Pippenger with Commentary by Prewitt

8/14/2019 Pippenger with Commentary by Prewitt

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A Summary of Thoughts and Concerns regarding the Teaching ofJeff Pippenger

I have only met Jeff one time in my life. I attended a symposium onDaniel 11 at the Lifestyle Center of America. The meeting was sponsored by

several persons that favored Jeffs teachings on Daniel 11, though personswith varying views were invited to attend.It is fair to the organizers to say that they never thought to invite me. But

how and by whom I was invited is beyond the scope of this short paper.Before attending the seminar I was favorably inclined to believe what Jeff

had to share. I had heard, as far as I knew, only positive things about histheology and his knowledge of prophecy.

And to his credit, I heard that he had avoided the pitfalls of futurismthat have ruined the usefulness of so many would-be prophetic expositors.

More than that, I heard (and am still impressed) that Jeff has a high-levelof respect for the Testimonies. And more than this, that he has made a

diligent study of the pioneers.This is an important point. The average Adventist doesnt realize the

difference in Biblical quality between the writings of the pioneers andmodern writings. The former are logical, Biblical, earnest, and to the point.The latter deliver less of these qualities.

And so, again, Jeff has made a good study of the pioneers and on thepoints on which they are well agreed with each other, he tends to agree withthem also.

Another positive point is that Jeff reminds Adventists of their duty andneed to know and teach their message. He reminds us of the coming SundayLaw, the coming change in the USA, the coming Latter Rain and the final

rise and fall of the Papacy.In terms of our belief about the end of time and about Daniel 11, we

share the following views:The Man of Sin, the Leopard-like Beast, the Little Horn, etc., represent

the Papacy.The 1260 days began in 538 and ended in 1798.Clovis led pre-France into becoming the first Catholic nation in 508.The France-led invasion of Italy brought an end to the Papal rule over

Rome in 1798.France is represented by Egypt in Revelation 11.Atheism, as nationally represented by communism, is the extension of

the principles of the French Revolution, and spiritually, of Egypt.The Latter Rain will add power to the church and cause our message to

swell to the Loud Cry.The tidings from the East and North in Daniel 11:44 are the Sealing

messages of the Sabbath and of the Fourth Angel.Daniel 12:1 is the close of human probation.


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What follows immediately is a summary of concerns with the Jeffs bookalready mentioned. After the summary you will find a partial detailing ofissues related to the book and expanding on the summary.

Point One: How is history repeated?

That history is repeated, especially in our day, is absolutely establishedby the prophets. But the nature and cause of that repetition needs to beunderstood before that repetition is a helpful element in our interpretation ofprophecy.

The work of God in the earth presents, from age to age, astriking similarity in every great reformation or religious movement.The principles of God's dealing with men are ever the same. Theimportant movements of the present have their parallel in those of thepast, and the experience of the church in former ages has lessons of

great value for our own time. {GC 343.1}

History repeats because God, and even men and demons, operate onbasically the same principles from age to age.

God does not force evil men to repeat the history of their ancestors. Infact, God warns them against doing so. He does, however, encourage faithfulpersons to imitate the faithfulness of ancient worthies. In every age mercypleads with both camps until hope for the former is lost through the hardnessof their hearts.

Ps 78:8 And might not be as their fathers, a stubborn andrebellious generation; a generation that set not their heart aright, andwhose spirit was not stedfast with God.

Eze 20:17 Nevertheless mine eye spared them from destroyingthem, neither did I make an end of them in the wilderness. 18 But Isaid unto their children in the wilderness, Walk ye not in the statutes ofyour fathers, neither observe their judgments, nor defile yourselveswith their idols:

In every age there is given to men their day of light andprivilege, a probationary time in which they may become reconciled toGod. But there is a limit to this grace. Mercy may plead for years and

be slighted and rejected; but there comes a time when mercy makesher last plea. The heart becomes so hardened that it ceases to respondto the Spirit of God. Then the sweet, winning voice entreats the sinnerno longer, and reproofs and warnings cease. {DA 587.1}

The law of cause and effect doesnt change. So the type of behaviorexhibited by Abel produced persecution by persons like Cain. Holy living byJesus led to his persecution. In fact, all that live godly in Christ Jesus will


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suffer persecution. Revivals are collective growth in holy living. Therefore agreat revival will be followed by a serious persecution. Thus history repeatsitself.

The apostle Paul declares that "all that will live godly in Christ Jesus

shall suffer persecution." 2 Timothy 3:12. Why is it, then, thatpersecution seems in a great degree to slumber? The only reason isthat the church has conformed to the world's standard and thereforeawakens no opposition. The religion which is current in our day is not ofthe pure and holy character that marked the Christian faith in the daysof Christ and His apostles. It is only because of the spirit of compromisewith sin, because the great truths of the word of God are soindifferently regarded, because there is so little vital godliness in thechurch, that Christianity is apparently so popular with the world. Letthere be a revival of the faith and power of the early church, and thespirit of persecution will be revived, and the fires of persecution will be

rekindled. {GC 48.3}

As an example of how history repeats we may consider the story of theExodus. When Moses followers rebelled against God, Moses was tested overhis love for them by an invitation to separate from their company. Thishappened in Numbers 14. It happened twice again in Numbers 16. Ithappened also in Numbers 20. God used the rebellion of the rebellious tocultivate the faithful intercession of the faithful. And this happenedrepeatedly on the way to Canaan, a trip representing our journey at the endof the world.

The question is: Does history repeat in numerical patterns? Or does it

repeat rather as men of one age make choices similarly to men of another?Should I expect that, in our day, there will be four such intercede-or-leave

tests, each with characteristics of the four in Israels history, and in the sameorder? Should I expect 10 unfaithful men (against two faithful peers and twofaithful leaders) to spearhead the first rebellion (as Num 14); three unfaithfulmen (two with families, one, like Korah, without his family) to spearhead thesecond (as Num 16); the third to be the entire nation (as Num 16 also), andthe forth to irritate the faithful (as Moses struck the rock in Num 20)?

Or should I expect that in the end of time that there will be repeated testsof mens love for their brethren by calls to leave the denomination becauseof its sins? In the same way, shouldnt I expect that most rebels will take

their families with them, but that being a child of a rebel doesnt doom aman (as it didnt doom Korahs children)? And shouldnt I expect that I amunder obligation to guard my spirit, even while interceding, so that I am notirritated by the churchs unfaithfulness (as was Moses) and so, like him,forfeit my chance at translation?

The latter paragraph, and not the former, is the proper way to view therepetition of history. In the latter case we understand that God selected


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snippets of history that would well represent the spiritual condition of ourage. That is how Paul used the Exodus stories in 1 Corinthians 10:

5 But with many of [the Israelites] God was not well pleased: forthey were overthrown in the wilderness. 6 Now these things were

our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as theyalso lusted. 7 Neither be ye idolaters, as were some of them; as it iswritten, The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play. 8Neither let us commit fornication, as some of them committed, and fellin one day three and twenty thousand. 9 Neither let us tempt Christ,as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed of serpents. 10Neither murmur ye, as some of them also murmured, and weredestroyed of the destroyer. 11 Now all these things happened untothem for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, uponwhom the ends of the world are come. 12 Wherefore let him thatthinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.

But the other way of understanding historical patterns is one used by Jeffregarding Daniel 11:30-36, regarding the timing of numerous events, andregarding number-oriented patterns and parallels. He looks for numbers ofenemies, order of obstacles, and short patterns in history, and reads theseas prophecies, as principles of how the Great Controversy between Christand Satan works.

Yet this idea is flawed. The reason that there were three horns to pluck upby the influence of the little horn was not that God was making it happenthat way to produce a prophetic pattern. The little horn uprooted the verytribes it needed to, and unless a prophet says otherwise, that is all we should

assume.In summary of this first concern, a misunderstanding of how history

repeats creates many false prophecies out of perceived patterns plannedneither by God nor orchestrated by Satan.

Point Two: How much should we trust an author?

Jeff repeatedly makes suggestions as to the meaning of passages ofscripture. He states his convictions as matters of fact. The Libyans and theEthiopians, he explains, represent the poor and the rich. He gives a littleevidence in the form of some anecdotal history. And then he expects his

readers to believe him.This isnt safe. Our pioneers adopted another course. They took the

various views, along with the scriptural evidence for each, and logicallyeliminated all but the true view. You could read their writings starting with adiffering view and see, by the end, that you were wrong. You didnt need totrust the authors to follow their logic.

The method of suggesting a meaning works best for passages whichpeople know that they dont understand. That is why I, like many, was


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anxious to read the section on the Libyans and the Ethiopians. I had ideasabout their meaning, but had not been able to settle on any conclusion withcertainty. I thought Jeff might present compelling Biblical data that wouldthrow light on the subject.

And neither have I settled on a meaning for these two nations now.1

Point Three: What role does a Lexicon play in Biblicalinterpretation?

Words change in meaning over time. By and by today meanseventually. In 1611 it meant immediately. And let today means allow.But in 1611 it often meant hinder. In cases like these lexicons can behelpful to persons unaware of the ancient meaning of a word.

But Lexicons are merely dictionaries. They describe part of the range ofmeanings that a word may have.

1 It is not central to the purpose of this paper to explain what I found regarding these twonations. Yet, as example of how Bible-study works, I will here share a few of myobservations:

1. In Jeremiah 46:1-11, the same nations in this verse, Egypt, Ethiopia, andLibya, are confederate against Babylon. Though rooted in a historical event, the wordingsounds apocalyptic. There is the gathering of the nations to destroy a city but only to bethemselves destroyed in a sacrifice by God [given to the birds, etc.]

2. The words for Libya in Dan 11 and Jer 46 are different, the former meaningempty-hearted and the latter meaning afflicted.

3. Phut, the father of the Libyans of Jer 46, was a son of Ham and a brother ofCanaan. Gen 10:6

4. In Eze 27-28 where Tyre represents the papacy, and the King of Tyrerepresents the Devil, we find these two words for Libya used together, showing perhaps that

they are not precisely the same, but that they are similar in origin and location. They arerepresented as composing, with Persia the army of Tyre. Eze 27:10.

5. In Eze 30:4-6 Egypt is prophesied to fall by the sword. There the nations thatare round her borders, those confederate with her, including both those of Ethiopia andLibyan fall with her.

6. In Eze 38, in the representation of the battle of Armageddon under the figuresof Gog and Magog, we find again Ethiopia and Libya with Persia, as forming themanpower of the army fighting against Gods city.

7. The bloody city Nineveh, when threatened by destruction, is warned by thehistory of Ammon, the city of No. She is told that No had as defenders Egypt, Ethiopia, andboth of the groups, Phut and Lubim that are translated Libya elsewhere.

8. King Asa had victory with a small force against more then one millionsoldieries of Ethiopia and Libya, (called Lubim in the passage). This great victory was to

teach him not to depend on the arm of men, a lesson he did not learn well. 2Co 16.9. Earlier than this, when Rehoboam was threatened by Egypt, Egypt was

buttressed with an innumerable company from Ethiopia and Libya. These were sent topunish Jerusalem. But when Jerusalem humbled itself, God sent deliverance. 2Co 12.

10. These are all the passages that refer to the Libyans by means of these twowords in scripture. In them we note several patterns: They (Libya and Ethiopia) are alwaysconfederate with Egypt, both against Jerusalem and against Babylon or Tyre. They form theshield-wielding soldiers and forces of Egypt. They are often connected to stories thatrepresent Armageddon. These seem to be the repeated, and hence, Biblical points.


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Let me demonstrate a faulty use of a lexicon by taking an actualstatement by Ellen White (in English) and using an English lexicon like aforeign person unfamiliar with English might erroneously do when trying tounderstand a translation of the passage into his own language.

Supposing that the translation was a good one, it would read something

like this, but in a foreign language:My attention was then called to William Miller. He looked

perplexed and was bowed with anxiety and distress for his people. Thecompany who had been united and loving in 1844 were losing theirlove, opposing one another, and falling into a cold, backslidden state. EW 257

Looking up key words in his English lexicon, our foreign speaking personmight find the following definitions for original English words:

Attention: n, attentiveness, as attentionto a teacher; affection foran ailing person; military: standing upright as a sign of respect;

Call: v., to beckon with a voice; to make a song, as a bird call; atelephone communication or attempted communication;

Bow: v., to kneel, usually as a sign of respect; to bend at the waist,as the artist bowed to the clapping persons.; to bend;

Company: n. Group; Companions, as they make good company;an organized business;

So now our foreign student tries to understand the passage. He mightconclude that Ellen White heard a voice calling her to be kind to William

Miller who was having a rough day and was nervously kneeling, apparentlyunder pressure from his people. These companions had been united andloving in 1844 but were losing their kindness [as is obvious earlier in thepassage when they lead William to bow.]

But we, as English speakers, wouldnt conclude that. You see, we knowthe language. It is easy for us, very easy, to know what attention, call,bowed, and company mean in that Early Writings paragraph.

This is like the difference between Bible translators and us. They knewthe language. Many times it was very easy for them to know which definition

of a word (for many words have more than one) ought to be understood in apassage. And we? We dont. And we are likely to guess wrongly and to makeup fanciful interpretations if we do guess using a lexicon. 2

2 This has been done by persons of other faiths. I had an interestingdiscussion regarding the Sabbath with two young men about a year ago.They promised to get back to me on why they kept Sunday. The next weekthey brought me a document. I can not quote it, but I can rewrite its main


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A safer way (than correcting a text via lexicon) to see if there arealternate ways to read the Hebrew or Greek is to look at a variety oftranslations based on the same Greek Text and to check the marginalreadings in the KJV. Looking to see how the word is used in other similar

contexts may also provide insights.The translators of the KJV did a tolerably good job of giving literaltranslations and alternate readings in the margin. And other translationsbased on the same family of manuscripts as the KJV include the Rotherham,Webster, Weymouth, Youngs Literal, and much of the NKJV.

There is another and graver mistake in using a lexicon that is often made,and sometimes made by Jeff in this book. Men use the history of thedevelopment of the word to help them understand its meaning in a passage.Let me illustrate.

Joh 11:9 Jesus answered[611]

, Are there not twelve hours in the day[2250]? If any man walk in the day, he stumbleth not, because he seeththe light of this world.

thesis:

In Matthew 28:1 we find the following words in the King JamesVersion of the Bible: In the end of the Sabbath, as it began to dawntoward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the otherMary to see the sepulcher.

What the average reader doesnt know is that the word translatedweek is the same word translated Sabbath earlier in the verse.And also, that the word day is supplied. Read literally the passagewould be rendered At the end of the [Jewish] Sabbath, as it began todawn toward the first [Christian] Sabbath, came Mary MagdaleneThe reading shows that the resurrection Sunday was the first of thenew Sabbaths.

The problem with the above is that the word first is feminine andSabbath is neuter. That is why the word day is supplied, because it is afeminine word. Greek readers knew that first couldnt refer to Sabbath.More than that, the word week (the word for Sabbath can be translatedeither as Sabbath or week) is in the genitive, showing that it should betranslated of the week/Sabbath.

All first-grade Greek pupils knew that. When we say It will come on thesixteenth of the month no one thinks we are saying It will come on thesixteenth month. Everyone understands that the word day is intended tobe understood.


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The two words, Strongs numbers 611 and 2250, are two of the mostabundantly used words in the new testament (used 250 and 389 timesrespectively, compared to an average occurrence of 5 uses per word.) It iseasy to look at the definitions and see that they mean answer and day.And it is easy to look up other passages that use them and see that they are

translated that way all through the New Testament.But if you look at the introduction of their definitions you will find that theword answer is derived from two Greek words, apo and krino. Thesewords mean, away from and judgment, or condemnation. It seems thatat some time the word apokrinomai came from replying to an accusation.Yet by the time of Jesus it was used simply to mean answer.

And in the passage quoted above the word day is haemera. This iswhat my lexicon says about it:

from (with 5610 implied) of a derivative of hemai (to sit, akin to the base of1476)

meaningtame, i.e. gentle;

Now this is all very interesting. The word day was derived from a wordthat meant to sit and that was related to a word meaning tame orgentle. It implies the Greek word for hour (5610). One could get the ideathat day means an hour for gentle meditation, or sitting.

But this would be a faulty conclusion. The word just means day. Itsmeaning developed and changed over time. By the time of Jesus it had lostall meaningful connection with its historical sources. When prophets usewords, they use them as those around them currently understand them, notin accordance with their ancient derivations.

One of my friends, reading the first draft of this document, wasconcerned that I was pushing Biblical interpretation back into the dark ages

where only the learned could do it. But it is not so.In fact, William Miller studied the Bible with a Crudens Concordance3 and

by making use of the marginal readings. This was sufficient. He wasdependant, you might say, on the scholars that translated the Bible intoEnglish. We all are, of course, unless we make diligent study of thelanguages ourselves. These great men translated the scripture into ourlanguage to free us so that we could read and interpret the Bible withoutdepending on scholars.

The misuse of the Lexicon actually creates an unhealthy dependence onmen. When common men see that a lexicon has been referenced they oftensuppose that the writer is more learned than they. They assume that what he

says about the Greek or Hebrew words is true since he quotes it from alexicon. And so they repose in the conclusions of his studies being neitherinclined nor able to follow him into the maze of a foreign language.

Point Four: Does repetition transform speculation into study?

3 Crudens is a fairly thorough concordance, but it contains no lexicon. It differs, in this way,from Strongs and Youngs.


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Jeff, after making a point about the interpretation of Daniel 11, oftenrefers back to that point again and again. This is a fine method of teaching. Ithelps settle points in the mind.

But if the initial point was made with a deficient amount of evidence, orwith an improper use of parallels or of a lexicon, that fact may be readily

forgotten by the reader a few pages later.This is particularly troublesome if the point made was speculative. Byspeculative I mean that Jeff selected one of the ways that a passage orword could be understood to the exclusion of others, but without evidencethat he had good reason to exclude the others.

The repetition gives the impression that there is a lot of material andmany ideas in the study even when there is little data and few evidences.Instead of the pioneer method of evidence-evidence-evidence-evidence-conclusion, Jeff sometimes uses a conclusion-evidence-conclusion-conclusion-conclusion-conclusion pattern.

Point Five: Does plausibility mean dependability?

Let me illustrate this with an actual point from the book. The following is aquotation from the section on the first 39 verses of Daniel 11:

After the delineation of the history of pagan Rome, verse 29 describes the closing

scenes of pagan Rome's authority. Here we see Constantine moving the capital away

from Rome at the "time appointed." In verse 30 we see his "indignation against the holy

covenant" as he introduces the first Sunday laws.

So here is the plausibility. Perhaps Constantines Sunday Law of 321 AD is

what is meant by indignation against the holy covenant in verse 30.Perhaps it is so. And it fits well if you believe Daniel 11 to be about SundayLaws later on in the chapter.

But do plausibility and a nice fit in connection with end-time scenarios helpus know if this is the right interpretation of the prophecy? I say no. Weneed to look at reasons, arguments, data, and to compare scripture withscripture. Consider the following:

1. Constantine did not live at the time of the closing scenes ofpagan Romes Authority.

2. Constantines Sunday Law was pagan, not Christian, in natureand wording

3. The first part of verse 30 speaks of the ships that both Jeff andI understand to refer to the Vandals. They began their work against Romeafter being chased from their homeland by the Huns, and this was long afterthe time of Constantine.

4. Time wise, this passage parallels the introduction of the littlehorn in Daniel 7 where it seeks to change times and laws.


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5. Conclusion: It is the papacy that has indignation against the HolyCovenant in verse 30.

Conclusion

These are my concerns with the book. It does have merits. It connects Rev14:12 and 17:3. And it connects Dan 11:36 with 2The 2. It makes a goodpoint regarding Rev 13:2 and Rev 17. There are other valid observations.

But there is also too much creativity and speculation. Men are invited toadopt interpretations without sound reasoning. And this habit of uncriticalthinking in the face of doctrinal teaching does not bode well for the time inwhich we live.

If someone wants more specifics on my relation to Jeffs teachings, mycomments on the following book are highlighted in blue so as to be easy to

find. (Items not in blue, below, are quoted from Jeffs book.) Most of Jeffsbook is not found below. But in the numerous places where portions (manylarge) have been omitted, an ellipsis is inserted, usually after one of mycomments in blue.---------

If the conclusions drawn from this study are accurate, they confirm that we presentlystand on the verge of a national Sunday law in the United States, and will soon beinvolved in the greatest time of trouble which has ever been. This sobering thought isvery similar to the convictions held by the early Millerites,

[And, also, if the conclusion drawn from this study include a number of fallacies,yet it is still true that we presently stand on the verge of a national Sunday Law in theUnited States, etc.. It would be inaccurate to give the impression that someonedisagreeing with JPs principles must surrender his belief in fundamental Adventism.] . . .

Daniel 11:30-36 identifies the rise of the Papacy at the beginning of the 1260 years. SisterWhite, while describing the transition of pagan Rome into papal Rome, ties both Daniel 11:36

and 2 Thessalonians 2:3-4 together confirming that the subject of both is "the man of sin."

This compromise between paganism and Christianity resulted in the

development of"the man of sin" foretold in prophecy as opposing and exalting himself

above God. That gigantic system of false religion is a masterpiece of Satan's power-amonument of his efforts to seat himself upon the throne to rule the earth according to hiswill. The Great Controversy, 50.

[Yes and No. Yes, the Man of Sin in Dan 11:36 is the same as that in 2Th 2:3-4. No, EllenWhite should not be quoted as saying it is so. The phrase according to his will is too generic

and may have been chosen for its usefulness and familiarity and not as a way of expounding on


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Daniel 11:36. This is an important point that saves us from perplexity over a number of

prophecies that Ellen White uses a variety of ways.] . . .

The First Sunday Laws

After the delineation of the history of pagan Rome, verse 29 describes the closing scenes ofpagan Rome's authority. Here we see Constantine moving the capital away from Rome at the

"time appointed." In verse 30 we see his "indignation against the holy covenant" as he introduces

the first Sunday laws.

[Butisnt verse 30 referring to Papal Rome? To the Vandals, mentioned earlier in thisstudy as the Ships of Chittim? How did we get back two centuries to Constantine? And can

Constantines pagan Sunday law be called national apostasy (see below)? Was it the law or the

persecution of Gods people as mentioned in Revelation 2 that led to Gods judgments? Andthree paragraphs down, who is it in verse 30 that is grieved? Reader, JP cant have it both ways.

Either verse 30 is about Justinians day, or about Constantines, or perhaps Constantine and then

Justinian. But here JP has it has Justinian and then Constantines Sunday Laws. Hmmm.] . . .

The transition from pagan to papal Rome identified in Daniel 11: 30-36 is also addressed inDaniel 7, which teaches that three horns would be plucked up from the ten horns, in order for one

stout horn to fill their places. These three horns are the "ships of Chittim," of Daniel 11:30

which were coming against pagan Rome. As the three horns of Daniel 7 continue to grieveRome in her ability to control the world, we see a deliverer arise out of the other seven horns of

Daniel 7.

[Three horns are the ships of Chittim? Vandals used ships. Let us give JP this one. But the

Goths and Heruli?]

Up until this time, the seven nations of Europe were pagans, and had not been sympatheticto Roman Catholicism, but prophecy states that arms shall stand on his part." In fulfillment of

this, Clovis, King of France, came to the military aid of the Papacy, and France became the first

Catholic nation. Clovis dedicated his sword and his throne to the Papacy in A.D. 508, and thenbegan the war against the three horns--the Goths, Vandals, and Heruli.

Paganism Removed

When Clovis dedicated his crown to the Papacy, the pagan powers of Europe followed his

lead. The pagan forces of Europe which had formerly been resisting Catholicism joined with the

Roman church. The pagan aspect of these seven nations is symbolized in the word "daily" inverse 31.

[It would be hard to say that these tribes were less Christian than Catholicism. They were

Arian Christians, converted to a type of Christianity in the 4th century by missionaries from theeastern church where Constantines son, an Arian himself, encouraged the mission. But the

papacy did take away the dominion of the Roman nation and replace it with a Roman church-

nation, and that may well be what is symbolized by the term taking away of the daily.] . . .


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The Walls-and Modern Babylon

As we proceed to address Daniel 11:40-45, we will find that the first three verses in this

sequence identify three areas of conquest which are subdued as the king of the north takescontrol of the world. These three areas are the former Soviet Union, the United States, and

finally the entire world. These three areas have symbolic walls associated with themselves,which are removed as the Papacy rises to its final position as the head of the world.

[Think about this reader. JP has proven well that scenes in our day will be similar to thoseexisting in the middle age papal rule. On this we agree. But where is he going from there? He

notes that three directions of conquest and three doomed tribes were mentioned in the prophecies

of pagan and Papal Romes rise. And to get three out of his future list, he uses 1. USA 2. Soviet

Union 3. World. Is that three? Or two? Or 240? And just take a look at the text, Dan 11:40-45.How many areas of conquest do you see? Is it plain and simple, as in Daniel 7 and 8, that there

are three?

What is happening here is that JP is misunderstanding the nature of repeating prophecy. Heis looking for numerical patterns where he ought to be looking for similar thoughts and feelings.

It would be as if someone had used the story of the Exodus to show that in the future we will

have one apostasy over jewelry, followed quickly by one over food and immorality. But what is

really being shown? That in our day we will face similar issues to those faced at that time,jewelry, food, and morality. This issue will come up again.

The first symbolic wall was the former'iron curtain,' represented by the literal Berlin Wall,

the destruction of which was a milestone in the rapid disintegration of the Soviet Empire.

Before the Papacy enters the United States through the passage of a national Sunday law, the

symbolic 'wall of separation of church and state' will have to be removed. It will beaccomplished by the politicians and justices of this land, as a result of the pressure brought upon

them by the Protestant and Catholic voters of this country. The pressure is already mounting andcan easily be verified through the testimony given within the secular presses. This second wallof attack for the Papacy is already being threatened.

The third wall which the Papacy will bring down in order to take control of the entire world

is the symbolic 'wall of national sovereignty.' The likely, structure which will be used to controlthe world is the United Nations. Already within the laws which have been developed by the

United Nations, we find the legal principles designed to remove national sovereignty. This

organization has already written and passed laws which supersede the national laws of individual

countries. In fact, many of these countries-including the United States-have already signed theseagreements, Placing the laws of the individual nations in subjection to the laws of the world

government.

[OK, here are the three walls. One is a national border, an actual wall. One is a legalprinciple. And one is so abstract as to be hard to explain national self-control. This might be an

interesting device for helping someone to remember a story, but it is a stretch if used as a way of

explaining prophecy.


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Let me explain again by a similar exposition (a fanciful and insincere one): There are three

hills that the papacy must climb on its way to international sovereignty. There is the hill of

atheistic unbelief in Gods existence. There is Capitol Hill, the legislature of the USA. Andthere is the uphill battle of convincing all nations to bow.

Or here is another. There are three horns that must be plucked up for the papacy to be re-established. One of these is the civil liberty horn of the lamb-like beast, the USA. Another is

the religious liberty horn of the same beast. The third is the horn, or trumpet, of theCommunist Revolution.

What am I saying? Prophetic interpretation is not like this when done well.] . . .

Pioneer Position

Two early pioneers give their view of this last power in Daniel 11:

Michael is to stand up at the time that the last power in [Daniel] chapter 11, comes tohis end, and none to help him. This power is the last that treads down the true church of

God: and as the true church is still trodden down, and cast out by all Christendom, it

follows that the last oppressive power has not "come to his end;" and Michael has not

stood up. This last power that treads down the saints is brought to view in

Revelation 13:11-18. His number is 666. James White, A Word to the Little Flock, 8-9.

Historical events, showing the direct fulfillment of prophecy, were set before the

people, and the prophecy was seen to be a figurative delineation of events leading downto the close of this earth's history. The scenes connected with the working of the man

of sin are the last features plainly revealed in this earth's history. Selected Messages,

book 2, 102.

We are in error if we seek to interpret prophecy in a way which is inconsistent with correctprophetic interpretations of the past. The last clear views of prophecy concern the Papacy; the

pioneers proclaimed the power "that comes to his end and none shall help him," as being the

Papacy. We are told that prophecy is a "figurative delineation of events" fulfilled by historical

events. Events in our recent history have fulfilled verse 40:

[Here JP is right and wrong. He is right that the king of the North is the Papacy. He is

wrong to prove it as he does. It is circular to say that the pioneers were right on those

points in which they were right. And the quote from 2SM says nothing about Daniel 11

directly. Anyone familiar with Haskell and the issue of the Daily will have read EllenWhites rebuke of him for using her indirect statements to settle issues that ought to be

settled by Bible Study. And more than this, A Word to the Little Flock was written prior

to the time when SDAs understood Revelation 13:11-18. We wouldnt want to say thatJames was right when he pointed to the lamb-like beast as the papacy....]

We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed,

as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in


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your hearts: knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private

interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of

God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost. 2 Peter 1: 1 9-2 1. . . .

The Ulai and the Hiddekel are two rivers with two different, though interrelated, messages,

but both messages come to a completion at the end of the world-just as both rivers flowed intothe same sea.

The twofold message of the visions of both rivers are Daniel's counterpart of the threeangels' messages of Revelation 14, for the three angels' messages also tell the story of the

everlasting gospel in connection with the final work of judgment going on in the heavenly

sanctuary above. They also identify the "man of sin" who will attempt to have the whole world

receive the mark of his authority.

In Revelation 15:2 John describes those who have entered into the experience symbolized by

the Ulai river as standing on "a sea ofglass mingled with fire," for in the battle against the king

of the north, they "had gotten the victory over the beast, and over his image, and over his mark,and over the number of his name." The vision of the river Ulal prophetically ends at the sea of

glass.

In Revelation 19:20 John describes the end of the king of the north the Papacy-by stating:

"the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, withwhich he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his

image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fireburning with brimstone." The vision of the

river Hiddekel prophetically ends at the lake of fire.

[This last section is another example of fanciful connections. The visions at the rivers

were not the rivers. They were not even metaphorical rivers. No prophet made the riversinto metaphors. The visions do not end in metaphorical lakes. What is JP doing? But if

he invents a metaphor, he is welcome to invent its meaning, and this he does. But do notpretend it is prophetic interpretation.] . . .

In Revelation 11:7 and also Revelation 17:8 we have a power that came out of a bottomless

pit, which symbolically means that it has no foundation in the Word of God. The French

revolution lacked the support of the Word of God, for it was founded and sustained uponatheism. In Exodus 5:2, "Pharaoh said, Who is the LORD, that I should obey his voice to let

Israel go? I know not the LORD, neither will I let Israel go."

[This is an interesting assertion regarding the word bottomless pit. Umm. Where did itcome from? What about abussos and the standard teaching regarding this phrase? Doesabussos mean bottomless? Or just desolate? Do JPs readers follow him in this kind of

paragraph? The pioneers had a good deal to say about abussos.] . . .

Prophecy applied before the cross is understood in its local and literal setting; prophecy

applied after the cross is understood in its symbolic setting. For example, modern Israel is theSeventh day Adventist Church, so too, modern Babylon is the Papacy.


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[Who was modern Israel in AD 1825? Does the Laodicean message only describe

Adventism? This is an important question whether SDAs are the Levites or whether they are

the nation of Israel.] . . .

For in one hour so great riches is come to nought. And every shipmaster, and all the

company in ships, and sailors, and as many as trade by sea, stood afar off, and cried when theysaw the smoke of her burning, saying, What city is like unto this great city! And they cast dust

on their heads, and cried, weeping and wailing, saying, Alas, alas, that great city, wherein were

made rich all that had ships in the seaby reason of her costliness! for in one hour is she made

desolate. Revelation 18:17-19.

Through economic pressure the king of the north sweeps away the king of the south. The

king of the south succumbs to a combination of economic and military power, the same twocharacteristics that the Papacy and its image will use to force the world to receive the mark of the

beast. See Revelation 13:15-17.

[Ships are economic strength? But ships are Vandals 13 verses before this (and on the sameside of cross time-wise)? This looks to be stretching it, to say that because they are used by

merchants that they represent them. Is there any evidence more solid? And if ships are ships in

verse 30, is there any reason to assume that they are not literal here? Arent they literal in

Revelation 18 quoted above?]

Question8. Whatare"countries?8. The"countries"spoken ofhererepresentthecountries that were under theking ofthesouth'scontrol. Ifnothing else, thisfact tellsusthat theking ofthesouth had agroup, orconfederation ofcountries. Thesecountriesofthe king ofthesouth werethesatellitesof the U.S.S.R.

Question9. Whatdoes"overflow andpassover"mean?9. To overflowisto rush, orwash away;and to passover isto crossover oroverrun:

overflow-7857:aprim. root;to gush;by imp]. to inundate, cleanse;byanal. to gallop, conquer: -drown, (over-)flow(-wheim), rinse, run, rush, (thoroughly)wash (away).

pass-5674:a prim. root;to crossover. Strong's.

TheFinalAnalysis

In 1798 the king of the south, France, began an ongoing war against the king of the north,

Catholicism. Atheism continued to develop its ideology, and reached another stage of growth at

the Bolshevik Revolution of 1917. Communism continued the war against Catholicism,attempting to bring the former empire of papal Rome into its grasp, but in time, Catholicism

mounted an overwhelming counterattack. The king of the north swept away the entire structure

of the king of the south, entering, into all the countries of the former Soviet Union.

[Umm, the Soviet Union crumbled. That is clear. This left a void that SDAs took advantageof. This is clear. But what religions have benefitted most or have taken over in place of

Communism? In Poland and Ukraine it is Catholicism. But in most of the republics it is the

inveterate enemies of Catholicism Orthodoxy and Islam.]

This overwhelming attack came with the military and economic aid of the United States.This alliance repeats the history of Clovis, when "arms shall stand on his part." It points to

Revelation 13, teaching that soon the United States will speak as a dragon, and then force the

world to also form an image to the beast. Daniel 11:40 is the first historical manifestation of thisend-time unholy alliance. . . .

The rush to freedom in Eastern Europe is a sweet victory for John Paul II.Ibid.

The word rush is the verb used to describe the spread of this freedom. He shall overflow,(rush), and pass through. The word pushed was chosen by this secular author to describe thebattle that Communism was waging against Catholicism. The king of the south pushed against

the king of the north.


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[Wait, wait, JP. The word rush isnt in Daniel 11. The word is over-flow and you picked

one translation out of about ten, one less common or justified than the words in the text. But

worse than this, you now quote an article about the rush of East-European nations and show it asa fulfulment of a prophecy about a rush of the Catholic church to help them. Who was

prophesied to overflow?]

Of all the events that have shaken the Soviet bloc in 1989, none is more fraught with

history-or more implausible- than the polite encounter to take place this week in VaticanCity. There, in the spacious ceremonial library of the 16th century Apostolic Palace, theczar of world atheism, Mikhail Gorbachev, will visit the Vicar of Christ, Pope John Paul

11

The moment will be electric, not only because John Paul helped inflame the fervorfor freedom in his Polish homeland that swept like brush fire across Eastern Europe.Beyond that, the meeting of the two mensymbolizes the end of the 20th century's most

dramatic spiritual war, a conflict in which the seemingly irresistible force of

Communism battered against the immovable object of Christianity. Time, December 4,1989.

While Gorbachev's hands-off policy was the immediate cause of the chain reaction

of liberty that has swept through Eastern Europe in the past few months, John Pauldeserves much of the longer-range credit. Ibid.

The word is swept, and the definition forcome against like a whirlwind is to sweep away.The author views this event as putting an end to the twentieth century's most dramatic spiritual

war, without even knowing of the spiritual war between the king of the south and the king of thenorth. This author also identifies Gorbachev as the czar of world atheism as opposed to being

identified as the czar of world Communism. Secular authors recognize Communism as atheism.

[Though they are spelled similarly, there is quite a difference between swept awayand swept through. And more than that, it is liberty that swept through while it is

Catholicism that swept away. JP is weakening even his good conclusions with low-

quality data. This playing with words to make things fit also makes things unreliable.] . . .

The Man of Sin's Deadly Wound

Adding here a thought outside the scope of this particular study, Revelation says that theVatican received a deadly wound which would be healed. It received that wound when Napoleon

captured the pope in 1798, the time of the end. Is it an accident that the pope who is guiding theefforts of the northern kingdom at the time when the southern kingdom is swept away, received aphysical deadly wound himself?

[Yes. To say anything else is speculative. And that is negative.]

It is of interest that it was this same king of the south, Communism, which allegedly

ordered the king of the north, the pope, to be killed. Also interesting is the fact that this


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northern king is the first pope in history whose name adds up to the number 666. (See this

equation at the end of a visit to Italy, the first face-to-face encounter between leaders of this

chapter.):

[So the 666 pope has died. What do we make of that?] . . .

The "glorious land" is a land where God chose to allow the last message of mercy to develop

in its infancy in 1844, and finally to mature into the loud cry of Revelation 18.

The "glorious land" is not the "glorious holy mountain" of verse 45. A land and a mountain

are different. Just as ancient Israel was provided a land to prosper and to present the message tothe world, so modern Israel also has been provided an asylum to do the same work in a modern

setting.

[It is fair for JP to state that this is his position, that the glorious holy mountain is not a

prominent feature of the glorious land. But let him not prove that it is so by saying that it is.]

In verse 40 the word countries is in the original, and points to the different countries making

up the former U.S.S.R., but in verse 41 the word countries is supplied. So in view of this fact,

when the king of the north enters the United States through the passage of a national Sunday law,

many shall be overthrown, not many countries.

[Literally, the word is many things. Countries, or institutions, but not persons. I am

making an informed guess here regarding the gender of the word.]

Those overthrown are the ones who come into the clasp of the iron hand of Rome by

accepting the national Sunday law. Those who escape are those responding to the beginning of

the loud-cry message under the outpouring of the Holy Spirit, which begins in earnest when thenational Sunday law is passed. I am not suggesting that the latter rain does not begin shortly

before the passage of the national Sunday law, but that it intensifies greatly at that time, as God'speople recognize the long-awaited fulfillment of the prophecies. Edom, Ammon, and Moab

symbolize those who begin to respond to this last message of mercy.

[You just have not given any evidence, JP, that this is truly what the verse means. You seem

to reason like this: This is what happens, so this must be what it means. And that, of course, isnot a sound principle of interpretation.] . . .

He shall enter also into the glorious land, and many countries shall be overthrown: but these

shall escape out of his hand, even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon.

After sweeping through the domain of the king of the south, the king of the north now enters

his next geographical area. This time though, instead of gaining a complete domination, a groupis identified which escape from his hand. First, let us identify the glorious land.


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[At this point neither the King of the South nor the King of the North is being interpreted as

a geographical area by JP. They are both, like Israel, being treated as spiritual bodies with the

characteristics of ancient Egypt, Babylon, Israel. But he says next geographical area.] . . .

America,. . . where the greatest light from Heaven has been shining upon the people,

can become the place of greatest peril and darkness because the people do not continue topractice the truth and walk in the light. Selected Messages,book 3, 387.

The glorious or goodly land was Palestine for ancient Israel, and it is the United States formodem Israel. The purpose of Palestine and the United States was the same for both ancient and

modern Israel. God has watched over His church and the land where He settled them that the

truth might be fully proclaimed to the world.

[The reader should understand the logic of this section. JP has well proven from Inspirationthat the USA is a favored nation prepared as an asylum for his people, as a place where the truth

could be developed and practiced.

But the fact that the interpretation of the goodly land being the USA is, for this reason,

plausible, is the largest evidence that has been given for this position. On the other hand, thefirst correlation of Jeremiah 3 via Ellen White with the USA seems to be a good piece of

evidence.

Until you check into it. Go ahead, look up ST 6-12-1893. Read the article. See if you find

any allusion to Jeremiah 3. Then go further, note the interpretation of 2Th 2 in this EGW article.Is Satan sitting in the temple of God today showing himself that he is God? And if yes, what is

that temple? Does this have an impact on how we understand Daniel 11:45?]

Hand Signs

Two characteristics prominent in the final movements of the king of the north are theclasping of hands, and the marching, or steps, or treading. The walking or marching, and the

clasping of hands are spiritual terms employed by both Daniel and the Spirit of Prophecy which

add to the continuity of this prophecy:

[With Daniel it isnt clasping of hands. It is stretching out of hands, apparently inoppression and conquest, agreeable with the common metaphorical use (see Strongs) of the

word, power. But are readers expected to not notice this? And in Daniel 11, it is the papacy that

stretches out its hand, or power, upon the countries. But in the following statements, who is

stretching out a hand?]

When our nation shall so abjure the principles of its government as to enact a Sunday

law, Protestantism will in this actjoin hands with popery. Testimonies,vol. 5, 712.

How the Roman Church can clear herself from the charge of idolatry we cannot see. .. . And this is the religion which Protestants are beginning to look upon with so much

favor, and which will eventually be united with Protestantism. This union will not,

however, be effected by a change in Catholicism; forRome never changes. She claims


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infallibility. It is Protestantism that will change. The adoption of liberal ideas on its part

will bring it where it can clasp the hand of Catholicism. Review and Herald, June 1,

1886.The Protestants of the United States will be foremost in stretching their hands

across the gulfto grasp the hand of Spiritualism; they will reach over the abyss to clasp

hands with the Roman power; and under the influence of this threefold union, thiscountry will follow in the steps of Rome in trampling on the rights of conscience. The

Great Controversy, 588. . . .

As the Sabbath has become the special point of controversy throughout

Christendom, and religious and secular authorities have combined to enforce theobservance of the Sunday, the persistent refusal of a small minority to yield to the popular

demand will make them objects of universal execration. Ibid., 615.

Prophetically, the focus is on allChristendom. The symbols associated with the prophetic

testimony of this time period of earth's history should be understood within the context ofChristendom. See Testimonies, vol. 9, 16. The main group of people to respond to the final

message of mercy comes from Christendom.

[Is JP saying something regarding missions? His last sentence is odd indeed, unlike the

interesting phrase supposed to be heathen quoted a page earlier. Of course it is obvious thatnon-Christian nations will not be arguing about Sunday vs Sabbath, and that is the point of GC

615 above. But when miracles begin to happen on national scales, all the world will become

Christian. And that makes this point mute.] . . .

In that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the

people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and his rest shall be glorious.

And it shall come to pass in that day, that the Lord shall set his hand again the

second time to recover the remnant of his people, which shall be left, from Assyria, andfrom Egypt, and from Pathros, and from Cush, and from Elam, and from Shinar, and

from Hamath, and from the islands of the sea. And he shall set up an ensign for the

nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed ofJudah from the four corners of the earth.

The envy also of Ephraim shall depart, and the adversaries of Judah shall be cut off.

Ephraim shall not envy Judah, and Judah shall not vex Ephraim. But they shall fly uponthe shoulders of the Philistines toward the west; they shall spoil them of the east together:

they shall lay their hand upon Edom and Moab; and the children of Ammon shallobey them.

And the LORD shall utterly destroy the tongue of the Egyptian sea; and with his

mighty wind shall he shake his hand over the river, and shall smite it in the sevenstreams, and make men go over dryshod. And there shall be an highway for the remnant

of his people, which shall be left, from Assyria; like as it was to Israel in the day that hecame up out of the land of Egypt. Isaiah 11:10-16.

The Sabbath Banner


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The previous passage teaches that the Lord is going to lift up an ensign, or banner for the

whole world to see. This banner is the Sabbath.

[Dear reader: Read the passage, the first verse, slowly. What is the ensign? And so it is thatJesus said And I, when I be lifted up, will draw all men unto me.

Now it is true that the Sabbath is a special banner, in metaphor, in the end of time. Many

symbols are used in several ways like this in scripture. The lion, for example, represents

Babylon, Jesus, and the Devil. To say that because the Sabbath is a banner in the statementsbelow that it is the ensign in Isaiah 11, when the first verse says plainly that the root of Jesus

is the ensign is not wise.]

ensign-5251: from 5264; a flag; also a sail; by impl. a flagstaff; gen. a signal; fig. a token:

-banner, pole, sail, (en-)sign, standard. 5264: to gleam from afar, i.e. to be conspicuous as asignal; to raise a beacon: lift up as an ensign, standard bearer. Strong's.

It is at this time that the true Sabbath must be brought before the people both by penand by voice. As the fourth commandment of the Decalogue and those who observe it

are ignored and despised, the faithful few know that it is the time not to hide their facebut to exalt the law of Jehovah by unfurling the banner onwhich is inscribed the

message ofthe third angel, "Here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the

faith of Jesus." Revelation 14:12.Evangelism, 281. . . .

When considering these three symbolic nations, the term, "the chief of the children," isimportant. The word chief means "firstfruits," and is derived from the root word

meaning-"shaking."

[This is a shaky hermeneutic. I have written on this idea, the idea that etymology is helpfulin showing the meaning of Hebrew and Greek words. It just isnt true. It [unconsciously?]presupposes both verbal inspiration and a false sense of continuity in the meaning of words. See

the introduction.] . . .

Three Enemies Symbolized

Let us consider some of the places in which Scripture portrays these three enemies.References and definitions of names are taken from the Seventh-day Adventist Bible Dictionary,

1960 edition:

Nehemiah 2:19:Sanballat the Horonite: the moon-god, sin has given life. A Moabite.Tobiah the Ammonite: Yahweh is good.

Geshem the Arabian: bom in the rainy season. Descendant of

Ishmael. Arabians are a family of tribes, (plural).

Judges 6:3; 7:12:

Midian:strife. Descendant ofAbraham from Keturah.


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Amalek, Descendant ofEsau.The children of the east (plural). Associated with Balaam.

Daniel 11:41:

Edom: red. Descendant ofEsau.

Moab: from father. Descendant ofLot.Ammon: paternal uncle. Descendants ofLot (plural).

Isaiah 11:14:

Edom, Moab, children of Ammon (plural).

Numbers 22:4-5:

Moab, Midian, Balaam of Pethor which is in the land of the childrenof his people (plural).

Revelation 16:12-13:

Dragon: Spiritualism.Beast: Catholicism.

False prophet: Apostate Protestantism (multiple churches, plural).

John 19:19-20:

Hebrew: one on the other side, Abraham, Shem.

Greek: sons of the Iortians, Japheth (plural).Latin: Roman: I have exalted, Babylon was founded by Nimrod, a descendant ofHam.

The Issue of the Law

The ancient enemies listed in Daniel 11:41 are a prophetic waymarkidentifying those who

are in resistance to God's, final-warning message, as well as identifying where those whorespond to the latter-rain message flee from. These enemies are mentioned in prophecies or

types whenever a prediction or illustration identifying the time period of the loud cry is being

presented. These scenarios consistently identify an issue concerning God's law which precedes

the latter-rain movement.

[Let us pause here and divide what has been demonstrated from what had been suggested. It

has been demonstrated that Ammon, Moab, and Edom were all long-time enemies of Israel.

Granted. It has been demonstrated that Midian was also a long-time enemy, though the relevanceof this is not clear. It has been demonstrated that Jesus cross bore an inscription in the three

languages current in his day.

And it has been suggested that those three languages symbolize three enemies. It has been

suggested that Balaam be considered plural since he came from the his people. It has beensuggested that Ishmael be considered plural even in the history of Genesis, since it was a

nation of tribes. But it has been suggested that Edom be considered not-plural, even though

Edom was a group with tribes like Amelek mentioned.


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These suggestions are unlike anything that you will find in the writing of the pioneers. They

border on religious fiction.

And it has been suggested that this is a theme in scripture: There are three enemies. But thisis far from demonstrated. Is it Judas, Pharisees, Sadducees? Or Pharisees, Sadducees and

scribes? Or Pharisees and Sadducees? Or Judas and the Religious Leaders? Or the Romans andthe Jews? Or Jesus family, his friends, and his enemies? Or Satan (Matthew 4, Luke 4), Judas

(Matthew, Mark, Luke, John), and Caiaphas? Is it Sodom and Gomorrah? Or Sodom, Gomorah,and the cities of the plain? Or Sodom, Gommorah, Admah and Zeboiim? Or is it Sodom,

Gommorah, Admah, Zeboiim and Zoar? Or is it Lots wife, his older daughter, and his younger

daughter (illustrating spiritual adultery in the end-times)? Or is it Lots family, Lots City, andLots choices to live there?

What am I saying? That this business is far too creative to be called Biblical interpretation.]

Gideon had to tear down the altar of Baal. Before the rains came, Elijah had to demonstrate

God's power in contrast to that of Jezebel's gods. Before the Promised Land came Mount Sinai.Before Pentecost came Gethsemane and the Cross. The prophecy of Isaiah, chapters 10 through

12, begins with the issue of an "unrighteous decree," and culminates in the latter rain.

The issue of the law precedes the latter rain, and confirms that the Sunday law in the

United States has already been passed if those symbolized by Moab, Ammon, and Edom areescaping. Understanding what and who these three nations represent in the prophetic sequence,

identifies the glorious land of verse 41 as the United States, for the United States is where the

Sunday law issue begins.

[Reader, perhaps you should do a little study on the Latter Rain and whether we should be

expecting and praying for it to come now. But more than that, examine the reasoning of thispassage. It shows that often troubles come before blessings. This is true. (Is it also true that

troubles often come after blessings? Like Christs temptation after His baptism? His cross afterthe Triumphant entry?

And then it does the most circular form of reasoning. In short: Since troubles come before

blessings, the Sunday-Law will come before the Latter Rain. Since Moab, Ammon, and Edom

are escaping, it shows that the Sunday-Law has already come. If we know who they are, it isclear that the USA is the glorious land. Now check earlier in this document and see how we

know who they are.]

PreviewIn Daniel 11:42 we again seethe king of the north using hishand to symbolize taking control. He is, once again, taking controlofgeographicalareas. In verse40, itwasEastern Europe;in verse 41, theU.S.A.;and in verse 42,Egypt. However, as in verse 40,thisgeographical area has the word countriesconnected with itsdescription. Verse41, pointing to the U.S.A.,has countries supplied-butmeans manypeople. Nevertheless, in verses 40 and 42,the word and meaning iscountries. Egyptin thisverse standsfortheentireworld with allitscountries. Thisverse pointsto thenextmovementa fterthe United States passes a Sundaylawand bows toRome. Itpointsto the pope bringing the world intoharmonythrough hiscorruptwine.

----

TheFinalRiseand FalloftheKing oftheNorth-PART5

10- SEIZINGTHETHRONEVERSEFORTY-TWO

He shall stretch forth his hand also upon the countries: and the land of Egypt shall not

escape.

The symbolic characteristics ofthe king of the south are understood by identifying the

word south with Egypt, and then applying the atheistic, defiant attributes of Pharaoh, in order to

identify Communism. Still we must consider the word used, and the context of the passage:


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Why is it so hard to lead a self-denying, humble life? Because professed Christians

are not dead to the world. It is easy living after we are dead. But many are longing for

the leeks and onions ofEgypt. They have a disposition to act and dress as much like the

world as possible and yet go to heaven. Such climb up some other way. They do not

enter through the strait gate and narrow way. Testimonies, vol 1, 131 .

I am filled with sadness when I think of our condition as a people. The Lord has not

closed heaven to us, but our own course of continual backsliding has separated us fromGod. Pride, covetousness, and love ofthe world have lived in the heart without fear of

banishment or condemnation.... The church has turned back from following Christ her

Leader and is steadily retreating toward Egypt.... Have we not been seeking thefriendship and applause ofthe world rather than the presence of Christ and a deeper

knowledge of His will? Ibid., vol. 5, 217-218.

The plagues upon Egypt when God was about to deliver Israel were similar in

character to those more terrible and extensive judgments which are to fall upon the world

just before the final deliverance of God's people. The Great Controversy, 627-628.

Many are not growing strong, because they do not take God at His Word. They are

conforming to the world. Every day they pitch their tents nearer to Egypt, when they

should encamp a day's march nearer the heavenly Canaan. Signs of The Times, March 6,1884.

The Lord God of Israel is to execute judgment upon the gods ofthis world, as upon

the gods ofEgypt. Manuscript Releases, vol. 10, 240.

Though close in identity, "south" and "Egypt" are still two different words. If Egypt

represented no other symbol or figure or type in the Scriptures then it would always follow thatEgypt represented the characteristics of a defiant Pharaoh. However, Egypt is more often used to

symbolize the world than it is used to symbolize atheism. The context of the passage underconsideration points out that the next step for the Papacy, after passage of the Sunday law in the

United States, is to move against the countries of the world. This is of course what Revelation

and the Spirit of Prophecy teach will happen. Egypt is not Communism; Egypt is the world:

[JP has revealed his fundamental hermeneutic. From the Bible and the SOP he learns whatwill happen. (10 points for this step.) Then he brings this knowledge to Daniel 11 and to other

Bible stories and searches for evidence to prove what he learned in step 1. (zero points for this

step.) Searching for evidence, even to prove a truth, tends to create false evidences. We do not

want false evidences to prove true points.

This principle of find-parallels-to-prove-truth makes challenging JP challenging. His

method, though imaginative and creative, can not be attacked without appearing to attack the

truth.


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But it also makes his work dangerous. It teaches men to suspend their own judgment. It

produces a mass of weak matter instead of a core of strong matter and this is calculated to

weaken the power of the truth, bringing to the structure wood, hay and stubble.

In the current passage, read verses 41-44. Does it read as if Egypt is the whole world? Or as

if it is part of the world? This common-sense approach, noting what the passage says, has worth.And when JP emphasizes that Egypt is a geographical location and then proves that it

represents wordliness (for that is what it is in the Spirit of Prophecy quotes given), what is hedoing? Is the church back-sliding to a geographic location?]

How art thou fallen from heaven, 0 Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut

down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! For thou hast said in thine heart, I

will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also

upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: I will ascend above the

heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. Isaiah 14:12-14.

And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and theyworshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with

him? Revelation 13:4.

Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is

worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he isGod. 2 Thessalonians 2:4.

Ever since his fall, Satan has been at work to establish himself as ruler of this earth.Review and Herald, March 9, 1886.

[Did JP just show that the king of the North is trying to become the king of Egypt?Who is King of Egypt before Egypt is taken?]

Sister White many times used the illustration of the joining of hands to symbolize agreement

with the Papacy. This verse says he will stretch out his hand to the world (Egypt). The world, of

course, has many countries, and they will all conform to Rome, for it states that the countries

will not escape.

The Second Escape

The word escape in this passage has a little different meaning from the word escape in the

previous verse. The last verse spoke of slipping out of his hand to be saved, or preserved. In thisverse escape conveys the meaning of not finding any deliverance from the iron fist of Rome:

escape-6413: tem. of 6412; deliverance; concr. an escaped portion: -deliverance,(that is) escape (-d), remnant. 6412: a refugee: -(that have) escape (-d, -th), fugitive.Strong's.


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Is this order of events consistent with Adventist understanding? Does the United States, theglorious land, first submit to a Sunday law and then the world follows after? Yes:

[Note carefully this logic: Does my conclusion about the meaning of this word supportstandard Adventist understanding of the end? The question nearly states that what is plausible is

also true. It reminds me, in this respect, very much of the writings of Victor Houteff in SR1,though I would in nowise indicate that JP comes to conclusions similar to Victors regarding his

personal appointment to teach the church.] . . .

We see upon this beast ten horns which signify pagan Rome, and we also see seven heads

with crowns signifying the seven kingdoms which brought about during the transition to papal

Rome by the removal of removing the three Arian horns in order to give place to the Papacy.

[This is an interesting, but not-so-standard interpretation of the seven heads. I would ask JP,which of these seven heads receives a deadly wound? And why are there not eight heads? What

you say next is more standard, but do you intend to say that the seven heads have two very

different interpretations?] . . .

Revelation 13-The Healing of the Beast

The first beast of Revelation 13 is a description of a mortally wounded papal Rome. Itdescribes a transition which takes place as the next world power arrives on the scene of history,

and also the transition which takes place when the deadly wound is healed.

As John viewed the composite beast of Revelation 13, he saw within the five characteristicsof the beast, the progression of world kingdoms as set forth in the book of Daniel, in reverse, for

John was looking back into history.

[Woah, JP. This is the limit. You virtually say that when prophets write about past events

they do it in backwards chronological order. Then is Jesus translated before he is born, and bornbefore the church is expecting?

The problem here is that you are not starting with a prophetic statement about why the beast

is said to be leopard-like. It would be more sensible to say that it is most like Greece, and hence

that is mentioned first. Greek does tend to use word-order to indicate importance.] . . .

When we began our study of Revelation 17 we prophetically located the prophet John inhistory. We saw that he was taken to the close of the 1260 years of papal reign. This was

ascertained by the fact that when he was taken into the wilderness, the whore was already drunk.

At the close of this time period there were five kingdoms of Bible prophecy which had

fallen. The first empire was Babylon, the second Medo-Persia, the third Greece, the fourth paganRome, and the fifth was papal Rome. Yet, was not papal Rome still a kingdom shortly before

1798?


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Technically, yes. However, prophetically, Daniel had already set an example concerning

kingdoms which had almost left the scene of history. Daniel 8 begins with the description of

Medo-Persia, even though Babylon was still a Kingdom when Daniel received the vision.Babylon was not listed in the vision of Daniel 8, for it had already reached the end of its

significance in prophecy. The same prophetic principle applies in Revelation 17:10. Papal Rome

still existed shortly before 1798, but it was at the end of its power.

[This is a fine suggestion of how to solve the difficulty of five kings being fallen duringthe time that John was in the wilderness. But if we dont assume that the blood of the million

martyrs under Innocent the III was insufficient to intoxicate the papacy, we dont even get near

1798 before she is drunk.] . . .

First, the United States forms an image to the beast, then the entire world does so. The

world therefore must form and empower a world government which supersedes the

sovereignty of nations in order to fulfill the definition of the image of the beast. To compel

the consciences of people through civil government, you must by definition and logic have a

civil government.

[This logic is not sound. 230 nations compelling the conscience would fulfill the

specifications of the prophecy just fine.] . . .

[The was and is not of Rev 17:11 also gives you a hint at timing, that this is after 1798,not before as indicated earlier. It is one thing to not mention Babylon in Daniel 8; but it is quite

another to say plainly that the beast is not in Rev 17.] . . .

The United States is the power which will force the whole world into making an image to

the beast, and thus into accepting the confederacy of the ten kings:

Eightpeople went into the ark, and were symbolically resurrected to a new earth. After sixthousand years of sin, the earth will have a thousand years of rest before it is resurrected anew

to begin the eighth millennium. Christ was resurrected the day after the Sabbath, which is the

eighth day, so to speak.

[JP sounds like Justin Martyr here. He had a lot to say about the eighth day. And theeight persons are resurrected? The eighth millennium? God arranged so that only eight people

would get on the ark? The first thousand years of the new earth represents the final phase of the

papacy? This whole eight thing seems just imaginary. Is it possible that the Bible records thenumber of people in the ark so that we would know that few, that is eight persons were

saved from the flood? (See 1Pe 3:20.)] . . .

Eight Represents Resurrection

The mystery beast, which is the eighth head, is the Papacy. It is of the seven, for it was thefifth. In contrast to the other six, it is identified as being dead. It is the head that is resurrected,

as symbolized by the number eight.


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[This graph represents the number of times the KJV uses the numbers 1 thought 19. It showsmathematically that, with the exceptions of 7 and 12, all numbers are used just as would beexpected in a book on any secular topic, a book where numbers represented no hidden messages.

The number ten is higher in use because of the useful habit of rounding. This tendency to round

also explains why five is slightly higher than the curve would predict. Which numbers show upmore than chance would predict? Just seven and twelve. Without a statement from a prophet

giving special significance to some other number we ought to resist our tendency to look for

such.]

The Final Transition

Connected with the beasts of Rome, there is always a story of a transition which takesplace. The mystery beast and the whore describe of the healing of the deadly wound. It is a

description of the Papacy's return to her position as a religious-political kingdom. This transition

takes place when the powers which were lost in 1798 are resurrected:

As we approach the last crisis, it is of vital moment that harmony and unity exist

among the Lord's instrumentalities. The world is filled with storm and war and variance.

Yet under one head-the papal power-the people will unite to oppose God in the personof His witnesses. This union is cemented by the great apostate. Testimonies, vol. 7, 182.

The Sequence of Events

The sequence of kingdoms, as set forth in the description of John in Revelation 17:10, is the

identical sequence of events which Daniel 11:40-45 identifies.

First, the enemy (atheism), which gave the deadly wound, would be overcome as the first

wall is removed.


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Then the United States, the head which existed when John received the vision of Revelation

17, would form an image to the beast at the passage of a national Sunday law. Thus the king of

the north enters the glorious land, as the wall of separation between church and state is

removed.

Then the king of the north brings Egypt under his control. Egypt, symbolizing the world, isrepresented by John as a world confederacy of ten kings, or the seventh head. Through pressure

from the United States, they form a confederacy, erect their own image of the beast, and remove

the wall of national sovereignty:

The spirits of devils will go forth to the kings of the earth and to the whole world,to fasten them in deception, and urge them on to unite with Satan in his last struggle

against the government of Heaven. By these agencies, rulers and subjects will be alikedeceived. The Great Controversy, 624.

[Check out the chapter this quote is taken from. It is the Time of Trouble, after the close of

probation, the time arrived at in the first words of Daniel 12:1.] . . .

Though swept away in Daniel 11:40 the political principles of atheism still have a part toplay in the end-time scenario, for the United Nations is politically structured as a socialistic

government. The ten kings of Revelation 17 are organized under the same guidelines as the

former Soviet Union.

[This is guess work. Readers should be aware of that. And to say that the United Nations islike a communist style of governmentisnt persuasive.]

Revelation 16:13-14 teaches that three spiritual powers will lead the world to the battle of

Armageddon. These powers are the beast, the false prophet, and the dragon. These are the samethree entities which begin their interaction in Daniel 1 1:40, for the beast is Catholicism with thepolitics of a monarchy. The dragon is spiritualism with its politics of socialism, and the false

prophet is apostate Protestantism with its politics of democracy.

Much more can be added to this understanding, but one helpful insight is found when we

recognize that Daniel 11:40-45 is identifying the healing of the deadly wound, but primarily fromthe perspective of Rome. Revelation 13 is covering the same ground, but primarily it is

identifying the role of the United States. Revelation 17 is also covering the same ground, but it

is identifying the role of the 10 king confederacy and its relationship to the story.

These three powers are identified in Daniel 11:40 and their story leads all the way toArmageddon, with each having a part to play, as well as each having a prophetic chapter which

brings their specific role into clearer perspective. The testimony of Daniel 11:40-45 is the

prophetic key which brings all these prophecies into harmony. This harmony establishes thismessage as present truth, and brings into focus an understanding from the books of Daniel and

Revelation which is designed to awaken God's sleeping church.


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[The last half of this paragraph is, at best, highly exaggerated. The prophecies described in

this book would be confirmed as present truth even without Daniel 11:40-45. They would waken

the sleeping church if well understood, even without Daniel 11:40-45. And Daniel 11 hasprovided no key that has helped us understand the meaning of any other symbol, even in this

book of JP. In each case we have noted the meaning of the symbols from Ellen White statements

about other prophecies.] . . . .

Rich and Poor

Ancient Egypt had two neighbors who had interesting histories. The Libyans, to the west of

Egypt, lived on the fringe of the desert, and throughout their history cast a longing eye toward

Egypt and the fertile Nile valley. They attempted to invade Egypt several times, but were

repulsed. Modem Egypt symbolizes the world, and Libya symbolizes what we call today theThird World-the poor, downtrodden countries that long to move up to the standards of the

affluent Western World. But who was Ethiopia?

[So how has JP showed us the meaning of Libya? He has given us an unreferenced summaryof ancient history. Is his audience expected to just believe something like this? There are two

Hebrew words used for the Libyans, one often translated Put, and one often translated Lubim.

Stories exist of these groups from whom we could learn, Biblically, their characteristics as we

did from Egypt. These with the Ethiopians, below, are often confederate against Gods people inscripture. But the idea of the wealth and poverty of these bodies is not a scriptural idea. Can we

say that it is reliable, or that we ought to use it interpretively? Does that still allow the Bible to

interpret itself?] . . . .

Following is Eugene Prewitts commentary on just a few other materials of Jeff Pippengerfound online.

http://remnantprophecy.sdaglobal.org/Remnant-Prophecy/endtimeJP/end-time3.htm

In the material at the above URL JP seems to ignore EGWs strong testimony regarding the

use to be made (or not made) of her EW statement on the daily. Haskell used the statement in thesame way as JP uses it here and was rebuked. How can JP ignore this?

I have words to speak to my brethren east and west, north and south. I request that

my writings shall not be used as the leading argument to settle questions over which there is

now so much controversy. I entreat of Elders H, I, J, and others of our leading brethren, thatthey make no reference to my writings to sustain their views of "the daily." {1SM 164.1}

It has been presented to me that this is not a subject of vital importance. I aminstructed that our brethren are making a mistake in magnifying the importance of thedifference in the views that are held. I cannot consent that any of my writings shall be taken

as settling this matter. The true meaning of "the daily" is not to be made a test question.

{1SM 164.2}I now ask that my ministering brethren shall not make use of my writings in their

arguments regarding this question ["the daily"]; for I have had no instruction on the point
http://remnantprophecy.sdaglobal.org/Remnant-Prophecy/endtimeJP/end-time3.htmhttp://remnantprophecy.sdaglobal.org/Remnant-Prophecy/endtimeJP/end-time3.htm


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under discussion, and I see no need for the controversy. Regarding this matter under present

conditions, silence is eloquence. {1SM 164.3}

The enemy of our work is pleased when a subject of minor importance can be usedto divert the minds of our brethren from the great questions that should be the burden of our

message. As this is not a test question, I entreat of my brethren that they shall not allow the

enemy to triumph by having it treated as such. {1SM 164.4}

http://temcat.com/prophetic-history/waymarksb.htm

I have people give me mild rebukes or strong rebukes that I spent too much timelooking at whats going on in Catholicism or in Spiritualism or in the political worldGodwould have us study these events and compare them with prophecy in order that wewould understand that were living in the last days. If youre studying the events andyoure comparing them with propheciesyou know youre in the last days. You knowyoure here! Its easy to present prophecy to Gods people today because if you got to

speak next Sabbath on prophecy to Gods people, all you have to do is go down and geta weeks worth of papers before Sabbath and on the front page youre going to haveinformation you can weave your presentation around because its being fulfilled everyday.

[Meat in due season is not found in the papers. But this paragraph gives an insightto Jeffs mode of thinking regarding prophetic interpretation.]

When we are purified when every sin and stain is gone, God is going to bring theSunday Law test that will bring us into a position where we receive the Seal of Godcorporately. All that have prepared for the Seal of God corporately will receive it; this will

be the group that then receives the Latter Rain without measure in order to proclaim theLoud Cry message to those people that are in Babylon and the rest of the world.

[We need to understand the sealing message! For evidence, in the form of sincere Biblestudy, on how men are sealed, email me. It isnt done corporately.]

"I was shown that if God's people make no efforts on their part, but wait for therefreshing to come upon them and remove their wrongs and correct their errors;if they depend upon that to cleanse them from filthiness of the flesh and spirit,and fit them to engage in the loud cry of the third angel, they will be foundwanting. The refreshing or power of God comes only on those who have

prepared themselves for it by doing the work which God bids them, namely,cleansing themselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holinessin the fear of God." Counsels on Diet and Foods, 33.

Were looking at the waymarks, historical events that are ahead of us; the Latter Rain,the refreshing. Immediately at the Sunday Law, Gods church is purified, we receive theSeal of God and the Latter Rain is poured out upon us. This empowers us to not onlystand through the time of trouble, but it empowers us to give the Loud Cry message.


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The Loud Cry message and t

Pippenger with Commentary by Prewitt

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Transcript of Pippenger with Commentary by Prewitt