by the translator. Jiri Levy Just as no original-language poem can be said ever to be completely finished, to be the definitive version (some poets have driven bibliographers mad by constant revisions in successive editions), a translated poem too is always open to alteration. In fact, even more widely open, for different translators will, as I shall show, produce extremely variant readings.

Translating the Untranslatable - Yann Lovelock The questions will always be open. The untranslatable is the mother of invention. p.210

An Introduction to Literary Chinese Problems of Reading and Understanding (p.1) highlighting the problem of ‘Grammar is not Enough’, one need to consider the context, history +++ to understand literary Chinese fully. (see the diagram) Hence translating into modern English may not work as well.

Translating Emotion: Studies in Translation and Renewal Between Languages p.66 John Kinsella It is as a translator that I write these words and recognise that my own first translations of poets such as Herberto Helder and Emanuel Felix stand at the axis of a long relationship between distinct latitudes and cultures. What can finally be achieved in a sense of dialogue (through translation) is perhaps an intermediate world of unusual juxtapositions, of opposites and yet again a space for creativity. It is in this realm of the human imagination that there emerges a contrast between the authentic and its potential within a landscape of alternative visions, interpretations, associations and connections: a spirit of otherness is both transmitted and even transcended in a journey that can finally share a common axis.


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Jakobson ‘Closing Statement: Linguistics and Poetics’, Style in Language p.350 ‘Poetics deals primarily with the question, what makes a verbal message a work of art?’ poetic function is not the sole function of verbal art but only its dominant, determining function, whereas in all other verbal activities it acts as a subsidiary , accessory constituent.

The particularities of diverse poetic genres imply a differently ranked participation of the other verbal functions along with the dominant poetic function. Epic poetry, focused on the 3rd person, strongly involves the referential function of language; the lyric, oriented toward the first person, is intimately liked with the emotive function; poetry of the second person is imbued with the conative function and is either supplicatory or exhortative, depending on whether the first person is subordinated to the second one or the second to the first. The question still remains open whether, besides the accentual and the chronemic verse, there exists a ‘tonemic’ type of versification in languages where differences of syllabic intonations are used to distinguish word meanings. In classical Chinese poetry, syllables with modulations ‘tse’, deflected tones) are opposed to the nonmodulated syllables, ping ‘level tones’, but apparently a chronemic principle underlies this opposition, as was suspected by Polivanov and keenly interpreted by Wang Li.; in the Chinese metrical tradition the level tones prove to be opposed to the defelcted tones as long tonal peaks of syllables to short ones, so that verse is based on the opposition of length and shortness.

Miss Cui takes a Hermeneutic Turn: ‘Yingying zhuan’ and its various translations and retranslations - Birgit Linder p.150 From the hermeneutic point of view, every text, be it the original or the translation, carries with it its own prejudice and meaning, its own horizon. A study of the correlation between texts as transmitted in different cultures or periods shows how meaning is constructed against the cultural and literary context of the source text and the target text alike. What this paper is concerned with is, therefore, not the ‘accuracy’ of a translation, but rather the cultural significance of a translation and how each text adds to the meaning of the original. [the hermeneutic approach should not be misunderstood as giving license to faulty translations.] --------------------- Avoiding Thesis and Dissertation Pitfalls p.16 S: But site based is better, and it’s important that people recognise it. P: that makes your dissertation an advertising tool - a device to get people to buy your product. It’s like selling Coke or Pepsi. By saying your purpose is ‘to prove’, you’re already committed to something you believe is true. S: What’s wrong with that? P: A research dissertation is supposed to contribute to knowledge or to practise by revealing something we don’t already know. The way you phrase your topic should reflect such an intention. If your work is to qualify as research, you need a different verb than ‘prove’. Try ‘discover if’ or ‘ test whether’ or ‘ compare the effectiveness of’? But don’t researchers gather inforemation to find out if something they believe is actually true? Quite so. That’s what a hypothesis is - a statement of a likely outcome. But the aim of such researchers is not to convince others that the hypothesis is true. Their aim is to test whether it is indeed true, or perhaps to test the degree to which it’s true. And the difference between a commitment to convince others and a desire to assess the validity of an estimate isn’t inconsequential, since it can affect the way you do the job. ‘when you sincerely try to assess a hypothesis, you hunt for -and use- all varieties of evidence that bear on the issue. Rejecting the hypothesis can be as significant as confirming it. Persuading - seeking to prove - is salesmanship. Discovering or evaluating is research.’ Fit the subject of study?? Will the results of the study make a contribution to knowledge?? Feasible?

Linguistics and the study of Poetic Language - Edward Stankiewicz, Style in Language

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