Super Facebook Group Marketing, with Mike Hill

Episode #8: Mike Hill at ThoughtLeaderRetreat.com/mikeh

“Super” Facebook Group Marketing ______________________________________________________________________________

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Alan: Welcome again, everybody, to another episode of Thought Leader Retreat. This is Alan Brymer, and it’s my

pleasure to be interviewing Mike Hill, the founder of Internet Marketing Super Friends, the super Facebook group and

also Media Management Association.

We’re going to talk about pay-per-click marketing and some of the content marketing strategies that have worked very

well for his clients as well as all the different changes going on in the internet marketing atmosphere.

Mike, you just got back from the Traffic and Conversion Summit at the time of this recording. I know it wasn’t your first

time there, at least I don’t think it was, but from what I saw in your updates, you were having an absolute ball. Tell us

about how that went.

Mike: Oh, I loved Traffic and Conversion Summit. I love attending events. The last time I went to Traffic and Conversion

was four years ago, and I spoke on stage about banner retargeting, some new thing that had just been starting, well I

guess it had been out for a few years, but it was really just starting to take off at that point.

Ironically, that was the subject of discussion for this Traffic and Conversion Summit, now that it’s really starting to hit

scale, and it’s obviously an incredible place to find and network with other people who are like-minded.

For us in particular, it was a great family reunion—getting to see a lot of people you haven’t seen for a long time, sharing

some private masterminds during the show and after the show. Just a great place to reconnect, if you will.

Alan: It’s really nice meeting people in person for the first time that you’ve only seen their thumbnail for the last year or

two.



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Mike: Yeah, it is. It’s interesting, too, when that happens, you’re like “Oh, I didn’t recognize you.”

Mike’s Entrepreneurial Journey

Alan: It’s funny, why don’t you tell us a bit about your story and how you got started in business for yourself?

Mike: Oh sure. This is going to sound funny. I had run a call center for a number of years. I got laid off and was on

unemployment and my unemployment was running out. I had spent some time just kind of sitting on my butt doing

nothing, thinking about what I wanted for my life.

I saw an ad in the paper for an internet receptionist. I answered the ad in the paper, I started to work for $6 an hour,

working as the receptionist and told them that I was going to be their President or running their company within a year.

Within nine or ten months, I was the Vice President and all projects were run by me. Within two years, I had outgrown

the company and started being my own mercenary conversion specialist and traffic guy.

People would hire me and I’d start doing conversion optimization for them back before CRO was a term. I’ve done that

for 13 plus years.

Alan: Congratulations to you.

Mike: Thank you.

Alan: And pay-per-click came into that when?

Mike: When pay-per-click got started. I remember ripping off a site look and design that but, “Man, I loved the way that

the search engine looks. It’s so clean.” This was in like, I don’t even remember what year, early 2000. It turned out to be

Google.

It was super, super clean and neat, and no one knew what it was. We’ve been doing pay-per-click since we had out

accounts with GoTo and then Overture and just you name it, over 12 or 13 years, I think at least…

Alan: So you like Google, huh? It’s AltaVista all the way for me.

Mike: AltaVista [laughing], oh yeah, we’ve spent some money there.

Alan: So the community who’s listening to you right now, we don’t really refer to ourselves like “Look how great we are;

we’re thought leaders.” We’re more like people who aspire to that ideal of someone who really shares something

original and is able to promote themselves in the process.

Mike’s Definition of a Thought Leader



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What would your definition be of a thought leader, since there are a lot of definitions out there?

Mike: Well, I think you nailed it. I think a true thought leader doesn’t consider himself a thought leader. A true thought

leader is someone who thinks about others before thinking about themselves, and then as such, ends up coming up with

or receiving inspiring thought through the consciousness that is this planet and universe, if you will.

I believe that a good and true thought leader will not inhibit thought, and will make sure that that thought proliferates

into the world, without a consideration for their own benefit and their own popularity.

I’ve met many, many thought leaders in my life and some of the more influential thought leaders. Nobody knows who

they are and nobody has ever met them, but they still are the people who are actually innovating society as a whole.

Alan: If no one knows who they are, then who’s listening, or who’s following them?

Mike: Those who decide to become the vocal leaders, where the thought leader does not want that fame or popularity.

Alan: Isn’t that interesting, because I’ve often found the people who are the best at something are quite often not the

ones who are talking about it the most, or the most visible. They’re just quietly going about their business and true

expertise does come across.

Mike: Absolutely. It’s always the silent guy in the corner that you want to end up talking to, it’s not the guy who is

standing up on stage talking about how you should join his mastermind group. It’s the guy in the corner with the ratty

jeans and the flip flops taking notes or the guy who’s outside and not even in the event himself, because they’re usually

doing the work, instead of just talking about the work.

Alan: That’s right. I’ve kept this certain criteria in mind when looking for martial art schools.

Let’s say that you go to a new city, you have a certain style you want to learn, but there’s three, four, five different

schools in the area, well, the places that resonate the most with me are not necessarily the brightest, cleanest, family-

oriented, trophies on the wall, lots of great marketing, etc.

I found it’s more like the hole in the wall, where there is some old dude that’s totally old school, like Burgess Meredith

from Rocky, and just old school.

Mike: There’s a distinct difference between a passion for what you do, and a passion for being famous for what you do.

A true thought leader doesn’t have the passion to become famous for what they do, they just enjoy what they do, and

that’s how they come up with the true thoughts that change humanity.

Was it Your Plan to Break Some Rules When You Started IM Super Friends?



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Alan: The group that you started Internet Marketing Super Friends, it was very different. It’s big now. It looks like it took

a couple of years to really get traction, but I remember even in the beginning, I don’t know four years ago, when I

started paying attention, it seemed to break some industry rules.

Was that your plan from the beginning?

Mike: Oh absolutely. When I began the group, there was a couple of reasons I started the group, the first of which is

that every mastermind I attended, and every closed door meeting, everyone was attempting to push their customers or

their prospects to their own website.

I was telling everyone this is a huge mistake. You need to go where the party is, and quit trying to bring people from the

party.

Part of me started the group just in spite of everyone else, and I was tired of repeating myself and I finally said “Screw it.

If you guys aren’t going to do it, I will do it. I’ll invite some people and we’ll see who shows up and I’ll see if I can get this

down right.”

The second reason I started it - first of all, again to prove the point of build it where they are, instead of build it and let

them come, and then the second reason for doing it was – I was tired of being embarrassed.

I was really sick and tired of being embarrassed to say that I was a marketer on the internet, and I knew that I wasn’t the

one.

There had to be more people who wanted to use ethical and moral practices in order to sell a product. There’s nothing

wrong with selling. There’s nothing wrong with slaying a nation, but you need to be able to do it with respect,

compassion and intelligence and I didn’t feel that any of those three items, as well as others were on the current mind of

anyone going into our marketplace.

I decided to see what we could do to influence an entire industry.

Alan: The best part is you pulled it off. You weren’t just some guy venting in a corner, somewhere on the internet, but

times change and people change, and it’s really satisfying to me to see values like compassion become more important

to people, important to society in general.

The types of marketers who don’t believe in that, and don’t respect people, and treat them like…treat their own

customers like the Homer Simpsons of the world, well it just becomes more obvious and eventually they’re forced to

change and come late to the party, a party that you’ve been rocking for how many years now?

Mike: Over four years now, yeah, over four. A key distinction that needs to be made is you mentioned the term “a guy

venting in the corner” and that’s how, unfortunately, a lot of people view change that if you vent enough, change will

occur. I don’t believe in that and I don’t say that you do, but that’s how a lot of folks look at.



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I don’t believe in that methodology. I believe that if you want to lead, you lead by example, and that’s why venting is just

simply not allowed in the group, nor a number of other things that are traditional human activities, they’re just not

allowed in our space of positive reinforcement.

Alan: If you show someone the alternative, they can just compare it to what was the status quo and say this is a better

option.

Mike: Absolutely.

Struggles and Trials While Growing a Successful Facebook Group

Alan: Great, what are some struggles and trials that you came into in the process of growing and moderating this

group?

Mike: Oh, that’s a question. Well, we of course like all growing things, we have has struggles for years now with the

gate, making sure that we let in enough people, and making sure that everybody who comes in is the right match for the

group.

It’s been a little bit difficult in ensuring that the right people get approved and what I mean by that is we’re don’t …we

have to use a marketer’s prejudice to a certain extent when someone applies.

If I see someone whose wall is filled with a lot of promotional posts, I have to either assume one…that that person is not

very respectful of their own friends and family. If that’s the case, then how are they going to act with people who aren’t

in their immediate circle of friends and family? Those are people who are probably not folks we want to be in the group.

Now, we have to strike that with the counterbalance of influencing those who need the influence the most. While we do

and are selective in the process of who we approve to be in the group, we also do let some folks in that others may not

let in.

I let some people in that my other admin probably wouldn’t let in, simply due to the fact that I think they need us the

most.

Then there’s that balance of you know letting them learn by example versus not letting them into the party. That’s been

one of the most difficult balances to strike.

The second - well, there’s two more complications. One of them is growing admin. That has been really difficult. We

found that selecting the right people to administer a group of that size, when you have people who you have to kick out,

who you know are very influential people, you cannot operate with two sets of rules.

Everyone must abide by the same rules, whether or not you’re a multimillionaire or a pauper, you still have to abide by

the same rules. Finding admins that were capable of doing that required a whole another level of training for us.



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Thirdly, funding the group. As of this point, I kind of just fund it all with our own pocketbook, but we definitely need to

start considering it more of a business and looking for sponsorships, and doing things like that, but because this is more

a passion play for me, I really haven’t made it a focal point.

Alan: Not only have I not minded that you might be or might eventually monetize the group, I can’t wait for it to

happen. I feel like you deserve it. Shut up and take my money, all right.

Mike: The funny thing, Alan, is that’s the whole premise that we use behind all of our work that we tell our clients,

which is “Hey, just build it with trust, compassion, and respect, and eventually people will be dying to give you their

money.”

You just have to truly care about them, first, and they’ll feel that you care, and then when they know that there is finally

someone who cares, they will bend over backwards to do whatever is needed to fund it.

Alan: You’ve begun speaking about ethical marketing lately, haven’t you?

Mike: Yeah, I’ve actually done it a number of different times. Believe it or not, though, it’s not necessarily a popular

topic, but I have been thinking about using ethics in marketing since probably 2004 or ’05.

Once I dumped the domain name ethicalmarketing.com, which I bought, and went to the Internet Marketing Super

Friends, a badge that everyone could adopt and would respect and appreciate, then it’s become a lot more socially

accepted.

Reconciling Compassion, Trust and Respect?

Alan: How do you reconcile compassion, trust and respect with the fact that there are so many examples of business

leaders that have built something substantial without exactly being the living embodiment of those values?

Mike: I don’t understand the question. What do you mean how do I reconcile their activities against my own.

Alan: Well in the past, let’s say you’re looking at business leaders, a lot of them CEOs have a certain results-driven

mindset, which is great, results are important; but when it comes down to the way they treat their team, the way they

run things, like Steve Jobses screaming at people, geniuses though, getting things done, it could be easy for someone to

say “Well why is this ethical stuff, why is understanding people, why is empathy important,” when there is these

hardliners in the past who didn’t give a rat’s ass about that, and things worked for them.

Is it because that was then, this is now? I just wondering what your take is on that.

Mike: So here is the way I see this. Each person has to do something right for them. I believe that - here’s the best way

to say it, and then it’s no BS hype.



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I think God put some of us on the planet to be leaders and motivators. He put some of us on the planet to be executors

and creators. I don’t think that you can be - I don’t think you have to decide which one is right for you.

I don’t think you can point and say which one is right for anyone or everyone. I think you can be one or the other, and

there will be times in your life when you’ll be one or the other.

There have been times in my life when I’ve been a ruthless executor, when I’ve done things and promoted programs

that I know I probably shouldn’t have. I’ve treated people ways that I know I shouldn’t have, but at this stage in my life, I

have left the point of - for me, I’ve left the point of ruthless execution and have come into a point of meeting and value.

For me, right now, I believe that this is my course of action. That’s why you’ll find in the group, I don’t point fingers at

someone else and say, “Hey, that guy’s a bad guy,” because I can’t. I could never do that, because that’s merely a

projection of my reflection of my inadequacies in that area of my life, or my unwillingness to put myself in that person’s

shoes.

Steve Jobs, what he built was glorious and beautiful. Was he a pain in the ass? Yes, absolutely, a lot of people say he’s a

huge pain in the ass, but that does not mean that he’s wrong, that just means that God gave him a separate set of skills

and talent and he’s utilized those skills and talents and he’s utilized those skills and talents to create change that he

thought was great for the world.

Alan: Isn’t it interesting how everyone has those main gifts, and then everyone could also stand to benefit from

rounding out their edges and their complementary things as well.

For all the Type A people out there, that are go, go, go…that’s cool, because there’s a lot of people who just sit around

with their thumb up their ass, but at the same time, those Type A people need to chill out or the piper is going to - is

that an expression? The piper is going to catch up with them?

Mike: Yeah, Steve’s a great example of - I shouldn’t say he’s a great example, because that’s really erroneous.

What I should say is if we run ourselves into the ground, we’ll find ourselves in the ground. We have to make the

decision and for some of us that decision may come too late. And for some of us, you know, what we are not supposed

to make the decision to become well-rounded.

If you find that in your life, you have pushed yourself to a point where you are unhappy and unable to slow down, then

you do really need to do that. I know this kind of sounds like a wishy-washy answer, brother, but I think that some

people are destined to burn themselves out, and I hope to God that if you’re listening to this podcast, you don’t do that,

that you find a nice way to balance out.

I think that there will always be the Steve Jobs if you’re going to focus on that one comparison. They’ll always be the

Steve Jobs of the world that will push us to another level, and unfortunately they will fizzle and burn out.

Alan: The bottom line then…pay attention. Pay attention to yourself.



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Mike: Yes.

Alan: Self-awareness, etc., if you notice yourself starting to burn out, then do something about it. It’s not a sexy answer

like you said, but it’s what it really boils down to. In fact, before you get burned out would be the time to start.

Mike: Yes, absolutely. I mean, look at Steve on his deathbed right now, right. If you’re in that position, are you grateful

for what you created in the world? Are you sad because you missed out on your kids’ life? Are you sad because you

changed things, or maybe he did or didn’t, I don’t know, but I’m merely suggesting that there is a balance that you must

strike for yourself.

What Thought Leaders Have Influenced Mike

Alan: So what thought leaders have you followed and that have influenced you, and how so?

Mike: Oh, good question. The most influential thought leader who has affected my life is Wayne Dyer, hands down. He

is the one who has helped me to see things as they truly are, not as I believe them to be, or not as others tell me that

they are.

He has been the largest influence in my entire life. Besides him, I’d say - God, he’s the one that I always just come back

too. I mean obviously, there’s a few thought leaders that have really provoked me to move to another level, but they’re

minuscule in comparison.

They’re the traditional subject…for instance Albert Einstein, and I also really enjoy a lot of the work of Deepak Chopra.

There’s a couple of folks…all of this…I really focus a lot of my motivation from the metaphysical world, not necessarily so

much from the marketing world, because I find that my metaphysical and my psychological understanding of humans

has actually helped me a hell of a lot more than any marketing program I’ve every undergone.

Alan: I believe that. And that is interesting that the person who influenced you the most wasn’t the Facebook

networking group guru.

Mike: No.

Alan: No, because our actions or our tactics are influenced by our strategy and our strategy is influenced by our

doctrine, or our beliefs, or our values. It trickles down from the big picture down to the tiniest most minute thing that

we do. That applies to everything I have found from martial arts to business, to whatever it is that we’re doing.

You’ve given some great examples of people that it seems like jive with your worldview or have helped to shape that,

and that in turn has not only influenced your personal actions but your business and then this entire group of people.

Mike: Absolutely. The more we can turn ourselves inwards, the more we can actually help everyone including ourselves

around us.



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What Is a Really Good Quote From a Thought Leader?

Alan: What is one really good quote from a thought leader that you’d like to share?

Mike: Wow, I wish I thought about that one beforehand. What really good quote…

There’s a story in one of Wayne’s books, where he talks about this woman who came to him and was complaining

because her husband was an alcoholic. She said “He’s an alcoholic, and he’s drinking all the time, and he’s doing all these

things, and he’s driving me crazy.”

And Wayne says, “So, your husband is an alcoholic.” She says “Yes.”

He says “Was he always an alcoholic?” “Yes, from the time I met him he was an alcoholic.”

“These things are driving you crazy?” he says, and she says “Yes, they’re making me nuts.”

He says, “Wait a minute, so do you think his actions are crazy?” She said “Yes.”

He said, wait a minute, let me get this straight…You married an alcoholic who’s acting like an alcoholic, and he’s the one

who’s crazy because you’re expecting him to act differently than he’s always acted and always been with you?”

That one simple story has me realize that I don’t attempt to change people from who they are. I only attempt to become

the brighter version of myself, so that hopefully I can help lead others to recognize that they can change also.

That the more we attempt to convert those who are not - the more we attempt to convert someone away from their

true self, the more difficult it will be for that person to want to change themselves.

Alan: Wow, that’s worth cross-stitching and putting on the wall, right there.

Mike: Wayne’s brilliant.

Alan: Real quick then, before we wrap things up, can you tell us again where to find you online and a little bit more

about the free resource that you have for our subscribers?

Mike: Sure thing. If you want to find me online, you can go to - well, I guess the best place would be, and I didn’t even

mention this to you in advance Alan, but - MediaBuyerAssociation.com. It’s myself and Charles Kirkland are attempting

to help train and lead people to be able to be professional media buyers and to bring traffic into their world and

industry.

So that might be a great place to find me is MediaBuyerAssociation.com, and then as far the resource, we’re going to go

ahead and give you a traffic checklist, so if anyone wants to stop the JV cycle and start taking control of their own future,

I believe traffic is the number one way to do that.

http://themediabuyerassociation.com/

http://mediabuyerassociation.com/



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Download the traffic checklist at MediaBuyerAssociation.com. And, you can just tell me what you want that to be Alan

and I’ll make sure that it gets there.

Alan: You got it, we’ll set it all up for our listeners, and I can’t wait to see it. You said the magic word. I love checklists.

Thank you very much for sharing that.

Any last words of wisdom for our listeners before we part ways?

Mike: The only thing I would say, and this is the most difficult lesson that I’ve learned, Alan, is as you go through to

create the growth in your world and your life, there is a natural inclination (because I’m assuming that that’s what these

people are listening to your podcasts for is they want to become thought leaders) are start to align themselves with a

thought leader energy.

You will feel the natural desire to want to help change others as you become more self-aware. Those around you, you’ll

want to share your experiences, just remember to share your experiences without imposing your experiences onto

others.

I’ve made those mistakes. I have learned now over the course of the last 15 years that I can only shine the light. I don’t

blind people.

Alan: Oh man, that’s good stuff. I really appreciate your time today, Mike.

Thanks so much for being on this episode and to everyone listening check out Mike and his checklist. And, make sure to

implement the things that we have covered today. The best of luck, and success, and fulfillment to each of you in

growing your own follower base and business through content marketing, see you next time.

http://mediabuyerassociation.com/

Super Facebook Group Marketing, with Mike Hill

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Transcript of Super Facebook Group Marketing, with Mike Hill