IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT FOR THE DISTRICT OF ... · Case 3:07-cv-01380-JA Document 233-2...

FASYO REPORTERS - English and Spanish510 Octavio Marcano Street Urb. RooseveltSan Juan, PR 00918 (787)767-5593 447-8858

IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

FOR THE DISTRICT OF PUERTO RICO

WILLIAM ANTHONY COLON, * CASE NO. 07-1380 (JAG)(JA) *

Plaintiff, * Hon. Magistrate Justo Arenas *

v. * * RUBEN BLADES, ROBERTO *MORGALO, MARTINEZ, MORGALO *AND ASSOCIATES *

* Defendants. ** * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *RUBEN BLADES, *

*Cross-plaintiff, *

*v. *

*ROBERT MORGALO, ETC., *et als., *

*Cross-defendants. *

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

ROBERT J. MORGALO, * Consolidated with *

Plaintiff, * CASE NO. 07-1380 (JA) *

v. * *

RUBEN BLADES, *RUBEN BLADES PRODUCTIONS, *

*Defendants. *

** * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Deposition of:

RUBEN BLADES-VELLIDO DE LUNA

taken on April 22, 2009, at the Juan Saavedra Law offices,

Banco Popular Building, 7th floor, 206 Tetuán Street, Old San

Juan, Puerto Rico.

Case 3:07-cv-01380-JA Document 233-2 Filed 07/13/10 of 327

Robert

Highlight

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APPEARANCES:

On behalf of plaintiff and cross-defendant:

JUAN SAAVEDRA LAW OFFICE

Banco Popular Building, 7th floor

206 Tetuán Street

Old San Juan, Puerto Rico 00901

By: JUAN SAAVEDRA-CASTRO, ESQ.

JOSE A. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL, ESQ.

On behalf of defendants and cross-plaintiffs:

BUFETE ROBERTO CORRETJER PIQUER

625 Ponce de León Avenue

San Juan, Puerto Rico 00917-4819

By: PAMELA D. GONZALEZ, ATTORNEY-AT-LAW

ROBERTO J. MORGALO, pro se

Notary-public:

MANUEL SAN JUAN

Also present:

Mr. William Anthony Colón

****************


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STIPULATIONS

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Your name, please?

THE REPORTER: Rosiris Miranda Cuadrado.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Do you solemnly swear to

transcribe everything that's asked---

MS. GONZALEZ: Oh, I'm sorry, counsel. I thought your

co-counsel was going to administer the oath. I would certainly

object to your taking the oath

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Excuse me, I'll be---

MS. GONZALEZ: ---of the deponent.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---right back.

You're taking the oath?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I'll get someone.

MS. GONZALEZ: Please.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: He's asking the questions. I'm

not going to be asking the questions.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "No, pero" I'll get someone,

I'll get someone.

MS. GONZALEZ: Oh, no, but certainly, you're attorney

of record for Mr. Colón. It's highly improper.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "'Pérate, 'pérate, 'pérate. Tú

me dijiste que... José... Tú no tienes problema que José tome

el juramento."

MS. GONZALEZ: "Sí, si él no iba a hacer las

preguntas."


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MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: OK.

MS. GONZALEZ: "O sea, yo pensé que tú ibas a hacer

la... el examen..."

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "No, no, yo no iba a hacer las

pregun..."

MS. GONZALEZ: "...del testigo."

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "No, yo no."

(Off the record.)

(Back on the record.)

THE NOTARY: On the record, Manuel San Juan, I've been

asked to serve as notary-public for the purposes of swearing in

the witness and the court reporter in this deposition, and I

understand that there will be a stipulation that, once I do so,

I will be discharged from any further---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Attendance in this---

THE NOTARY: ---participation in this deposition.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: That is correct.

MS. GONZALEZ: So stipulated.

THE NOTARY: OK. Very well. So, madame court reporter,

if you will, please, state your full name, raise your right

hand.

THE REPORTER: Rosiris Miranda Cuadrado.

(Whereupon, the notary took the oath of the

reporter.)

THE NOTARY: And the witness, sir, could you, please,


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raise your right hand and state your full name?

THE DEPONENT: Rubén Blades Vellido de Luna.

(Whereupon, the notary took the oath of the

deponent.)

(Whereupon, the notary was excused.)

Whereupon,


having been duly sworn, was examined and testified as follows:

DIRECT EXAMINATION

BY JOSE A. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL, ESQ.:

Q I know you just stated your name, but just to have a

clean record, could you, please, restate your full name?

A Rubén Blades Vellido de Luna.

Q Mr. Blades, have you ever attended a deposition

before?

A Yes, I have.

Q I said attended, but I meant have you been to a depo-

--? Has someone taken your deposition before?

A Yes, sir.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: So, you know the process. I

will ask some questions, you will provide the answers to the

best of your knowledge.

THE DEPONENT: Uh-huh.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I would ask you not to guess,

not to speculate. If you don't remember something, you just


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don't remember it.


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: This is not a test, it's just

an exercise in obtaining facts regarding an incident that we

all know about.

If my questions aren't clear, you can ask me to

clarify them, to restate them, as you wish. If you wish to take

a break for any reason, just let me know, and we'll do it

immediately.

THE DEPONENT: Thank you.

(Pause.)

BY MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL:

Q Well, Mr. Blades, do you know a person by the name of

Morgalo?

A Yes.

Q When did you meet Mr. Morgalo?

A I don't quite remember the exact date, but I met him

when he was working with David Maldonado Management.

Q And who is David Maldonado?

A David Maldonado Management is a--- ah--- booking

agency that worked in New York, and that I worked with many

years.

Q Could you estimate the date when you met Mr. Morgalo

for the first time? Let's say, give or take a decade.

A Ninety eighty something.


7


Q OK. And did you have business dealings with Mr.

Maldonado at---

A Yes---

Q ---that time?

A ---sir.

Q So, Mr. Morgalo---? Did Mr. Morgalo do some work on

your behalf, as an employee of Martínez?

A I believe he did.

Q In the '80s?

A I don't quite remember when it was. But whenever it

was that he worked with David Maldonado, where I met him, he

worked with David, and as a worker within the Maldonado

Management, he worked--- ah--- projects that I was involved

with. I don't quite remember the date.

Q What type of projects were you involved---

A Music projects.

Q ---with back then?

A Music projects, specifically concerts, shows. Music

shows.

Q So, Mr. Maldonado's company would be in charge of

booking concerts for you?

A They would book shows and concerts, yes.

Q OK. The difference between a show and a concert is

the size?

A Ah--- yes, I would say.


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Q OK.

A It's semantics. Music--- music engagements.

Q That's wide enough a term. And---

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Argumentative or---?

MS. GONZALEZ: It's not a question. Characterization.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Fine.

Q At that time, were you a--- did you have your own

band?

A It depends, because my--- I can't--- I cannot--- if--

- if---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: No, no.

THE DEPONENT: David began to work with us--- David---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: No, no, let's stop. I don't

know, if you appreciate--- Let's go off the record.

(Off the record.)



Q You want me to repeat the question, or---?

A The question was whether--- when did he work with my

band, did he manage my band.

Q Did you have a band back then?

A I don't remem--- I--- My band began in 1983-84. If

Mr. Morgalo was not working with David by then, I don't know if

he would have worked with me in that concert. But with


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Maldonado himself, he also did bookings with--- when I was with

Willy--- ah--- I think he also booked some shows.

Q Maldonado?

A Yes.

Q And when you say when you were with Willy, what was

the nature of that relationship?

A I was working with Willy Colón. We were together in

a band. Willy Colón and Rubén Blades.

Q And it is your testimony that Mr. Maldonado did some

bookings for you and Willy Colón---

A It is my---

Q ---when you were---?

A ---it is my belief that he did, at some point. We

were working with different promoters.

Q So, Mr. Maldonado was not like your regular promoter?

A I never sign a contract of exclusivity with anybody.

Q Now, did it come a time when Mr. Morgalo started his

own company?

A Yes.

Q Do you recall the approximate date when that

occurred?

A It must have been after '84.

Q And did you engage the services of mister---

A Absolutely?

Q ---Morgalo? When you say absolutely---


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A I did.

Q ---were they your main booking agents?

A No. I wasn't sign--- I never signed a contract with

them either.

Q OK. You said that it must have been after 1983, but

you cannot be more precise.

A No, because at the time--- I don't remember when he

did--- ah--- his agency. I--- I would assume that it was after

'84.

Q Do you recall the name of that company?

A Of which company, sir?

Q Of Mr. Morgalo's company.

A Martínez Morgalo.

Q OK. And who is Mr. Martínez?

A Arturo Martínez was his partner.

Q Did Mr. Martínez also work for Maldonado?

A Yes, at one point.

Q And did you meet Mr. Martínez at about the same time

you met Mr. Morgalo?

A Yes.

Q And you also worked with Mr. Martínez through the

Maldonado company?

A Probably.

Q But you don't have any specific recollection?

A Not really, because there were different people. Juan


11


Toro was there--- ah--- they had different secretaries, and I

don't know exactly who was assigned to what.

Q Do you recall the name of a company that---

(Off the record.)



Q OK. Their company was called Martínez and Morgalo---?


Q Martínez Morgalo. And what did that company do?

A Basically, I think that they did shows. They did---

Actually, they promoted, which was the--- the part that I was

interested in. I don't know what else they did. They probably

did shows, produced shows.

Q When you say they promoted, what does that entail?

A Promoter is known, and perhaps is not the right term,

but it's known as the person who represents the artist in

shows.

Q Would it be accurate to say that the work they would

do is to find people in the different places where you could do

a concert, to have them contract with you, to do a show or a

concert?

A Some do that.

Q What about Mr. Martínez and Morgalo?

A I imagine they also did that. Some wait for the phone

call to come in. That's the advantage of having an office, that


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people call there.

Q Because they--- people know that they have access to

the artist?

A That is correct. Or they have had somebody tell them

that they should call there and ask.

Q And you used to use the services of the Martínez---

I mean, the Maldonado company---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---and you testified that you also used the services

of Martínez and Morgalo, correct?

A In different times.

Q OK. Did you stop using Maldonado's services and

switched to Martínez and Morgalo?

A More than switch, I think Maldonado sort of took off

a different direction. I'm not sure--- I can't remember if he

was sick then, or if he left, and left Juan, but--- ah--- I

wanted to help Martínez Morgalo more, 'cause they were young.

Q And were they friends of yours, or---?

A Absolutely.

Q And did it come a time where Martínez and Morgalo

would be--if we're going to use the word promoter--your main

promoters?

A Absolutely.

Q Did at any time---? Were they exclusive?

A No.


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Q In fact, not--- maybe not---

A No.

Q ---not legally, but---

A No.

Q No?

A No.

Q OK. But you do say that, at some point, they were

your main promoter.

A I did most of my work with them.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I'm going to show you a

document dated May 9th, 2000. I want you to look at it---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---and once you're ready, I'll

ask you some questions.



Q Do you recognize this document?

A Yes, I do.

Q OK. It has your signature?

A "Ese garabato es mío", yes.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Did you catch that?

THE REPORTER: Yes.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK.

Q And it's on the M&M Associates letterhead, correct?

A Uh-huh.


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Q And what is this?

I have to ask you--- You're going to have to answer

in words---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---not in "uh-huhs", because

she can't---

THE DEPONENT: Oh, I'm sorry.

THE REPORTER: You have to verbalize.

THE DEPONENT: Yes, sir.


Q What is this document about?

A From what I read, apparently, there was a database

that had someone, which happened frequently, present---

representing themselves as my managers, or something, and

periodically, I would get--- ah--- this type of enquiry, and---

ah--- I guess this is the answer, saying that the only people

that had the authority to represent me are these two.

Q And who is Pollstar Magazine?

A I have no idea.

Q You've no idea. And who is Rubén Blades Productions,

Inc.?

A That is my company.

Q And it has--- it says management. What is the

difference between booking and management?

A The booking, like I said before--you know--managers


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determine what you're going to do. That's why I never had a

manager in my life. If I had a manager, I could have not done

all the things that I've done.

Booking means that you're going to be doing shows,

very specific shows. You're not obliged to give them fifteen

percent of everything you make; you're not obliged to consult

with them over film offers; you're not supposed to--- to--- to

have any specific obligation with booking. Booking books. They

call, or they propose to you a show, or somebody calls them.

It's a whole different thing.

Q So---

A The--- the--- Excuse me.

Q Go ahead.

A The word management here is management. But there's

no manage--- I never had a manager.

Q And is Rubén Blades Productions, Inc., a company

owned by you?

A Yes, sir.

Q Solely owned by you?

A As far as I can think of. Maybe my wife had something

to do with it.

Q OK. As of May 9th, 2000, where did you live?

A I'm sorry?

Q As of May 9th, 2000, where did you live?

A In Los Angeles.


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Q You've lived in Los Angeles since when?

A First--- ah--- '86.

Q OK. Now, I notice that this--- the first paragraph of

this letter says: "Please, be advised that the information in

the database concerning my representation is incorrect".

A Uh-huh.

Q "Martínez, Morgalo and Associates, Inc., and Rubén

Blades Productions, Inc., are the only companies that have

authority to represent me."

A Uh-huh.

Q You were stating here--were you not?--that Martínez,

Morgalo and Associates and Rubén Blades Productions were the

only companies authorized to represent you.

A What I was saying there is they can speak for me.

Q And whomever appear in their database was wrong?

A I don't know what appeared in their database.

Q OK. Now, I also notice that the address that appears

here for Martínez, Morgalo and Associates is 350 Broadway,

suite 1211---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---New York---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---correct?

A Uh-huh.

Q And it's---


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THE REPORTER: Yes?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Yes, the "uh-huhs" are---

We're going to have to deal with the "uh-huhs".

THE DEPONENT: I'm sorry?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: You need to say yes.

THE REPORTER: You have to verbalize the answers.

THE DEPONENT: Oh, yes. I apologize.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I know, it happens to

everyone, so don't---

THE DEPONENT: I'm sorry.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---worry about it.

THE DEPONENT: Yes.


Q And it also appears to be the same address for Rubén

Blades Productions, Inc., correct?

A Yes, it's the same.

Q And is that--- was that a true statement back then?

A That they're both there, yes.

Q And they have the same phone number. Or had the same

phone number?

A Uh-huh.

Q Yes?

A Yes. I'm sorry.

Q And the same fax number.

A Yes.


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Q OK. Would it be safe to say that the same person

would answer the phone, both for Rubén Blades Productions and

for Martínez and Morgalo?

A Yes, it would be safe to say.

MS. GONZALEZ: Let the record reflect counsel Saavedra

just passed counsel Hernández Mayoral a note.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: You'd like a copy of it?

MS. GONZALEZ: Yes.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Take the same.

MS. GONZALEZ: Counsel, I would like a copy of it.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Sure, but I'm not going to give

it to you.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Well---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: I know you would, but I'm not

going to give it to you.


Q Did Rubén Blades Productions, Inc., have any

employees at 350 Broadway, suite 11, as of May 9th, 2000?

A No.

Q So the people from Martínez and Morgalo would provide

that service to Rubén Blades---

A I think---

Q ---Productions, Inc.?

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection. What service?

THE DEPONENT: What service?


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MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Well, answering the phone.

THE DEPONENT: If somebody called there, I think they

would tell me: "Rubén, somebody called for Rubén Blades

Productions".


Q OK. You didn't have an office, personally.

A I'm surprised it's there, because my business manager

has always been Jerry Shustek. Business manager.

Q Yes, but you did sign this.

A Yes, I'm not discussing that I signed it or not.


MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "¿Tú lo marcaste o no lo quieres

marcar?"

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "Sí." I'm going to mark this

as exhibit 1.

(Whereupon, exhibit 1 was marked for the record.)

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I'm going to show you--- I'm

showing you what appears to be a photocopy of a July 22nd,

2000, Billboard Magazine cover---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---and I draw your attention

to the story that says "Innovative Route"--or "Route",

depending on what part of the country you come--for Latino

Tours".



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MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: And it has the M&M Associates

logo, the same one that's in the letter.


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: And it says: "New York based

Martínez, Morgalo and Associates, founded by Robert Morgalo and

Arturo Martínez, in association with Rubén Blades---"


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "---is on target to exceed

first year projections by more than one million."



Q Do you recall reading this story back then?

A Not really.

Q Is this the first time you see this, or have you seen

it in relation to this case?

A In this case? No. First time I see it.

Q OK. Now, it says here that it was founded by Robert

Morgalo and Arturo Martínez, in association with Rubén Blades.

A Uh-huh.

Q Is that true?

A Depending on what you mean by that. It doesn't say

MM&B---

Q That is right.

A ---so---

Q But this story that appeared--- that apparently


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appeared on Billboard Magazine---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---says "in association with Rubén Blades". Did you,

back then, when Martínez and Morgalo were going to start their

own company---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---did you promote the idea that they do that?

A I encouraged them.

Q Encourage. That's the word I was looking for.

A Absolutely.

Q And did they form the company relying on having your

business?

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection. Speculative.

A I have no idea.


Q But when you encouraged them to start---

A No.

Q ---to go on their own--- You said you encouraged them

to go---

A Yes, after they said: "We think we should do this".

Q When you encouraged them---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---what was the content of that encouragement?

A I think people who work by themselves do better.

Q Did part of the encouragement include offering them


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your business?

A No.

Q But you did, in fact, give them---

A I encou--- I didn't offer them the business

exclusively.

Q That's right, but you--- but---

A "I'll work with you guys."

Q Do you have any idea of why the story would say that

they founded the company in association with you?

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection, speculative.

A I--- I don't.


Q You don't.

A No. Like I said, it doesn't say MM&B.

Q Do you recall what bookings M&M did for you in the

year 2000? I know that's a little far away, but---

A Do I remember? Sir, I really don't.

Q How many concerts and shows would you do in a year,

around that date, around the year 2000?

A I don't know, because I had other things to do, like

films, so--- I didn't work all the time.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I'm going to have this marked

as exhibit 2.




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Q But would you do more than once concert a year?

A Yes.

Q And when I say--- I'm going to say musical

engagement, to use---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---the term that you used.

A I would hope so. More---

Q And would you---

A ---than one.

Q ---do more than five?

A Yes.

Q More than ten?

A Probably. It really depends on the price, on the

amount of the money earned--- earned in the business office---

ah--- film office.

Q Back then---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---say, year 2000, 2001, and 2002---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---what percentage of your bookings were carried out

through Morgalo and--- Martínez and Morgalo?

A I have no idea. Of--- of music business?

Q Yes.

A I don't know.

Q You don't know because you don't remember, or you


24


don't know because you've never known?

A I've never known. I mean, what percentage?

Q Yes. I mean, the--- They were, according to that

letter signed by you---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---they would do bookings for you.

A Right.

Q And my question is, during the three year period

between--I mean--2000, 2001, and 2002, out of the totality of

musical engagements you had, how many were booked by Martínez,

Morgalo and Associates?

A I don't know, I mean---

Q What percentage?

A I don't know. I don't know what percentage.

Q OK. Do you think it would have been more than fifty

percent?

A Probably.

Q More than seventy five percent?

A I have no idea, sir.


(Pause.)

Q Did M&M provide any consulting services to you?

A Not that I can recall. Consulting?

Q Yes.

A Not to my recollection.


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Q And just to finish this thing about the May 9th

letter, did you pay M&M any fees for identifying your company

with their same address?

A Not that I remember.

Q Who's office was actually located at that address?

A I have no idea. I don't remember. What office? Must

have been them. I have--- I have---

Q M&M's?

A I don't know.

Q OK.

A I guess.

Q But you don't---? You wouldn't pay any fee---

A No.

Q ---any rent?

A No.

Q OK. Mr. Blades, did Martínez, Morgalo and Associates

obtain an engagement contract for a concert by you in Puerto

Rico for September of 2002?

I'm going to show you--- Now, let me show you---

(Pause.)

THE DEPONENT: I don't remember seeing this.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. I am showing you a

document that has a Martínez, Morgalo and Associates name and

address at the top---



26


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---it's titled "Engagement

contract", it has a 17th September, 2002, date, and it's

unsigned, it's two page document, and it---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: It was produced by---?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: By Martínez.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: No, I---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Yes, this means it was produced

by Rubén Blades.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. It was produced by your

attorney during discovery in this case---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---I believe, and it makes

reference to a concert on November 23rd, 2002, once concert

performance at the Coliseo Rubén Rodríguez.

Q Do you recall that?

A No.

Q You don't recall playing there that day?

A No.

Q You have no recollection about this event---

A No.

Q ---or the details surrounding it? Whether it got

canceled, whether it was held---

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection, compound.



27


Q Whether it was canceled?

A I said no. Do I remember this? No.

Q Remember receiving a payment for this concert?

A No.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I'm going to mark it as

exhibit 3.



Q Now, Mr. Blades, have you ever had a canceled

concert, or a concert canceled?

A Sure.

Q Let's say, on account of the promoter canceling the

concert. Has that happened to you?

A Probably.

Q OK. What is your customary practice when that

happens, in terms of any deposit that might have been paid to

you?

A Depends what the scenarios are.

Q Have you ever returned money given to you when a

concert gets canceled?

A I don't recall. Probably. Or not. I don't know. I

don't---

Q You don't know?

A ---remember that. No.

Q When was the last time you had a concert canceled?


28


A Over five years ago. That's for sure.

Q OK. And you don't recall whether you have had to

return money or not?

A I didn't really have many concerts canceled by me.

Q I don't mean by you. I mean by the other side.

A I have not--- What other side?

Q Well, the promoter; the person who's engaging you for

the concert.

A Not many. I don't remember having concerts canceled.

Q OK.

A Specifically.

Q Now, Mr. Blades, you know that we are here regarding

a concert that you did with Mr. Willy Colón, correct?

A Yes, sir.

Q Do you recall when that concert was held?

A With all this, it's--- ah--- It was in--- in 2003.

Q OK. To the best of recollection how did the idea of

doing that concert originate?

A They called me.

Q You mean Mr. Morgalo?

A Uh-huh.

Q You said they. Martínez and Morgalo?

A The agency.

Q They called you and said what?

A "There's a great concert, great idea for a concert,


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and we spoke to some promoters in Puerto Rico, and they're

offering a lot of money to do this concert with Willy Colón and

you." Siembra, or whatever.

Q OK. Did they say that it was their idea, or it was

the idea of some promoters in Puerto Rico?

A I don't recall them explaining who's idea was. They

just said: "There's a tremendous chance here, it's a lot of

money to do this concert".

Q That would have been like a significant date with

regards to Siembra, right?

A So they said.

Q Was like the 20th anniversary, or something like

that?

A I don't remember.

Q And so, they called you, and they said that, and what

did you tell them?

A No.

Q That you weren't interested?

A Right.

Q And what happened next?

A What happened next is that they called me again.

Q Mr. Morgalo and---? Martínez and Morgalo?

A I can't remember who, who it was

Q But it was---

A Or--- or---


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Q ---from the agency?

A ---or Willy called me. Huh?

Q It was from the---? OK., go ahead. You don't remember

who it was?

A First time, I said no.

Q Why did you say no?

A Why?

Q Yes.

A I didn't need the money, I was involved in like three

films, and working in another one, I had an album, Mundo, that

I was about to release, and I thought it was stupid to do that

concert with my album coming out. I had--- ah--- I really

didn't have any reason, because we had already done the '93

concert, and I felt like--you know--we're going to go back and

play the same things again---

Q OK. So then, you recall--- Again, you don't recall

who called you?

A No. I think maybe Willy called me. I think they

called him.

Q After speaking to you?

A Right.

Q And he might have thought it was a good idea?

A Yes.

Q And did it come a time when you said: "Yes, I'll do

the concert"?


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A I spoke to him about it, and he gave me his reasons.

MS. GONZALEZ: Let the record reflect the witness is

pointing to Mr. Colón.

THE DEPONENT: Willy gave me his reasons, which I

calibrated, and then, I said OK.


Q And when you said OK., what happened?

A No, the thing continued moving. The process continued

through the office, M&M.

Q OK. Who is Arturo?

A I'm sorry?

Q Arturo. Who is Arturo?

A Arturo Martínez?

Q Yes. I mean, if I said Arturo in the context of this

case, you would think it's Mr. Martínez?

A In the context of this meeting?

Q Of this concert, of the---

A Yes.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. I'm going to show you a

document.

(Pause.)

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: It's a document in Spanish, it

has a handwritten date of January 21, 2003, to someone referred

to as Arturo, and it's unsigned, but it has two names at the

end, Ariel Rivas and César Sainz. Once you have a chance of


32


looking through it, I'll ask you some questions.

(Long pause.)



Q You've seen it?

A Yes.

Q Do you know who Ariel Rivas and César--- who Ariel

Rivas is?

A Absolutely

Q Who is he?

A He's a promoter.

Q And César Sainz?

A He's also a promoter.

Q A promoter based in Puerto Rico?

A I think so, yes. I don't know if they still are, but

I think they were then.

Q And Arturo, you would say is Arturo Martínez?

A Yes, sir. I would think so.

Q Based on the content of the document, it would seem

that it's addressed at Arturo Martínez, correct?

A Right.

Q And it says, in the first paragraph, that this is in

reference to a May 3rd concert, correct?

A Aha.

Q And the May 3rd--- That was the date of a concert


33


that you---

A Yes.

Q ---did with Mr. Colón, correct?

A Right. Yes.

Q So, even though the date here is handwritten, we at

least know, from the context, that this is a 2003 document,

because it says: "On May 3rd of this year".

A Where does it say that?

Q The same--- The first sentence.

A Aha. Yes.

Q And they're talking about starting the promotion on

February the 3rd, correct? The next paragraph.

A Uh-huh.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. Now, I want you to look at

the bottom third of the document, where it says Arturo, and

then, it has some bullets.


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: First, bullet says: "We've

been working on the possibility of presenting Rubén in Puerto

Rico since 2001---".

Q Are you aware of that?

A No.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "---where we made the first

approach to Rubén, personally, in Los Angeles".

Q You don't remember that? During the Grammies. A


34


Grammy thing for Paul Simon.

A I remember the--- Paul Simon. I don't remember them

talking to me. People come and talk to you about all kinds of

things. I don't---

Q And that wouldn't be something that you would

particularly remember?

A No, why would I?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Now, the second bullet says:

"We have complied with the corresponding deposits---"


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "---for the Rubén show---"

"puntualmente" meaning "on time", I guess---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---when you have requested it.

"Given the case that you already have the first sixty two

thousand five hundred dollars that we sent several months ago."


A No.

Q Is it your testimony that you have no recollection

that, let's say---

A Never.

Q ---assuming that this state is correct, that as of

January 21, 2003, César Sainz and Ariel Rivas were stating that

they had already---

A No.


35


Q ---given a sixty two thousand five hundred dollar

deposit?

A Absolutely not.

Q And that they had been working for a year and a half

on this project?

A On the Siembra thing? I don't know what---

Q I can't---

A ---that means.

Q I don't know. It says: "on this project"; "to make

this project a reality".

A I have no idea---

Q OK.

A ---what he means by that.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Then, the last--- the last---

OK. The last bullet on that page says: "We're sure that we can

find a favorable solution for everybody".

Q Do you recall any conflicts regarding the contract---

the engagement---

A Not from---

Q ---on the early part of 2003?


A No.

MS. GONZALEZ: The engagement.

THE DEPONENT: I think that they're talking about---

from what I see in this paper, about the Salsa, Día de la


36


Salsa. That's what I think they're talking about. They seem to

be complaining that there's going to be--- that I'm going to do

Día de la Salsa, and that's going to clash with the date of

their concert. That's what I think they're talking about.


THE DEPONENT: I don't have any idea about what he

means, or what Arturo said, or--- You know, I don't know

what--- what it is.


Q Because on the second page, they're talking about how

to promote the concert, right? The Rubén and Willy concert. The

top two proposals.

A I'm--- I'm very sorry. I don't--- I didn't get that.

Q You're saying that you think they're talking about

the conflict between El Día Nacional de la Salsa and---

A Only responding to what you said. "Estamos seguros de

que podemos encontrar una solución favorable para todos." I

don't know what he means, other than maybe he's talking about

appear--- He says: "Es para nosotros de suma importancia

comenzar la promoción, por lo menos, tres meses anti...

anticipación..." eh... "y respetamos los lazos que unen a Rubén

con el Día Nacional de la Salsa y disfrutamos..." blah, blah,

blah, "sin embargo, la posibilidad de que Rubén se presente

nuevamente este año conflige con la promoción."

"Y me imagino que es eso."


37


Q OK. So they talk---

A I have no idea.

Q OK.

A I'm just saying, from what this paper means, you're

asking me?

Q You were not told by Mr. Martínez or Mr. Morgalo, at

this point in time, January 21, 2003, that César Sainz and

Rivas had stated they already paid sixty two thousand five

hundred dollars?

A No.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. I'll have this marked as

the next exhibit.


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I'm going to show you another

document. It's stapled.

And my first question would be--- And they have

consecutive Bates numbers. "Eso es de ella, ¿verdad?"

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "Bueno, nosotros se lo pusimos,

pero pones así."

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I think they go together, but

if they don't--- if you don't think they go together---

THE DEPONENT: I have no--- no clue.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I would like to have you look

at it, and after you've gone over it, I'll ask you some

questions.


38


(Pause.)



Q OK. The first page is a document on the M&M

Associates letterhead, dated January 22nd, 2003, addressed to

César Sainz and Ariel Rivas, it says: "Reference Rubén Blades

and Willy Colón", and it's signed by Arturo Martínez.

Q Do you recognize Mr. Martínez's signature?

A No.

Q 'Cause you've never seen it before, or---?

A Do I recognize it? No.

Q Yes. But you don't--- You wouldn't say that this is

not his signature? That's---

A I cannot say it is---

Q OK.

A ---either. I don't know.

Q OK. And it says: "Based on our conversations, I

confirm the date of May the 3rd, 2003, for the exclusive

presentation of Rubén Blades and Willy Colón at the Hiram

Bithorn Stadium in Puerto Rico". Correct?

A Uh-huh. I'm sorry, yes.

Q And that would be a correct statement, right? That

date was confirmed in that venue, for that venue.

A There was---



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THE DEPONENT: Yes. The statement that I can confirm

to you is that the concert was realized, it happened on the 3rd

of May, with Willy Colón, in--- at the Bithorn---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: In---

THE DEPONENT: ---in Puerto Rico.


Q OK. In the usual course of the business of musical

engagements, would this be a document that is generated at some

point in time?

A I'm sorry, sir?

Q In the music business---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---when dealing with musical engagements---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---is this the type of document that is generated at

some point in time? The confirmation of the booking.

A It's the first time I hear of somebody signing a

document confirming a date.

Q And are you saying that it is unusual, or are you

saying that you just don't know---

A I've---

Q ---whether this---

A ---never seen---

Q ---is the way---?

A ---it before it happened.


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Q Yes, but the question is: do you think--- do you find

this unusual, or is it---?

A Yes, I do.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. Let's take a look at the

second page.

THE DEPONENT: I did.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. It says "contract offer".



Q You know what this document is about?

A I imagine it is--- I can--- I can see that it has

the--- ah--- the points of the concert, except the name of the

artist, they inverted the usual. It should have read Willy

Colón and Rubén Blades.

Q Why would that be?

A Because that's the way it's always been.

Q Ah, it's a historical, traditional thing? Because

that's---

A It's a dif---

Q ---that's the way it started?

A It's a difference to Willy.

Q And--- But my question was: what is this document

about?

A I would imagine these are the points, the--- the

specific points about the show; when it was going to be held,


41


how much money was going to be paid--- ah--- offered by these

people, the promoters, and--- ah--- they offered three fifty,

plus sound and lights.

Q And---

A All inclusive.

Q And is this an accurate statement of what you

considered the deal to be?

A Yes, sir. We had to pay for everything, except for

sound and lights.

Q And is this document a document that is typically

generated in this type of business?

A This? Yes. This type of thing, yes.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. I will have it marked as

the next exhibit.

THE REPORTER: Exhibit 5.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Exhibit 5.


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I'll show you another

document.

Let's look at it, and when you're done looking at it,

I'll ask you some questions.

(Pause.)


Uh-huh.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Now, this is---


42


THE DEPONENT: Ah, yes.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: You've seen it. OK. This is a

two page document, it says Martínez, Morgalo and Associates at

the top, it has a title--- it's titled "Engagement contract",

has a date on the first paragraph, 22nd day of January, 2003,

and the second page has signature lines, although it doesn't

have a signature. Dissar, D-i-s-s-a-r, Production, Ariel Rivas,

with a Caguas address, and on the other side, it says Martínez,

Morgalo and Associates, FSO Rubén Blades and Willy Colón, and

on the bottom, it says Arturo Martínez, agent.

Q Have you seen this document before?

A Probably. I don't remember it, but probably I--- I

did. It doesn't surprise me.

Q Is this the typical format of an engagement contract

for a---

A Yes.

Q ---show? And again, it mentions the name of the

artist, Rubén Blades and Willy Colón, you said that was

inverted, was--- but it's in reference to the concert that was

held on May 3rd?

A Say that again, I'm sorry.

Q OK. It's says--- it identifies you and Mr. Colón as

the artist---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---and it identifies the engagement date as May 3rd,


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2003, correct?

A Yes.

Q And the amount to be paid would be three hundred and

fifty thousand dollars.

A Right.

Q Now, I want you to look at number 7---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---where it says how the payments would be made by

the employer.

A Right.

Q First deposit in the amount of sixty two thousand

five hundred dollars, received April 2002. Do you know what

that is a reference to?

A You know what I think? I think they were two

different papers issued, and this one was done after.

Q After the first one?

A I would think, because if I had seen that, I would

have asked.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. Let's mark that one--- I'm

going to show you the--- another document, but let's mark that,

let's put a number to it. It would be exhibit?

MS. GONZALEZ: 6.

THE REPORTER: 6.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Exhibit 6. I'll hand it back

to you.


44


In the meantime, I'm going to show you this one.


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK., exhibit 6. And I want you

to look a the other one---

(Pause.)

MR. MORGALO: Is this one 6a, 6b? 7?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: No, we're going to do it 7,

but after he has looked through it.

OK. Let me mark the other one, before I ask you

questions, so that we don't get confused; so we can make

reference to numbers.



Q OK., Mr. Blades, you said--- Looking at exhibit 6---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---you stated that---

A This is exhibit 6? 6?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Yes. You thought--- "A la

izquierda. El que está abajo, a la izquierda..."

THE DEPONENT: "Oh, perdón."

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "...es el de esta deposición."

Q That you thought that there was another one, and

that this was--- this one was done after?

A If I see--- I remember being surprised by the fact,

when we were arguing--and I'm going ahead--about the


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deposits---

Q You're going ahead in time?

A Yes.

Q You're going to after the concert in time, or are you

going---?

A No, before, when we were---

Q Before the concert? OK.

A We're trying to determine if the guys had paid or

not.

Q OK.

A The fact that they were saying they had paid this

money, and I said that's not true, because I was told that they

had not paid. This is money that was owed.

Q OK.

A So the fact that this showed up at all, as an

advance, was something that I have in my--- in my brain,

because we never got that money.

Q OK. Let me backtrack a little bit, so I can---

A So---

Q ---sort this out---

A I'm sorry. So---

Q ---sort this out. I showed you what's been marked

exhibit 7---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---prompted by your reaction that there was another


46


document that didn't have that advance.

A It's very obvious to me that, if I see this---

Q You're looking at exhibit 6, yes.

A ---exhibit 6, saying: "first deposit in the amount of

sixty two thousand five hundred dollars, received April, 2002",

there's something wrong---

Q But you---

A ---right away.

Q OK. But did you see this document, exhibit 6, before

the concert?

A I'm sorry?

Q Did you see this document before the concert?

A Which one? The 6?

Q Yes, the 6.

A I don't recall that, seeing it before--- That

document itself, no. I don't remember seeing it before.

Q OK., but you did mention, a few minutes ago, that

before the concert, there was a controversy as to whether the--

- what they call here the employer---

A Monies had been paid.

Q Had been paid.

A Uh-huh.

Q And did at that point the issue of them claiming that

they had already paid sixty two thousand five hundred dollars

arise?


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A That's correct.

Q And they were saying that they had paid that back in

2002?

A At some point. Remember that everything came in--- in

a matter--- hours, days; two, three days, all this information.

Personally, I thought they were not being truthful.

Q They meaning who?

A The promoter. I didn't think that they had paid.

Q You mean Rivas and Sainz?

A Right. I thought that they were--- You know, for

whatever reasons, promoters do that. They tell you they paid,

and they're--- they're holding back, or whatever. I didn't

think that there was going to be anything wrong, that "I feel

they're going to pay, they're just late", or something. But---

Because I kept asking the office: "What's going on? Is the

money coming?" When---?" "Well, they're taking long--you know--

but--- blah, blah---"

Q When you say the office, you're referring to what?


Q OK.

A So, all of a sudden, I get a call from the newspaper

here, a guy who--you know--writes for a newspaper here, and I

said to him: "I don't know if this is going to happen, because

we haven't gotten paid". Then, he printed something, and that

made the people over here react. And then, they started saying:


48


"No, they paid", and then, they talked to somebody that I know,

who called me, and said: "These people are good people".

And that's when we started, then, finding out what

had really happened. And including, in the conversations during

that period, came out this thing, which really was a stunner.

Q When you say---

A When they first said something about having paid

already sixty two thousand, because I said: "Where's the money?

You know, where's this money?" And they said: "No we paid that

a while ago, because we had a canceled show, and then, we

applied this money to this", and I said: "What canceled show?

What are you talking about?"

Q Going back to exhibit 3--I'm going to show it to you

again--you mentioned earlier that you didn't recall whether

that concert took place or didn't take place.

A Ecuador?

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Ecuador?

MS. GONZALEZ: Uh-huh.

(Pause.)

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Which exhibit number do you

have?

THE DEPONENT: 3.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: 3?

THE DEPONENT: Now you're really confusing.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Now, well, let me see that.


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Maybe I'm confusing myself. Where do you say Ecuador?

THE DEPONENT: "Allá abajo." The money has to be paid

before leaving.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Oh, you're talking about---

Because it's a concert for Rubén Rodríguez Coliseum, right?

THE DEPONENT: "Pero aquí abajo dice: `Artist must

receive payment in full thirty days prior to departure for the

Ecuador'."

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I'm trying to find--- ah---

Oh, I see.

THE DEPONENT: I'm sorry. It's point 7.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I see, I see.

Q Well, would you have had a concert in Ecuador before

the concert in Puerto Rico? Could that be a reference to that?

A I don't remember, sir.

Q OK. Do you have a file with your---

A Proba---

Q ---where you---

A Didn't we---?

Q ---have your musical engagements?

A Me, personally, a file? No. But---

Q I mean, if you had to reconstruct where you played,

when---

A I would have to ask my--- my business office, and we

could, maybe, check through---


50


MS. GONZALEZ: Maybe his questions are better posed to

Mr. Morgalo, or his partner, Arturo Martínez. They can explain

the document.

THE DEPONENT: But maybe---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: It could be, but--- but---

THE DEPONENT: ---tax returns---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---I--- I---

MR. MORGALO: Can I take a look at---? Can I have a

copy of that, sir, to take a look at it?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: You do have a copy.

MR. MORGALO: Well, I don't.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Yes, but---

MR. MORGALO: Oh, number 3 you said? Oh, number 3.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Yes. But---

THE DEPONENT: November 23rd---

MR. MORGALO: This one?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: But now that we've come to the

point where you're stating that you were told---

THE DEPONENT: I'm sorry, sir?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I'm just trying to sort things

out.

THE DEPONENT: I know.

THE DEPONENT: So are we.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: You know, we're trying to---

THE DEPONENT: Understand


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MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---to get all the facts---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: First, understand. Firstly,

understand.


Q I think you just stated that, at some point before

the concert---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---a controversy arose as to whether Rivas and Sainz

had paid in full.

A "Así es."

Q And they were claiming that they had paid sixty two

thousand five hundred dollars---

A Let me--- Can I expand on that?

Q Yes, sure, sure.

A When the issue arose---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Let's go off the record for a

second.

(Off the record.)


THE DEPONENT: When the issue arose about whether

these people had made the--- these people meaning the

promoters, had made the payments or not, they began to submit--

- I think they did it very quickly, 'cause we were supposed to-

-- I was supposed to rehearse with Willy on the--- on the

Wednesday before leaving--on Thursday I think we were supposed


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to leave--and then, we were supposed to have a press conference

on Friday, and then, we had to play on Saturday.


THE DEPONENT: I think that's the way it was. So, I

didn't go to the rehearsal, because I'm waiting from the papers

from these guys. They had to tell me--- you know, send me all

this stuff. And this all happened because of a woman here that

I trusted, her name is Tuti Bou, and she works for Sony. And

Tuti called me, and said: "Rubén, I read the paper, these guys

are good people, they're serious people, and they're saying---

they showed me stuff", and I said: "Well, show it to me. I want

to see that."

Within that explanation, within the scope of all

that, there was a mention of the sixty--- Because I started

adding up. And I said: "You know, we're missing, not just the

last payment", or whatever it was that they were supposed to

make, and didn't make, or--- or didn't show, but there was this

other figure, and I said: "What is---" you know, "What is this

about?" And then, the claim was: "No, no, that was given"--you

know--"in advance, a concert you were supposed to do, and

canceled, that money was applied to that show". And then, I

thought--- I remember I called my office to try to check and

see--you know--if they have any remember--- if--- remember this

thing. And it was like in, to this date, we don't know what

that was.


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Q But they did show that they had sent Martínez and

Morgalo six--- that money at---

A There was---

Q ---some point?

A ---something. I mean, I gave all those papers that I

received. I gave---

Q Yes.

A ---them all. So, proba--- most likely, it had to be

there, because they had their stuff very well documented, I

have to say. Those guys were very clean, I mean, everything was

there. So, I--- I can't--- ah--- confirm it, but I would think

that it wasn't just that they said they sent it--you know--

because they can talk whatever they want. I--- I'm pretty sure

I must have seen something that convinced me they had, in fact,

sent that money. Otherwise, you know---

Q Now, to the best of your recollection, did you ever

agree to perform on Coliseo Rubén Rodríguez on November of

2002?

A No, not that I remember at all. I don't remember

that--- that--- that date.

Q OK.

A What--- what concert was it?

Q Well, the one that--- on exhibit 3, the one that---

A No, but I mean---

Q ---says that you have---


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A ---why---?

Q ---to be paid before you left for Ecuador.

A I--- I have to say I don't remember.

Q But it could have happened?

A I think it could be checked, if I ever played here.

I think that's something that should be on the record.

Q Well, I think what--- I think the fact is that you

didn't play here. What I'm---

A Oh.

Q What I'm trying to--- On that day. What I'm trying to

ask you is whether you recall---

A No, I don't.

Q ---doing this engagement, and then, getting a deposit

for it---

A No, no, no, no. No. Not at all.

Q Is it your best recollection that no such thing ever

happened?

A No. Yes.

Q OK. Now, going back to exhibit 6 and 7---

A But whether or not I played, it's something that

could be checked. I don't recall ever playing this show.

Q But you do recall Mr. Sainz and Mr. Rivas saying:

"Well, the thing is we had sent sixty two thousand five hundred

dollars---"

A Only---


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Q "---for a concert at---".

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection. Misquoting the witness.

THE DEPONENT: Yes. Only--- only in terms of the

explanation they did when they felt that we were going to

cancel because they hadn't paid.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: No, I agree. That's the basis

of my question.

THE DEPONENT: Basically---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: They were claiming that.

THE DEPONENT: But I--- I'm saying I con--- I think I

must have seen something, because when I was adding up this

stuff, there were sixty two whatever--- no--- They didn't come

up. So where is this? This is--- This was a question also that,

in the press conference, I talked about it.

In the press conference, I talked several times about

the fact that I had been surprised about the fact that there

were sixty two five hundred thousand dollars that these guys

were saying that they had sent to the office. I said: "Where

was that? Did we ever receive that money? No, we didn't receive

that money."

And again, I see this thing you have over here,

saying that the money was sent in April, 2002, and that was a

re--- a huge red flag, if I had seen that. To say: "Where---

where did that money come from, that sixty two?" They would

have to explain to me where did the money come---


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And fir--- And let me say something else for the

record. Would have been dishonest with him, because then, that

means that he would have gotten screwed out of sixty two

thousand dollars.

MS. GONZALEZ: Let the record reflect---

THE DEPONENT: I'm sorry, Willy.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Yes.

MS. GONZALEZ: ---the deponent pointed to Mr. Colón.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Let's go back to 6 and 7. On

exhibit 7, which is a copy of an engagement contract, in

similar format to exhibit 6, except for what we've been

discussing about number 7, which says--- On exhibit 7, it says

that the payments would be made in the following manner: first

deposit in the amount of sixty two thousand five hundred

dollars due immediately---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---and--you know--the second

deposit in the amount of eighty seven thousand five hundred

dollars---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---due March 22nd 2003---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---third deposit in the amount

of eighty seven thousand five hundred dollars, US dollars, due

April 1st, 2003, and the balance of a hundred and twelve


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thousand five hundred dollars shall be paid no later than April

22nd, 2003.

Q Is that---? Does that reflect your understanding of

what the deal was?

A I have to say I don't remember specifically this, but

I--- it looks fine to me.

Q And when you compare that to--- Well, strike that. Do

you recall how the payments were actually received?

A No. But I remember, when I spoke to these guys about-

-- Because I'm very much a stickler--you know--I like to get my

money paid in advance, I want it paid in the--- in the times.

Promoters usually don't do that.

And then, you're faced with the problem if having

received some money, the guys are selling the tickets, and

then, they don't pay when they're supposed to pay, if you

cancel, you're going to hurt a lot of people on that, so you

figure always end up giving them a little more rope, you know?

Q And they know that?

A They probably do know that, but in this particular

issue, the promoter said that the terms had been changed by the

office.

Q Meaning Martínez and Morgalo?

A Correct. I thought--- That they were going to--- You

know, I don't know. It--- What was a new arrangement, because

I--- I was on top of the thing: "Where's the money? Where's the


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money? Where's the money?", after we got all the information of

what had happened after the thing came out in the paper, after

they were like--- you know---

Q What was your agreement with Willy Colón with regards

to this concert?

A Half and half of whatever it was after expenses.

Q And what about the duties of each?

A I'm sorry?

Q The duties.

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection, vague.


Q Well, what---?

A Base---

Q Besides playing---

A No, basically--- No.

Q Or what else---? Was there a distribution of tasks?

A He was going to--- he was going to be looking after

the music, and what not, and I'm going to be after the office,

telling them: "Where's the money? Did the money come in? How

you got---? What's going on? What's happening?" That sort of

thing.

Q And you were going to split the proceeds?

A After taking out all the expenses.

Q And what would the expenses be?

A I--- At the end, it was like---


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Q No, I'm not talking about the amounts. What---

A I'm sorry---

Q ---would be---

A Oh.

Q ---in terms of categories; what were the---?

A Hotels, band, the cost of the band "per diem", air

travel, food, rehearsal---

Q And who would pay for that initially?

A We would.

Q What? Who is we?

A Willy and I.

Q I mean, would you write checks, fifty fifty, or---?

A The company would write the checks.

Q What company would write the checks?

A I'm sorry. Martínez Morgalo would pay--you know--give

out the advance for the rehearsal, the studio, whatever was

needed.

Q Let me follow the money flow here.

A Uh-huh.

Q Pursuant to whichever contract is the one that

Martínez Morgalo and the promoters had, the money would be paid

to whom?

A Martínez Morgalo's office.

Q They would receive, presumably, the checks in---

according to the schedule that's in the contract?


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A Correct.

Q And they would pay the expenses before paying you

guys?

A Absolutely.

Q And where would that---? When would they---? When

were they supposed to pay you two?

A I think after the gig.

Q OK. And you---?

A After the show.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Aha. I think everybody got

that.

(Pause.)

Q And you would be informed by Mr. Martínez or Mr.

Morgalo as to whether money had come in?

A Right.

Q OK. So, before the concert---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---you're saying that, in the days, few days prior to

the concert, you thought the promoter had not paid in full?

A I thought several things. One thing I thought was the

money was there. I mean, I--- I--- I had no reason not to

believe the money wasn't there. First of all, I never had this

happen to me before. One.

Two, it was too big a concert.

Three, these guys--- You know, I didn't have any


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reason to believe they weren't going to pay, being that it was

such a notorious type of--- of--- of show. It wasn't like some

show. It was like Willy Colón and myself, in Puerto Rico,

Siembra. "O sea", you know, they're going to pay. Of course

they're going to pay. So, that's one issue.

The other thing was I was told--you know--"They

haven't come, the money `todavía no llega', they're delaying,

`blah, blah, blah'---" You know, so I figured--- That has

happened before.

Q Who's saying that to you? Mr. Morgalo, or Mr.

Martínez?

A The office--- ah---

Q The office meaning M&M?

A Yes.

Q So, you were told by M&M, before the concert, that

they were--- some money hadn't come in?

A That is correct, 'cause I'm seeing the date

approaching, I got a--- You know, I got to--- we got to--- I

got to look after ours--- Then, I'm saying: "What---?" You

know, how's things happening, what's happening with the thing--

-

Q Do you know---

A ---with the money.

Q ---who--- And by that, I mean whether it's the

office, or the promoter in Puerto Rico---


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A Uh-huh.

Q ---who drafts the documents that have being marked

exhibit 3, 6, and 7?



Q No, do you know?

A No---

Q That's not---

A ---I don't.

Q ---speculative.

A No, I frankly don't.

Q You don't know if this is something that's referred

by M&M?

A This--- this, I would think it's M&M. It has the

thing upstairs. It says--- ah--- on the top, it says Martínez,

Morgalo and Associates.

Q OK. So, if you look at exhibit 6---

A Uh-huh.

Q No, strike--- Well, if you look at exhibit 6---

A It also says that.

Q This is not signed. Is it customary for these

documents not to be physically signed?

A It depends at times. I think it--- it--- it is

customary, because they're acting on our behalf, so, they sign

for--- for us.


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Q You don't sign the---?

A No. I don't remember ever signing a contract. So, for

that matter---

Q So, there is an element of trust involved?

A Absolutely.

Q Now---

A With then, every promoter. I mean, it used to be the

same thing with Mercado, God bless him, or whomever, you know.

I don't remember--- I don't remem--- I'm not saying it never

happened, but--- ah--- I don't remember sitting down--- Unless

there was a press thing.

Q OK., based on what you know now---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---did the promoters actually--- had actually paid

those sixty two thousand five hundred dollars?

A I still, to this day, don't know what happened there.

I trust that they did, but--- ah--- frankly--- I mean, I would

think they did. You know, remember that--- remember that

they're saying they paid this in advance. They paid this for a

concert that was canceled. And then, they applied the

cancellation money to the--- as an advance for this show. Since

I never saw the contract, and never received a penny from those

sixty two thousand five hundred, I don't know if that was true

or false. I would assume that it was true, that what they said

was real, given the context of what happened.


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Q To this date, you don't know if M&M contracted with

these promoters for a Rubén Blades concert in 2002 without you

knowing about it?

A Absolutely.

Q You have no---? You don't---?

A No. And as a matter of fact, and maybe I should

mention it also, in the internet, there were--- I'm not a real

internet person--- ah--- but there were rumors about other

shows, of people complaining that they had sent advances--you

know--so I don't--- I don't know--you know--I really don't

know. For shows that never happened.

Q OK.

A So, I really--- I'm not at liberty to say, but---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Now---

(Pause.)

Q OK. Did you---? Do you recall booking--- having any

other concerts booked by Martínez and Morgalo in 2002 period?

A Frankly, no, because remember, I was doing movies,

so---

Q You don't recall ever receiving money from Martínez

and Morgalo on account of canceled concerts?

A No.

Q And your testimony was--I don't have it clear--as to

exhibit 6, the one that talks about a payment having been made-

-- received, actually, on April, 2002, you don't recall having


65


seen this before---

A No, sir.

Q ---the concert?

A Before which concert?

Q Before your concert with Willy.

A Oh, no. This, no.

Q No?

A No.

Q OK.

A Unless--excuse me--you mean in the days before the

concert?

Q Yes.

A I don't remember, but I--- like I said, they sent me

a lot of papers justifying that--- the fact that they had sent

this, and they had done that--you know--so, I don't know. I

may--- If I saw it two, three days before--- But had I seen it

before, no.

Q Did you---?

A Before that moment, no. It would have called my

attention to see something with a 2002 date.

Q But you do recall having been told by a reporter, or

by--- By a reporter?

A By a friend, by a friend. Tuti Bou.

Q No, I think---

A Oh, I'm sorry.


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Q I know where the confusion comes, and maybe it's my

confusion. By a reporter who showed you the payments.

A No.

Q That was Tuti Bou?

A No. Tuti Bou---

Q Tuti Bou told you they were serious people.

A Tuti Bou told me: "They are serious people, I had

seen the receipts".

Q Very well.

A And I said: "Tuti, I trust you, but I--- You know,

you--- I got--- I have to see it myself." And then, they sent

them to me. I don't remember if it was by fax, or by FedEx,

which is why I couldn't go to the rehearsal. I was waiting for

the papers to arrive, so I could look at them, and--- and---

and--- and then, be able to tell Willy something, because I

wasn't sure what the heck was going on.

So, we ended up--- ended up talking to Willy, if I'm

not wrong, that Wednesday night, or in the morning--- ah--- of

the--- of the Thursday, when we talked to the lawyer, you know?

Q Did at any point---? Prior to the concert, once this

incident about payments arises--- arose---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---did you ever contact Mr. Morgalo and Mr. Martínez

to enquire about this allegation regarding the sixty---

A Absolutely---


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Q ---two thousand---?

A ---tried. I called the office, and I could not get

Arturo anywhere. Or--- ah--- Robert wasn't there, so---

Q He was in Afghanistan, I think, or---

A It was not---

MR. MORGALO: Iraq.

THE DEPONENT: As far as I understood---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Iraq.

THE DEPONENT: ---he was not in there, in the office,

at that moment.

MS. GONZALEZ: Let the record reflect that attorney

Saavedra and plaintiff, Mr. Colón, have stepped outside of the

conference room.

THE DEPONENT: And--- ah---


Q OK., so you couldn't reach Mr. Martínez?

A I couldn't reach the o--- In the office, nobody

answered the phone. Let's put it that way. I called, and

called, and called, and called.

Q And was that unusual?

A Ah--- yes, it was. Very unusual.

Q All right. How many people worked there, if you know?

A I don't recall, but--- ah--- I think they had a

secretary. They had somebody else. A lot of the stuff--- I

think they started going through--- You know, maybe they had


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some problems--- ah--- But I--- I think there was--- there

were--- The two of them worked there, physically involved, and-

-- ah--- and then, I think there was a secretary, I--- I think.

Q And you couldn't even reach the secretary?

A There was nobody. No one. I remember I called Juan

also, to ask what happened.

Q Juan?

A Juan Toro.

Q OK. Who is Juan Toro?

A Juan Toro used to work with David Maldonado, and---

and when they were working there, Juan assigned both Roberto

and Arturo to work with me, 'cause I--- you know, I--- I've

seen--- you know, I--- I was not--- ah--- Sometimes, I could be

hard, and--- ah---

MS. GONZALEZ: Let the record reflect that attorney

Saavedra and plaintiff have just returned---

THE DEPONENT: And---

MS. GONZALEZ: ---to the room.

THE DEPONENT: ---and--- ah--- they--- ah--- You know,

they felt I'd go. They know Rubén and they know his quirks and

his stuff, so--you know--they assigned them to me. That's how

I actually began to work with them.


document.

(Pause.)


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MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Take a look at it. I believe

it's identical to exhibit 7, except for some handwritten notes,

and the fact that it bears a fax thing on the top. But in terms

of the content---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---I believe it's the same.

THE DEPONENT: Yes, it is.


Q OK. Do you recognize the handwriting?

A It's mine, I think.

Q And do you know what---? What does it---? What is it

about?

A From what it says, it's all inclusive; means that we

have to pay for everything, and that the promoters only

covering sound and light.

Q Do you know when---? Well, if you know why you wrote

that in there. It's all inclusive a---? A term of art in the

music business?

A No, maybe this is only something that I was writing

after the fact--- ah--- I don't know. To explain Willy--you

know--what it meant, or---

Q And is it accurate? Is that what all inclusive means?

A Well, that's what I understand it means, and that's

what the promoters understand. It said all inclusive, except

for sound and lights, it means we don't pay for anything,


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except for sound and light. We--- You take care of all the

rest.

Q OK. So--- But you don't recall---

A It wasn't a---

Q ---the context in which you wrote this?

A No.

Q Do you see that, at the top, it has a--- like a fax

date 4.10.2003, 8:27---

A Where?

Q ---p--- At the top---

A Aha.

Q ---at the very top.

A Uh-huh.

Q See that?

A Yes. This year. That's this year?

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: No, 2003.

THE DEPONENT: Oh, I'm sorry. April. April 10.


Q Yes. That's like a week before the concert, or---?

A No.

Q I mean---

A "Un mes."

Q "Un mes." So would---? Is it you recollection that

you saw this before the performance?

A Saw what? This?


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Q This, the engagement contract. This one.

A Oh, the--- the original points? We knew about them.

Q Yes, but this, the document. I mean, when you did

this, when you---

A This, I don't recall.

Q When you wrote this note, do you think you wrote

that---? Is it your recollection that you wrote it before the

engagement?

A I don't remember. But like I said, if I did it, was

pro--- was most likely to explain--- ah--- to someone, whether

it was Willy, or the office, or I don't know what--- what it

meant. I knew what it meant.

Q OK.

A But certainly, I didn't write it for my benefit, you

know.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. I'm going to mark it as 8.


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. Going back to that--- the

days before the concert, there's this controversy as to whether

you've been paid, or you haven't been paid. You meaning both of

you.

Q Did it come a time when you thought it would be

better not to do the concert---

A Absolutely.

Q ---because of that?


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A Yes, I did.

Q When? When did you---

A I men---

Q ---think you shouldn't do the concert?

A It was so confusing. The whole scenario was so

confusing--- ah--- that I--- My recall--- recollection is that,

on the Thursday--- on the Wednesday night, when I--- I don't

know if Willy called me, or I called him. I don't remember. I

do remember his lawyer was there, and my feeling was "let's not

do this". That was my position. "Let's not do this, and let's

clear this up."

Q Are you already in Puerto Rico when this is

happening?

A No, I was---

Q No.

A ---in Los Angeles. Willy was in New York. And--- ah--

- the lawyer said: "I don't think it's a good idea to cancel

this", for several reasons. One was: "These guys paid in good

faith. You're going to get sued." And number two, Willy had a

problem with some guy here, Pepe Dueño, or somebody, that was

suing him, or threatened to sue him, because of--- he--- he

claimed that Willy had canceled a concert, or not shown up, or

something. So, it would--- it would've not been good.

But basically, the thing was: "These guys paid in

good faith, you're going to get sued", basically. His lawyer.


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And was good advise, so I figured: "OK., now, let's do the

gig".

Q OK. But your objection to playing was because you

thought you had not been paid in full?

A I--- To tell you the truth, at the time, as I try to

remember that unpleasantness, it was I was very upset I didn't

understand what happened. I like to have all the points clear,

you know? I like to be clear. And I was not clear. I was not

clear about a lot of stuff. I didn't understand what--- why it

happened, why did they do this--you know--I--- I wasn't sure

what the heck happened here. Not sure.

Q And---

A And my position--- Excuse me. And my position was:

"Let's--- let's step back, and really find out what happened.

Let's chase this 'till the end, and find out what happened."

And--- ah--- But the lawyer--- ah--- Das--- or Das--- I don't

know his name. He has--- ah--- he had a very good--- ah---

It--- it was good advise.

Q And the--- This is already in the papers?

A What is in the papers, sir?

Q The controversy about the concert, while you're

still---

A Yes, I think---

Q ---in L.A., and---?

A No, no, no. I think it is in the papers already. I


74


think it happened the week before. I can't remember exactly,

but it must have been like, at some point, the guy calls, on a

Thursday or a Friday, or something, and I call him and I tell

him: "Hey, you know? This may not happen, because we haven't

gotten paid", and the guy printed it in the paper. That's when-

-- that's when the thing began to create reactions from the

promoters. The promoters started, then, making noise. And

that's when Tuti Bou reaches me, and tells me: "Hey, this is

the--- these guys are OK." You know? 'Cause it's when the thing

hits the fan--- ah--- when the paper publishes that the

Siembra--- ah--- concert is--- ah--- maybe not--- will not

happen, or something, that's when everybody starts getting

panic.

Q Did at any point, before the concert, did you suspect

that the money had been paid to Martínez and Morgalo, and they

weren't telling you?

A No. I had no reason to believe that at all.

Q OK. Did you look at exhibit 7, the last payment,

according to that exhibit, the balance of one hundred and

twelve thousand five hundred dollars---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---had to be paid by April 22nd, 2003.

A Uh-huh.

Q That would have been eleven days---

A Uh-huh.


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Q ---before the concert.

A Uh-huh.

Q Does the issue about not being paid in full arise

after April 22nd, when you were---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---supposed to have received full payment?

A ---- (no audible answer).

Q "Tienes que hablar."

A Ah, sorry--- ah--- Yes.

Q And is it your testimony that you couldn't reach

Martínez and Morgalo at that point?

A No, the testimony wasn't exactly that. The testimony

is that, every time I asked him, before I had--- when I could

talk to him, the thing was the money---

Q Him meaning---

A Him---

Q ---Martínez?

A ---meaning Arturo, at the office, was--- ah--- "Well,

I can't reach the guy, the guy hasn't called me back---" ah---

"You know how these guys are, I'm sure the money will come,

`blah, blah, blah'." That was before. And like I said, before

these guys--- This is not un--- unheard of, that these kinds of

things happen.

Q Do you re---?

A So---


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Q OK. Do you recall how much--- what was the amount you

thought remained unpaid at that time?

A No, I don't.

Q You don't know if it was the one hundred and twelve,

or---?

A I can't exactly remember, but it probably--- If--- if

I had asked how much money, it would probably mean the last---

the last payment, or--- You know, I don't know. I can't--- I

cannot confirm that, but there was money missing. Let's put it

that way. Money not--- not acknowledged, not paid.

Q OK. Prior to that April 22nd deadline for---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---the last payment, did you and Willy receive

payment from M&M---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---any money from M&M for that---?

A Yes, we did.

Q Is that based on--- because you do an estimate of

what the costs are going to be, and you can distribute the

difference?

A Ah--- probably. It was like an advance, I think. It

wasn't a lot of money. I don't think.

Q So, the reason---? So, you would know if money has

been coming in, because they are paying you those advances?

A Absolutely.


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Q And the remaining amount---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---would that be an amount that you and Willy would

distribute completely?

A Right.

Q I mean, that--- Expenses would have been taken care

of by then?

A Not necessarily, but most pro--- probably. There's

always something.

Q And what about the commissions? The M&M commission.

They take them from the--- from the first check?

A They shouldn't have, but they do.

Q From the first payment?

A They take it right away.

Q Now, did at any point, while you're discussing the

lack of payment issue with Mr. Colón, did Mr. Colón suggest

that you call the police?

A He probably did.

Q You don't recall?

A I don't recall. No, but he probably did.

Q And what do you think he probably did? What do you

think---?

A Because I'm sure he was pissed.

Q And he was---?

A I'm sorry. He was angry.


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Q Aha. Well---

A I was angry too. I mean--you know---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Pissed is probably more

accurate; a more accurate reflection of what the feelings were.



Q So, based upon Mr. Das'--D-a-s--says---

MR. MORGALO: Das, Das.

THE DEPONENT: D--- I don't know, really---


THE DEPONENT: ---how you write it. Das.


Q ---recommendation or suggestion---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---you decided to fly to Puerto Rico and do the

concert?

A That is correct.

Q What was Mr. Colón's position regarding doing or not

doing the concert at the time?

A I didn't hear any opposition to going. Otherwise, I

don't go.

Q So Das what Mr. Colón's attorney at the time?

A He was there, in the room. I mean, my feeling. I---

I talked to the guy. He was there--- ah--- I was in Los

Angeles, and Willy was in New York.


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Q Oh, so he was with Mr. Colón---

A That is correct.

Q ---in the same room---

A That is correct.

Q ---when it was decided that the concert had to go

forward, otherwise, you might get sued?

A That is correct.


(Pause.)

Q OK. So you do the concert, you don't--- you haven't

heard from Mr. Martínez regarding that last payment.

A No, but before we did the concert, they told us the

guy tried to kill himself.

Q Who told you?

A I think it was Juan Toro, or somebody, but it think

it probably was Juan.

Q That Martínez tried to kill himself?

A Yes.

Q For any stated reason?

A I don't know. I don't know why. That's what we heard

at the time, but--- We didn't know what to believe. And then,

we started talking to his wife, and I--- You know, we didn't

know what was going on. We--- Like I said before, there was a

lot of confusion. I mean--- you know---

Q And when you got to Puerto Rico---


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A Uh-huh.

Q ---did you meet Mr. Sainz and Mr. Ríos?

A I think Willy and I spoke with the people for a long

time. We sat down, and we spoke a long, long time with those

people. I--- I'm not sure, probably--- might have been the---

the day before the concert--- ah--- in the night. I don't---

I--- We arrived on a Thursday---

Or maybe we talked before the press conference then.

If we arrived on a Thursday, we--- we talked with those people

on--- all the night--you know--late. We talked late, because

we--- you know, it was---

Q And what were they saying?

A The guys would--- I--- As I recall, they were upset,

they thought that the concert was going to suffer, because of

the bad publicity, that people weren't going to show up, they

were concerned about their reputation--you know--they wanted to

make sure that we made--- and specially me, made clear that

they had been on the up and up, which is what I did in the

press conference several times, just to clear the--- it--- it--

- you know, it's the thing with--- with that type of situation,

you throw it in, and it--- it spreads, and--- ah--- so, that---

that's what I think we were talking, and also the fact that we

were going to perform here.

They were just upset. Those guys were very upset

also.


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Q Their position, at all times, was: "We have paid"?

A The position--- their position was, and they had all

the--- the papers--you know--"This is what we paid".

Q Good. Payments are usually done by wire transfer in

this business?

A Legal payments, yes. Unless--- Some people show up

with a brown bag, which is not the kind of thing you want, but-

-- ah---

Q With cash?

A Well, we've seen everything. In the old days, they

paid you with dollar bills. In back office.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I'm--- Let's go off the

record. I'm going to take a five minute recess---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---before going to---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Would like some coffee or---?

(Off the record.)



Q Mr. Blades, before--- prior to the concert, once you

were in Puerto Rico, did Mr. Colón ever meet with you, together

with a relative or friend of his, called Pablo Rodríguez?

A "No, yo no recuerdo eso."

MS. GONZALEZ: In English.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "Ah, en inglés."


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THE DEPONENT: Oh, I'm sorry. No, I don't remember

ever doing that.


Q You don't recall if someone who came with Willy Colón

and gave you a book, a biography of Ramón Emeterio Betances?

A I don't remember that.

Q Do you recall ever telling Mr. Colón, prior to the

concert, that if Mr. Martínez and M&M had actually received

payment, that you would take care of Mr. Colón's part?

A No.

Q When you say no--- My question was whether you

remember--- you distinctly remember not having said that, or

you just don't remember---?

A I didn't say that.

Q Did you say anything close to that?

A Before the concert?

Q Yes.

A No.

Q Or after the concert?

A After the concert, I remember feeling terrible still,

because of the conversation I had with him before, when we

accepted, at the time when we said--- Remember I said "I don't

want to do this"?

Q Yes.

A And then, explained me his reasons?


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Q Yes.

A OK. After the concert, the idea arose that more

concerts would be made, and then, I--- I told him: "When we do

the next concert, from the monies that we may get, that we got

stolen from, I'll give you some of your money that you lost".

Q And what exactly did you mean by that?

A I meant that, if we did the Shea Stadium concert, for

instance, and they--- you know, I don't know, what would have

happened, let's say we get a hundred thousand each, then--you

know--I think we were having like--- The money that was

appropriated, which I included now the--- the--- the money that

was collected by the agency as a fee, I think, I felt that they

didn't deserve that, which was thirty five thousand, or

something, and whatever was left was, maybe, like seventy five,

or--- or something, that if you split that in two, it's thirty

two thousand dollars--you know--and then, that "whatever my fee

was, you can take those thirty two".

Q OK. Let me see if I understand. If you were going to-

-- Each were going to get a hundred thousand dollars on the

Shea Stadium---

A Just as a--- as an example, yes.

Q ---you would take thirty two thousand from your

hundred, and give it to Willy?

A That's correct.

Q Because you felt terrible?


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A I felt awful.

Q Did you feel awful because---?

A I felt awful be--- You want---? You know, I'm trying

not to say it, I'll say it. You know why I felt awful? Because

I think he needed the money.

Q OK. But did you---

A That's why.

Q ---feel that---? Did you feel awful also in part

because Martínez and Morgalo were your booking agents?

A That was a personal awful.

Q OK. Did you feel---? But did you feel in any way---

A Uh-huh. The obligation?

MS. GONZALEZ: Let him finish the question.



Q Did you feel in any way that this had happened---?

Strike that. Did you feel in any way that this was caused by

the booking agents that did work for you?

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection. They did work for both.

THE DEPONENT: They worked for both of us, and they

stole from both of us. I felt worse, because I knew these guys,

and I was very happy when they made the--- the--- the agency,

I mean. And I just couldn't believe that they did this.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Well, that is actually what I

mean.


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(Pause.)

Q Were you upset because the people who might have done

this, or let's say, did this---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---were a group that used to represent you---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---and that, in terms of this deal, they were working

on your end of the bargain, which was the collection of the

money and---

A I felt---

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection. Compound. There are two

questions being---

THE DEPONENT: I felt, at the time, and I think it---

it so reflects a note that I wrote, that was--- ah--- "un

borrador", a draft of a letter--- ah--- in--- in the sense of

I felt terrible about what had happened, and--- but I had no

obligation whatsoever to do anything related to paying him

anything. I had no obligation to do it. Just felt terrible. But

more terrible, because I knew he needed the money at the time.

That's my--- That was my recollection of this.


Q And you did tell Mr. Colón that, if--- that from a

future concert, and you were thinking about the Shea Stadium

deal at the time, you would take a part of the money you were

going to receive personally, and give it to him?


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A After the concerts. After the--- after the Puerto

Rico concert?

Q Yes, after the concert.

A OK. There were several--- there were several offers

made to do shows, which I--- you know, again, I was doing film,

I was doing other things, but I thought--- He said, if I don't-

-- He mentioned something in New York, which I thought would

have been nice--- ah--- In Shea Stadium, I think, or something.

And I thought that would be nice. And I figured: "You know,

well, since that's going to be probably the last gig", you

know?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. I show you a letter, or

what looks like a letter. I ask you to look at it, and once

you've done so, I'll ask you questions.

(Pause.)



Q It's a document that has the William Anthony Colón

Román---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---letterhead, dated May 8th, 2003, addressed to

Rubén Blades, in L.A., and it says at the end: "Un abrazo,

Willy".

A Uh-huh.

Q Do you recall seeing this letter?


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A Yes.

Q Do you recall seeing this letter at about the date

that's stated there?

A I guess.

Q Let me put it in context. The concert was on May 3rd,

2003, this has a May 8, 2003, date.

A Uh-huh.

Q Do you recall that you had discussions, and I don't

mean that in an adversary way, discussions with Mr. Colón,

after the concert, regarding the amount owed?

A No, I don't.

Q What is this document about?

A This is what Willy sent me, stating that this is the

amount of money that he felt I--- I--- he was owed.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: And--- Let me run by the

different figures here, so that I can understand what they are

referring to, if you know. I mean, you're not the author of the

letter, but you received it, and I understand you commented on

it.



Q First of all, do you recognize the handwriting in

that document?

A Yes, that's mine. Mine--- my--- my handwriting.

Q Yes.


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A Uh-huh.

Q Now, it says--- There's a table there---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---where it says: "Contract total", and Mr. Colón

wrote a hundred and seventy five thousand dollars.

A Uh-huh. Which is wrong.

Q Why is it wrong?

A Because one seventy five doesn't include any

expenses.

Q OK. One seventy five---

A One seventy five times--- times two is three fifty.

Q Which was the contracted amount?

A Yes.

Q Yes.

A He just split it and said--you know--one seventy

five.

Q OK. And you wrote something on that row there,

something like plus fourteen thousand nine hundred and seventy

nine sixty two.

A Uh-huh.

Q You know what that is in reference to?

A No, sir. I don't remember.

Q OK. Then, it says: "Less advance from Arturo---"

A Uh-huh.

Q "---thirty one thousand two hundred and fifty


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dollars, on March 7", and another one from Arturo on March

31st, for the same amount. Correct?

A Yes, sir.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Now, if you look at exhibit 7,

exhibit 7 says, on the--- Do you have it near you? OK.

MS. GONZALEZ: Yes, look at it, right here.

THE DEPONENT: Aha.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Item 7, number 7, says that a

deposit of sixty two thousand two hundred and fifty--- I mean,

sixty two thousand five hundred dollars would be due

immediately, and eighty seven thousand five hundred dollar

payment would be due in March 22nd. And then, another one on

April 1st, and the final one, on April 22.

Now, I see that Mr. Colón is saying that an advance

was received from Arturo on March 7---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---and another one, on March

31st.



Q Is it your---? Do you recall whether there were other

advances?

A Paid to whom?

Q To either of you.

A I have no idea.


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Q To you.

A No.

Q No meaning you don't recall, or you don't---?

A No, I must have received the same amount--- ah---

Whatever it was that was being sent to Willy. I never received

extras different than what he got. That was not the deal. The

deal was we get the same amount.

Q At the same time?

A Not nece--- I don't know at the same time, what

they're going to do--- If they going to send us both the same--

- You know, I--- I don't know. That part, I don't know. But

the--- the deal always was--- And I know this, because that's

the way I deal. He gets what I get. I get what he gets.

Q But you don't know how M&M would send out the

payments---

A No.

Q ---but is it your understanding---

A If he got sixty two, I'm must have gotten sixty two.

Q And you have no reason to believe that you would have

received it at a different point in time?

A Received what?

Q The same payments that he was receiving, or---

A No, I---

Q ---vice versa.

A We got a check, is--- They should take--- ah---


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Q Let me ask in a different way, because I am being

confused.

A Tax forms--- ah---

Q I'm being--- I'm the one being confused. You have no-

--

A Uh-huh.

Q In your deal with Mr. Colón---

A Aha.

Q ---you would share the profits.

A Yes. After expenses.

Q After expense.

A Aha. Equally.

Q Equally, and there was no provision as to one

receiving the money first or the other one---

A No.

Q ---receiving---? So, as far as you know, it should

have occurred at the same time?

A Yes, should have.

Q OK.

A And--you know--yes.

Q You had no special provision for collecting first---

A No, no.

Q OK. So---

A And let just add this. If it had to be something like

that, I'd rather that he gets paid first, given the context of


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the situation.

Q OK. Now, he is stating here, on this May 8th letter,

that---

"¿Qué pasó?"

THE DEPONENT: "No, dale, dale. El hielo..." I'm

sorry.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: All right.

THE DEPONENT: The ice was weird.


Q ---that--- that as of that date, May 8th, he had only

received sixty two thousand five hundred dollars.

A Aha.

Q And he's deducting thirty two thousand five hundred

dollars in expenses.

A Uh-huh.

Q And you wrote--- you added a little over twenty six

hundred dollars next to it, right?

A I don't know.

Q Are you---? I'm sorry.

A This? A little added where?

A You added to the expenses row, which is the third row

in the table---

A Oh.

Q ---Mr. Colón said---

A Oh, aha.


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Q ---thirty two thousand five hundred dollars, and

apparently--- OK., well, apparently, and you wrote---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---next to it plus two thousand six hundred fifty

three and seventy seven.

A Right.

Q And then, like a total, you totaled it next to it,

thirty five thousand a hundred and fifty three seventy seven.

A Uh-huh. Uh-huh?

Q Is that because you had specific data regarding the

expenses?

A At the time, with the numbers that I--- As I recall,

the numbers that I had taken, it was around seventy--- between

seventy, but then, I think some more--- couple of more things

came up, and it went up to like seventy three, or something

like that, seventy five--- I don't recall, but it was--- I just

remember that this is something that I was sort of doing, and

responsive--- When I received this, I started checking, and

adding--you know--putting numbers there, but I wasn't--- ah---

done. And I think that actually came out to--- ah--- It

actually came--- came up a little higher than that. Because

there were some things that we hadn't put in, I think they had

to do with New York.

Q And based on your calculations---

A Uh-huh.


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Q ---done in handwriting, on this document---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---it was your understanding that Mr. Colón was owed

sixty two thousand three hundred and sixty six---

A At the---

Q ---dollars?

A ---time, that's what I thought, yes, sir.


(Pause.)

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. This document was produced

by your attorney---


MS. GONZALEZ: And also by Mr. Colón.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. Just for housekeeping

matter, I would beg all the parties to try to find a better

copy, because this one is--- it has some--- some numbers cut

off on the side---

THE DEPONENT: Yes.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: It's your hand, your plain

handwriting.

THE DEPONENT: Huh?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I mean, he might have an

original, so---

THE DEPONENT: No, I gave everything I had.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK., but---


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THE DEPONENT: Oh, I see.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---you gave everything to her,

and we produced a copy, she produced a copy. I'm just trying to

find out if we can find a copy that's not--- that doesn't have

the numbers cut off.

THE DEPONENT: OK.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: We should mar this as exhibit

8.

THE REPORTER: 9.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: 9.


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Mr. Blades, you made reference

to a draft of a letter that you wrote.


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I'm going to show you a

document, I'd like you to examine it, and---

THE DEPONENT: Yes, this is it.


This is--- appears to be in memo format, addressed to

Willy Colón, from---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---you---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---date, May 10th, 2003---



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MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---regarding the Martínez

Morgalo mess---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---Puerto Rico concert, May

3rd, and it's a typewritten document, with a lot of--- Well,

I'm not going to say a lot. A bunch of handwritten---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---corrections, or editing in

it.

THE DEPONENT: Yes.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Correct?

THE DEPONENT: It's a draft.


Q You never sent this to Mr. Colón?

A No.

Q And what were you doing here? What's this document?

A Basically, I was very upset, because--- ah--- I

didn't--- When I got the other note--- ah--- the expenses he

felt were fifty one, and that he would take sixty five--you

know--I--- I--- I--- ah--- and he had eighty coming--you know--

it was all of a sudden as if like--- my feeling at the time was

like he thinks I got to pay him this. That was my--- my

reaction was: "He thinks I have to pay him this?"

And I felt--you know--"We both got robbed, I don't

have to pay you anything". I mean, this whole scenario happened


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because of what these guys did to us.

Q These guys meaning M&M?

A The--- the M&M office. And basically, as you can tell

by the May 10th--- ah--- issue, it was after the concert, and

my feeling, when I talked to him, was: "If we do another show,

because--like I said--go back to what I said before, because I-

-- I---" And I don't like to talk about it, but I'm going to

have to mention it, that because I felt that there was a need

at the time for Willy to get his money--you know--I said: "You

know, I'll give you whatever it is that--- whatever part of---

of the money you didn't get, you can take it out of mine, of my

portion, when we do the second concert, or the next concert".

And that's what I mean when I say pay you.

And then, I read the draft, and I thought I was too

angry--you know--and I said: "I'm not---" You know. And them,

I--- I sent another--- another letter, which I don't know where

it is or what it was.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: It might be here.

THE DEPONENT: I don't know. But it was a draft. But

that's the origin of that.


Q OK. By May 10th, you already thought Martínez and

Morgalo had robbed you?

A On May 10th? Oh, yes.

Q Do you recall whether you already had that thought


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when the concert was actually held?

A No, I wasn't sure what happened. I was not sure. I

remember, in the press conference, people kept trying to get me

to say that--- And I--- and I kept saying: "I don't know what

happened. I don't know what happened, and I don't want to say

something, and then, I'm going to have to regret it", so--you

know--the whole--- Yes, I don't recall when I met Arturo,

because I did meet with Arturo, I just don't remember the date,

'cause I kept trying to get him, and get him, and get him. I

don't think it was on the--- by the 10th. I'm not sure.

So, by then, it was clear that something really

terrible had--- had happened. And when I met him finally, which

was---

THE REPORTER: Stop. Off the record.


(Off the record.)


THE DEPONENT: And when I met Arturo--- ah--- Arturo,

because I asked Juan to produce him. I kept after Juan: "Juan,

you know? I've got to know what happened. I've got to know what

happened." When I met Arturo, then, he told me how everything--

- what--- everything that had happened.


Q So, all you knew before the concert was that Arturo

supposedly had tried to kill himself---


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A Yes.

Q ---and you weren't told why?

A No, I wasn't sure why.

Q Did you---?

A I didn't even know if it--- if it was true, I mean---

Q Did you, at any time before the Puerto Rico concert,

come to believe that M&M had--- were in financial trouble?

A No.

Q No? You had no reason to suspect that?

A No.

Q Do you know what point--- when, between May the 3rd,

and May the 10th---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---did you come to realize, or to believe that M&M

had taken the money?

A I think by the fact that this guy never showed up.

There was--- there were no explanations--- ah--- You know, we

tried to find him--you know--get--- get the real sense of what

had happened. Nothing. I said: "You know, the monies---" I knew

now the money had been paid. I knew I didn't have it.

Q Now you mean by May 10th?

A Absolutely. The monies--- Even before that. I have to

say even before that. I wasn't going to say that in a press

conference at the time, 'cause didn't really have all the

information. But after we did the concert, and everything was


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clear, the guys had paid. We saw the--- all the bills, we saw

the--- the statements, and we know. I don't have the money. He

doesn't have the money. Then, the money was taken by the

office. Who else would have the money?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Now---

THE DEPONENT: So---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---now, looking at paragraph

1 of your draft letter, exhibit--- Well, we haven't marked it,

but it's going to be exhibit 10.

"Esta."

MS. GONZALEZ: "Ajá, es ésta."

THE DEPONENT: "Dale."


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: In the--- towards the middle

of that paragraph---

MS. GONZALEZ: What paragraph, counsel?



MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "Third, I told you I'd pay

you, because I feel morally obliged to do so."



Q Why did you feel morally obliged to do so?

A Because the whole point of the concert, of me

agreeing to the concert, was to help him, 'cause he was having-


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-you know--difficulties. Money difficulty. And the bottom line

is instead of getting the money, the money is stolen.

Q OK. But let me try and understand this. Your choice

of words here---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---is---

A In the draft.

Q In the draft, yes.

A Aha.

Q Is that you felt morally obliged to do so.

A Yes.

Q OK. What was the moral component of that feeling.

A I love him, and--- and---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Fair enough. Now, I have

another--- "¿Cogemos un `break'?" OK.

(Off the record.)


THE DEPONENT: No, let me finish.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. Go ahead, yes.

MS. GONZALEZ: Let me show another document.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: No, no---

MS. GONZALEZ: Proceed.

THE DEPONENT: No, let me just finish. So basically,

that's the issue. I felt terrible.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. Let me show you another


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document. Here.

It's rather long, so just look at it, and when you're

done, I'll ask the questions.

(Pause.)

THE DEPONENT: Aha.


Q Have you seen this document before?

A Yes, because I see my handwriting over here.

Q Where?

A Over here.

Q On the page that has the Bates number 146 at the

bottom?

A "No, el 6." Number 6.

Q 6 on top, yes. OK. This is a document that has a May

10th, 2003, date.

A Uh-huh.

Q That it says: "Estimado Rubén", I would gather that

Rubén is you.

A Yes.

Q Do you know who wrote this?

A Do I know who wrote it? I think this is Ariel Rivas.

Q OK. You recall receiving this?

A I--- Yes, I--- I--- I remember writing--- I mean, I

don't remember receiving it, but I know I did receive it.

Q And it's like a long narration of events---


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A Uh-huh.

Q ---and it incorporates emails---

A Uh-huh.

(Pause.)

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Counsel was pointing out to

me, Mr. Saavedra, that the fax line, that's how that thing is

called, at the top, has an April 11, 2003, date on top. That

just doesn't make any sense. I mean, there's no reason---

This was obviously written after the concert.

THE DEPONENT: Yes.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Yes. So some fax are---

Q What is this document about, in general terms?

A I think that it was the--- "resumen" by the promoter

Ariel Rivas of--- of his memory of the whole scenario of

negotiations that led to Siembra, to the concert of the--- of

May 3rd.

Q And it--- OK. And the first page, at the bottom,

there appears to be like--- It appears to be including an email

that has your name at the center. Page 1, the bottom. Rubén

Blades 1, 2, 3.

A No, but that wasn't me.

Q You don't know who that is?

A That's probably the--- The office had that---

Q Email?

A Aha.


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Q Oh, so this text is not from you? What's---

A This text? No. "Rubén Blades 1, 2, 3, AOL"? "Si yo ni

usaba computadora en este tiempo." "Digo", I didn't have a---

I don't think I was that good in the--- I don't know if I had

a--- I don't remember if I had already an email address, but if

I did, it wasn't that one.

Q This has a 2001--- I mean, that apparent email that's

included, that--- that--- You said Rivas is the on who sent

this?

A No--- ah---

Q No, the letter.

A I'm sorry? O, Rivas?

Q The letter.

A I think it was him who sent this letter.

Q OK. And he is making reference to an email---

A Right.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: The letter. No, he was saying

the cut and paste here---

THE DEPONENT: "Ajá. Eso..."

MS. GONZALEZ: ---from Rubén Blades to Ariel.

THE DEPONENT: "Eso yo creo que lo recibió..." I'm

sorry. I think that that was received by Ariel Rivas, and was

sent by---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: The office?

THE DEPONENT: ---the off--- Martínez Morgalo's


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office.


Q OK. Well, according to that email, or what Ariel

Rivas is representing as an email---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---Arturo is saying that the spoke to you, and you

were very interested in doing something in Santo Domingo.

A Uh-huh.

Q Is that true? Do you recall having spoken to Arturo,

and saying: "I'm interested in doing something in Santo

Domingo"?

A I usually didn't start the--- the conversation--- ah-

-- I didn't start the--- the wheel moving to go some place.

Usually, I was told by someone: "`Oye, oye', there's a chance

to go X", and I'll say: "Oh, yes, I'd like to go there because

of something". So, I don't know how they--- ah--- represent

that to be, but I--- I know I did play in Santo Domingo at one

point. I hadn't been there in a long time. I think it was Altos

de Chavón. I'm not sure. Never played there. That's maybe what

it means. It maybe--- If it was like Altos de Chavón, I said:

"Oh, that's a nice place".

That was with my group. It wasn't with--- with Willy.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Yes. And on page 5, there's a

reference to a concert in Altos de Chavón with Danny Rivera.

THE DEPONENT: It says there?


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MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Page 5.


Page 5?


MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "Sí, aquí, mira."

THE DEPONENT: "Tiene Rubén Blades regresar a

trabajar..."

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "En mis manos."

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: No.

THE DEPONENT: "Ah, aquí. Sí, perdón." Uh-huh.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Aha. Altos de Chavón.

(Pause.)


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: And apparently, they're

narrating that there was some incident that left Rivas outside

of that concert, and it was given to Luis Medrano by Morgalo---

(Pause.)

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: And then, we get to page 6,

which is where you have your handwritten note.



Q Now, here, he's saying, and the stuff that you

underline--- I think it was you, right?

A Yes, sir.

Q All right. "Afterwards, Roberto---" I think we have


107


agreed that means Morgalo, right? Roberto?

A Yes.

Q Robert?

A I would think so.

Q "---talks to me about the possibility of doing

Siembra in Puerto Rico. We were very interested, and we

negotiated the May 3rd date for three hundred and fifty

thousand. At that moment, it was agreed, then, that the sixty

two thousand five hundred dollars, originally deposited for the

show with Cheo Feliciano---"

A Uh-huh.

Q "---would be credited to the new date for Siembra on

May 3rd."

A Uh-huh.

Q Do you recall having agreed to do a concert with Cheo

Feliciano?

A It was spoken for--- We'd spoken about that. I

remember ta--- The--- the talk--- As I remember, I remember

the--- the talk, the conversations that the show might happen,

or that it was a good idea to do that, or something to that

effect.

Q And it was canceled because Richie Ray and Bobby Cruz

were doing a concert on the same day.

A There was some kind of problem at the time, yes, and

I think there was a time--- a conflict--- I--- I--- I don't


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have it very clear, because I remember that they mentioned, at

one point, talking about--- They talked about Cheo on one day,

and then, another time, they talked about Richie Ray and Bobby

Cruz, I don't remember--you know--really, at this time, not

clear about which of the two was the one that--- that we were

going to have the conflict that prevented the show from being

done. I don't remember which of the two, but there were like

two different dates. They were not the same day.

In other words, it wasn't like Cheo, Richie and me.

It was first with Cheo, I think, and then, there was with Ri---

with Richie, and then, there was--- This was canceled, and

then, there was a thing with Bobby, and then, it was the same

day, and--- You know, the thing is that nothing happened.

Q And this? If we look at that paragraph, it says--- It

suggests that the Bobby Cruz--- the Richie Ray, Bobby Cruz

concert---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---was going to be on the same day---

A Right.

Q ---or on the week of February the 16.

A I don't remember. I think that that's why probably---

The--- the concert was moved. The--- the--- they were talking

about dates. I--- I think it was like the 14 of February, or

something, and then, they couldn't get the--- the--- I don't---

the---


109


MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "El Coliseo."

THE DEPONENT: ---the Coliseo or some problem.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "Era la noche de apertura."

THE DEPONENT: And the--- and the thing dropped. And

it was dropped. It was like an idea. It wasn't like---


Q But it was an idea for which they deposited sixty two

thousand.

A That's what it says there. I didn't get that money,

if that's what you're asking me.

Q I'm not asking--- I'm just---

A OK. But so---

Q I'm not asking.

A ---so everybody knows.

Q I'm trying to figure out---

A Right.

Q ---a chronology here.

A Uh-huh.

Now, may I ask something? Can I ask questions? No?

OK. Because is this the 2002 advance they're talking about?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: That's what I'm trying to

figure out.

THE DEPONENT: But this is in 2003.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: And the exhibit says--exhibit

6--has a reference to a deposit in the amount of sixty two


110


thousand five hundred US dollars, received April, 2002. And

this must be--- I mean, it seems to me that February 16 is the

reference to 2003.

THE DEPONENT: I don't know, because 2003, I don't

think they would have done that, and then--- You know, I--- I--

-

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Then, a May Siembra concert.

THE DEPONENT: No.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: But Rivas is saying that he

paid that for the Cheo Feliciano, Rubén Blades concert.

THE DEPONENT: Maybe this is something that refers to

the 2002 date, not 2003. I--- I don't see how that could have

happened.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Do you---?

THE DEPONENT: As a matter of--- Well, go ahead.


Q OK. You--- But your testimony is that you never

received any money---

A That is my testimony, sir.

Q ---regarding the sixty two thousand five hundred

dollars---

A No.

Q ---of the Cheo Blades concert?

A Right.

Q Now, who is Editus?


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A Editus is a Costa Rican group that backs me up. At

the time, I was working with them.

Q OK. And in your handwritten note, you're saying---

You put an asterisk next to the Richie Ray Bobby Cruz sentence-

--

A Uh-huh.

Q ---and you say: "Cheo couldn't".

A Uh-huh. Remember that I'm reacting to what I'm

reading, and I'm trying to--- write down what I'm thinking as

I read this. And I recall--- Again, I don't--- I'm not--- I

don't understand the dates, but I do remember there was a

concert that they had suggested was a good idea to do, with

Cheo, on February 14.

Q OK.

A I don't know--- I--- I don't know. That year? I

don't--- I don't think so. I'd have to check and see what---

what movies I was doing, or what I was at--- doing at the time.

So, I think this was before. This must have been like before.

And I remember. I put in down "Cheo couldn't do it"

that time, because that's what I recall when they said that

that the--- mentioned--- ah--- this--- this point.

And then, it was another scenario, which had to do

with Richie, or maybe it's that--- Again, we're talking about

2002, I think, and then, they couldn't do--- When they moved

the concert, they couldn't do it, because Richie Ray had a


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concert that same day.

Q You also wrote, at the bottom of the page---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---the phrase "with Morgalo". Do you know what that

means, what that meant?

A Well, at the time--- I'm--- I'm trying to determine

who did he talk to---

Q OK.

A ---because I remember that Morga--- Robert had left

for Iraq at one point. But before that--you know--he was in the

office. So, who did he talk to. That's why it leads me also to

believe it's 2002, because he couldn't have spoken with him in

2003, since the--- he wasn't there. So that means the sixty two

five had to do with the year before, when he was there.

Q OK. Let's---

A That's what I--- I mean, again, I'm just writing

little things in--- refresh my mind, well, what the heck

happened at the time, you know? Try to find a chronology,

because I was also confused.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Let's look at page 7. The

second paragraph says: "Everything went well, until two days

before the show".


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "Arturo sent me the writers."

Q What's a writer?


Robert

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A It's--- ah--- the information regarding the band's

requirements.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "We verified it, and---" "Les

enviamos los contra writers." "We sent counter writers." That

would be like---

THE DEPONENT: Corrections.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "Told us that Memo---"

Q Who's Memo?

A The sound man.

Q The sound man for---?

A For me. For Editus.

Q For Editus?

A Uh-huh.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "Had said that everything was

perfect, he gave us the phone", and then, it says they talked

about the sound, et cetera, et cetera, that everything was

going well. Then, it says: "During this period, we agreed with

Arturo---" "Dice: `Cuadramos con Arturo'", "to make a

presentation---" "en sociedad contigo", that could be "in a

joint venture with you", or something else, "and Danny, in the

United Palace of New York".


A Uhm-uhm.

Q No?

A Uhm-uhm.


114


Q You have to say no.

A I'm sorry. No, no, I don't. I'm sorry.

(Pause.)

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Now, page 8. That's where he

talks about the deposits.

The first full paragraph, the letter says: "We always

sent the deposits to Arturo---"


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "---in the manner that money

was flowing in. Since he was conscious about how slow the

ticket sales were going, because of the situation regarding the

Pepe Dueño lawsuit, Willy--- lawsuit against Willy---"


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "---and I must always say---

I must say always that the word that we made the deposits in

the way Arturo authorized. So he never pressured us to make the

deposits in the stipulated manner."

THE DEPONENT: Uh-huh. Remember, at one point I said

that--- This is when, I guess, I--- I realize that they claim

that they had been told to--- to do it some different way---

You asked me, at one point, why the--- the payments had not

been made in the specified dates, and I said I recall that---

promoters saying that he had been authorized to do them

differently. This is, I guess, where I read that.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Now, he says: "There's some---


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there's a key person here called Christian.

Q Do you know who Christian is?

A No.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "Supposedly Arturo's brother."

THE DEPONENT: Excuse me. If I met him, I mean, do I

know--- If--- if you put his face right in front of me, would

I know, like I can recognize Robert, would I recognize him, if

I saw him right now, no.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Then, he says something that

coincides with your testimony. It says that he would call---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---apparently, Christian to

the Martínez and Morgalo office to inform that a transfer had

been sent, but that it was--- became strange to him that, in

the final weeks, he would call the office, and no one would

answer. And that, then, he found out that they had closed the

office, and that Arturo was working for his house.

Q You see that on page 8?

A Yes.

Q Were you ever told by Arturo that he had--- that they

had closed the Broadway office, and---

A No.

Q ---that he was working out of his house?

A No.

Q When you were trying to reach him, and you said you


116


couldn't reach him, were you calling the---

A I was calling the office.

Q ---the 212 number?

A I guess. The office number. I don't think I had his

home number.

(Pause.)

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. Let's mark this as

exhibit---

THE REPORTER: 11.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---11.

THE DEPONENT: 11.


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "¿Cuándo quieren `break for

lunch'?"

THE DEPONENT: "Yo... yo, no importa si yo no como. Yo

estoy..." You know, I'm fine.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "Estamos fuera de récord."

THE REPORTER: "No, estamos en récord."

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "Pues, vamos fuera del

récord."

(Off the record.)


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I handed over a document to

you, and please, review it, and let me know when you're done.

THE DEPONENT: Yes, go ahead. I remember this.


117


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. This is a one page

document that says "confidential" on the top. It says page 1 of

two, but this is all I have. And it's addressed to you---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---date May 13, 2003, subject,

"Gilbertito bails Blades and Colón out", and it's sent by

Willy, which we gather should be Willy Colón.

Q Do you recall seeing this document?

A Yes, I---

Q Do you recall seeing it on that date, or on or about

that date?

A When he sent it, I think. Near--- near that date, I'm

not sure.

Q What is the document about?

A Ah--- apparently, a paper here wrote that--- ah--- I

don't know which paper, probably a big headline saying that---

ah--- Gilberto had--- ah--- had helped us, or not helped us,

but perhaps--- ah--- saved us, or something, I don't know. It

says "bails out"--you know--like he saved us, or something to

that effect, because--- ah--- when--- when all this--- When all

of this happened, Gilberto did help us, his office. There was

a need for cash. There was a need to receive money--you know--

to pay everybody at the time, because like I said, they had

made the advances, advances, and then, we found out that all

this--- all that happened, I paid some of the stuff with my


118


Visa--you know--we had to pay the musicians, and we--- now,

we're needing money. So I--- They came forward, and helped us.

Q But do you remember in what amount of money?

A I don't quite remember, but I remember there was---

We found out that the last--- The last payment that these guys

sent, which they sent like perhaps days before the--- the

Siembra concert, these guys meaning the promoters, went to

Arturo's own--- I don't know if it was the Martínez Morgalo

account. And his wife, somehow, had access to the money, to the

funds---

Q Which wife was what?

A Arturo's wife. And I knew this, because of--- ah---

Juan. Juan Toro, who's--- Juan was the only guy that made the

contact--- ah--- with--- with Arturo's wife. I didn't know

where she was, and I guess they called him when he tried to

kill himself. I'm not certain about that part. I sure that

Juan, later on, when he goes to trial, he'll be able to you in

detail how did that--- all that thing happened.

But there was an amount that was never cashed, and

that amount was sent back to--- ah--- Gilberto Santa Rosa's---

his wife Meli--- Mélida--- Nélida, and--- and that money was

the money that we used to pay--you know--back the money that he

lent us. He lent us--- I think it was about ten or twelve

thousand dollars.

So, we returned him that money, and then, there was--


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- There was another amount, like thirty nine thousand dollars,

or something, that was left, and it was paid--- you know, paid

everything, and out of that, then, I sent him, Willy, ten

thousand and something dollars. As I recall.

Q And Willy sort of feels embarrassed by that

situation?

A I guess he did. I guess he didn't like the idea that

people would think that--- ah--- you know--- that we were

helpless.

My feeling was different, but---

Q You want to say something? Ah, she's--- OK.

A No, my feeling was different. I think he helped us,

and that's why I said to people--you know--"Thank you,

Gilberto, and than to everybody", and then, the paper went in

to get that way, and gave it that spin--you know--as they

usually do.

Q And Willy Colón says, at the end: "I'm still very

proud of the work we did through the years, and the job we did

on the night of May 3rd".

A Uh-huh.

Q "I hope we get a chance to another date to make it

up."

A Uh-huh.

Q By that date, were you already discussing the Shea

Stadium---?


120


A I think we had spoken about it, yes. Because he was

working with the Blumberg people, and it--- We--- we had sort

of talked about--- about--- Yes, about that--- Specifically,

that--- that time. That day---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK., let's mark---

THE DEPONENT: ---ah--- Shea Stadium.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Let's mark this as exhibit 12.

THE REPORTER: 12.



document.

I'm going to ask you to review it, and when you're

ready, you let me know.

(Long pause.)


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Uh-huh means you're ready?

THE DEPONENT: I'm sorry--- ah---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "Ah, ¿una reacción a un pedazo

de...? ¿Algo que leyó? OK."

(Pause.)


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: This document is dated May

14th, 2003---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---to WAC.


121


Q It's safe to say that that is William Anthony Colón,

right?

A Yes, sir.

Q And RB is you?

A Yes, sir.

Q And says it's about the problem general.

A Uh-huh.

Q Now this---

A Ah, yes, sir.

Q Yes. What is this document about?

A Basically this is the letter stating--- I--- I---

ah--- I had drafted--- This is the letter. It's pretty much

explaining the situation, and what my concerns were.

Q You are--- The first thing you're telling Mr. Colón

is that you spoke to Arturo---

A No. Arturo called---

Q Oh.

A ---and left me a message.

Q That's right. So he would have called on May 13.

A That is correct.

Q And that you--- On item number 2, you told Juan Toro

to talk to Arturo, and you're making enquiries about the sixty

two thousand five hundred dollars---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---"the alleged payment made last year---"


122


A Uh-huh.

Q "---for a different show, and applied to the May 3rd

engagement."

A Uh-huh.

Q So, at this point, you're telling Willy that you've

become aware of this.

A In the---

Q Yes?

A ---in the May 10th letter from---

Q From Rivas.

A Aha---

Q It makes---

A It's very clear. He--- he makes his own explanation.

Q Would that be the first time you become aware of that

situation?

A When? In May 10?

Q Yes. Of the allegation that that money had been paid

for a previous show?

A He might have mentioned it before. We talked to these

guys on May--- Before the concert, we sat down and spoke with

them, so that must have come out there as well.

Q Now, you say, after you make a reference to that

money: "I also want Arturo to clarify the extent of Roberto

Morgalo's involvement in this situation".

A Uh-huh.


123


Q What do you mean by that?

A Well--- there is no doubt that Roberto Morgalo was

not there from a very specific time. I don't recall if it was

January or February. Don't recall after May. But given the

sixty two thousand five hundred dollar scenario, that allegedly

took place a year before, when he was there, my concern was

when did this whole thing started. When did the problem start.

My problem was they were taking money when. To us?

They--- Taking the money from this concert, from Willy and I,

or were they already taking money out from me? 'Cause I never

saw those sixty two. And when did this happen? And who was

involved in this?

Q You spoke to Arturo after this, correct?

A At some point, I did. Finally, Juan brought him.

Q And did you discuss the issue of the sixty two

thousand five hundred?

A Yes, I did.

Q And what did you tell him, and what did he tell you?

A It was a really tough--- ah--- It was a tough--- I

was very angry--- ah--- I try not to be. I thought it was

really stupid of them to not have come forward and said: "You

know, we're having problems", and basically, what I got from

him, as I recall, and again, this could be checked with---

ah--- Juan, who was there as well, was that they were doing

shows of their own, and their shows were not working, and they


124


had to ask for money on the street, and they were not paying---

the shows were not happening.

So, they would take money from an advance, and use it

for the show, or to pay--- and thinking they were going to make

money, and then, pay off, and then, the thing wouldn't work,

which led them to continue to try to book things, and get the

money to pay--you know--it's like a front seat backwards.

And--- and that's---

And then, at some point, it got--- the water just

drowned them, and--you know--he went away, and Mr. Morgalo went

away, and then, he was left alone to hold the--- the fort. And-

-- and that's when--- There was nothing--- there was nowhere

else to drag to draw money from, and that's when the whole

thing was exposed.

Q Now trying to put the pieces together---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---if the sixty two thousand five hundred dollars

were from a show that got canceled in 2002---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---and if, from reading Rivas' memo, that was in

reference to a Cheo Feliciano concert that might have occurred

in February of 2002---

A That's my--- my memory of--- of when it was mentioned

that there would have been a concert, 2002. February.

Q This went on for over a year.


125


A People come and say they want to do a concert with

Frank Sinatra, they come in and tell you: "We got a call from

so and so, we're going to do this, we're going to do that".

Some things happen, some things don't happen. I mean, I don't

really hold my breath. I had other things to do. I was doing

movies. I did like three movies back to back. I wasn't paying

attention.

Q And you were worried, in this document, about

Hacienda thinking that you had made more money that you had?

A Yes. And they were really upset with Willy, because

he didn't show up at the meeting, and I told the guys, I said

he couldn't come, because he has a gig, and I think it was in

Florida. And they were really upset--- ah--- And I--- I wanted

him to understand--you know--'cause you don't want to mess with

IRS or Hacienda--- Well, we shouldn't mess with anybody from

government, but I'm saying, specially taxes. And--- ah--- and

I knew it wasn't going to go away.

Q They were thinking that you had made more money than

the---?

A Well, the thing is, again, this is--- I always like

to have things clear. I like to have things clear, 'cause I

like to argue with things clear, and I think what happens,

usually, is the promoters lie about the gigs. They don't tell

them--you know--exactly how much are the--- the gigs are for,

so they don't--- so they pay less--- ah--- or declare less. I


126


don't know. And I wanted them to be very clear it was three

fifty, then, they had to take away all the expenses, and all

the stuff, and then, whatever was left, that's what we're going

to pay taxes on. It's rumors.

Q What was Hacienda's final position on the matter?

A They believed us, because--I mean--I always pay my

taxes with them. And I asked for the meeting. I asked for the

meeting. You know, I said: "We're going to--- Yes, we're going

to meet---" I--- I--- I didn't remember, or didn't know that

Willy had a gig. He had to leave. Willy had to leave. And they

got pissed like I can't tell you. And I--- and I said: "No, he

had a show--you know--we didn't know that this was going to

happen, and anyway, I'm here. What's the problem? You know,

tell me." 'Cause they felt disrespected.

Q So, there's no issue outstanding there, with Hacienda

now?

A No. No.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I'm going to mark it as the

next exhibit.

THE REPORTER: 13.


THE DEPONENT: I think--- I'm sorry, can I add

something else? I think also the promoters were in hot water

with Hacienda, because the--- I think the--- the--- it's

required that they leave an amount as backup, withholding---


127


you know, and they were supposed to have left like thirty

something thousand dollars, and they didn't. And then--- ah---

that didn't sit well with them. I don't know how--- how--- I

don't know how the promoters resolved that issue.


Q Have you been able to track those sixty two thousand

five hundred dollars---?

A No.

Q So---

A I asked--- The only thing I thought that could have,

in any way, from my perspective, bring any kind of clarity to

that was to ask my accountant, who's Jerry Shustek, is really

careful, it's not like--- ah--- you know, he's very, very

careful. I said: "Look into your records, and check and see if

we received any money during this period of time that we can

ascribe as to whether that money come from; any check, and it

wasn't there.

Q And--- But did you see anything from the promoters

that would---?

A I don't---

Q Or did the promoters---

A No, I don't---

Q ---demonstrate that they had---?

A I don't remember seeing anything of that, other than

what they said, but I--- I--- I stress again; Willy and I


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stayed until like the wee hours of the morning talking to those

guys, and I am sure that they mentioned--- they must have

mentioned that. Why wouldn't they mention the sixty two five?

Why would they mention everything, except that? And I'm sure

that I said: "Where is the money? Where?" You know--- So---

Q But we're talking about more than sixty two five

right now, right? I mean---

A Well, we got the sixty two five, plus. I don't think

that the company deserves to get any fees, plus whatever it is

that was left. There was some money left. I think it was like

seventy thousand, or something, at the end of the day, that we

didn't get paid. I was six---

MS. GONZALEZ: Hundred and twenty five.

THE DEPONENT: Huh?

MS. GONZALEZ: Hundred and twenty five.

THE DEPONENT: The total?

MS. GONZALEZ: Unaccounted for. Yes.

THE DEPONENT: OK., so sixty two plus whatever---

MS. GONZALEZ: No, that's--- Yes. That would be.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK., let me show you another

document.

THE DEPONENT: There was a moment there, when they

didn't come up with the money.

Huh?

MS. GONZALEZ: Amount--- amount unaccounted for.


129


THE DEPONENT: Oh, there you go. See, I put in "amount

stolen in 2002---"

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Wait, wait. Let's---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: It gets messy.

THE DEPONENT: Oh.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: It's hard to recall afterwards

what you're looking at.

THE DEPONENT: OK.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I just showed--- I just handed

to you a document---

THE DEPONENT: I'm sorry, aha.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---that has as the title

"Report on the expenses for the May 3rd show".

Q Have you seen that document before?

A This?

Q Yes.

A I think I made this.

Q You made it? And it says as of May 16th?

A Yes, sir.

Q OK. Well, go ahead. What is this document about?

A Ah--- these are the numbers, as I had them at the

time--- ah--- and I was typing them. Trying to put them in

order, to understand--excuse me--what was what. But I see here,

for instance, Martínez Morgalo forty four, which means fifteen


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percent---

MS. GONZALEZ: No, it's ten percent plus other

expenses they take.

THE DEPONENT: Oh, it includes their ten percent

commission.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK., but let's--- Let me go

line by line. It says---

THE DEPONENT: OK.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---at the beginning: "A,

received by Willy Colón and Rubén Blades---"


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "---a hundred and eighty

thousand four hundred and sixty dollars---"


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "---the wire transfers to

Willy Colón, sixty two thousand five hundred dollars---"


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "---were transferred to Rubén

Blades, sixty eight thousand one twenty five".

Q Why is there a---

A I have---

Q ---six thousand one hundred and twenty five dollar

difference?

A I don't know. I--- I can't explain it.

Q Wire transfer of M&M balance left. What is that? A.C.


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A Oh, this is the monies that were---

Q Received?

A No, but these are the monies--- Remember I mentioned

that, at the end, there was--- ah--- an amount that had not

been cashed by Martínez--- by the office, that's the amount

that the wife of Arturo Martínez, through the offices of Juan

Toro, recouped and sent us here, to the office of Mélida, the

wife of--- ah--- of Gilberto Santa Rosa. That's the forty nine-

-- That was, I think, the last payment that the promoters from

here did---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK., let me---

THE DEPONENT: ---that had not been cashed. It--- it

wasn't taken.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Let me--- I give you--- show

you a photocopy of a check, with some handwritten notes. Let's

mark the first document, as exhibit?


THE REPORTER: 14.

MS. GONZALEZ: 14.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: 14, which would be---

"Vamos a usar la copia de él, porque yo te estoy

dando las mías y, entonces, él se puede confundir allá."

Exhibit 14.


THE DEPONENT: Uh-huh. There it is.


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MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK., the document you're

looking at now, which is the piece of paper with a photocopy of

a check---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---for thirty thousand eight

hundred and twenty dollars, by Víctor Manuelle Ruiz, and some

handwritten notes, that's going to be marked as exhibit 15.



Q What's that about?

A This was a copy of a--- of a part of the forty nine

thousand eight hundred and thirty five dollars that were

deposited in the Martínez Morgalo account, that were sent by

the promoter. That, I think, corresponds to the last payment---

ah--- And it was sent--- I had contacted Juan Toro, and I---

and he--- ah--- con--- This was a surprise. I thought the money

was all gone, and then, he said: "No--you know--the--- the last

advance that the promoters--- The promoters had told us there

was this money that had gone over", and said--- you know,

'cause they sent it almost too late. They didn't send it on the

right times. So the money was not spent. And--- and we found

this out, and then, I asked Juan: "You know, can you send it

over here? Because--you know--we got all these bills that we

need to pay, the expenses that they hadn't paid".

And then, I asked to--- ah--- Gilberto Santa Rosa, I


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think Víctor Manuelle is his partner, or something, and--- and

his wife, and I said: "You know, we're going to need some cash

to pay the musicians, and--- and then, we're going to need to

pay the hotel, and--- and I---" I was paying things also with

my Visa, and what not, "and we're going to need the

reimbursements".

So, they sent the money--- I didn't have an account

here, so--- Neither did Willy, so they sent this amount, minus

whatever they took for the wire, to this--- ah--- to these

people here at the Banco Popular de Puerto Rico, at his

account, and then, from this account, we started drawing money

to pay for all the stuff that needed to be paid.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. Exhi---

THE DEPONENT: "Aquí también falta un pedazo."

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "¿Falta algo?"

THE DEPONENT: "No, es que..."

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "No, es que no se ve."

THE DEPONENT: It's cut.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Whoever has a better copy---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Exhibit 14, which is your May

16th breakdown, or reconciliation of accounts. I don't know

what the term is.

MR. MORGALO: That was 13.


MR. MORGALO: That's 14?


134


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: No, no. 13 "es esto".

MR. MORGALO: "Ah, verdad que sí."

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: 14 "es esto."

Says on AC, wire transfer of M&M balance left forty

nine thousand eight hundred and thirty five.

Q That's what you state that Morgalo's--- I mean,

Martínez's wife transferred from the M&M account---

A Yes.

Q ---to Mr. Víctor Manuelle?

A Uh-huh. I think he sent it to them, yes. The whole

thing I think it was.

Q OK. And Victor Manuelle---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---gave you ten thousand dollars in cash---

A Yes.

Q ---from that account?

A Yes.

Q That you used to pay expenses?

A The whole band and all that.

Q And he kept nine thousand as a reimbursement for a

loan of the same amount---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---given on Friday May the 2nd to pay musicians?

MS. GONZALEZ: "Per diem."

A Uh-huh. The per diem.


135



THE DEPONENT: "Per diem" and stuff.


Q But is that the Gilberto Santa Rosa money---

A Yes.

Q ---or is that---?

A The amounts--- I--- You know, I really don't remember

what it was, but I did make the whole reconciliation of this

things. There were different bills to be paid. Some had to do

with the concert, the performances themselves, others had to do

with the "per diems", others had to do with hotels--- ah---

others had to do with even air transportation--- ah--- You

know, so I--- I can't, right now, remember--- I remember that

most of the cash went directly to musicians, who didn't want to

get paid in--- in checks, 'cause they needed--you know--the

money. They want their money right away. They don't want

checks--- ah---

So, I am sorry, I can't remember exactly--- ah---

Q Who the money went to? OK.

A It's--- it's reconciliating, though, I do--- I do,

and my lawyer has everything, right?

MS. GONZALEZ: Yes.

THE DEPONENT: All the--- the--- how the money was

spent; what was given to whom.



136


Q OK. Then, going back to 14---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---exhibit 14, B, expenses, Martínez and Morgalo,

forty four thousand six dollars and eighty cents---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---including the ten percent commission---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---which you are stating that they shouldn't get

that. I mean---

A After what happened?

A Yes. And then, there's the twenty nine thousand

dollars and seventy five cent expenses paid by Colón Blades,

bringing the total of expenses to seventy three thousand seven

dollars and fifty five cents.

A Right.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Take out the thirty five.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "¿Cómo que ̀ the thirty five'?"

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "El `thirty five' del `ten

percent commission'."

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Ah.

THE DEPONENT: I mean, the out of pocket.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "Sí."

And you reached the conclusion that there's a sixty

two thousand five hundred dollars--you write here--stolen in

2002, that refers to that deposit that is still unclear as to


137


where it actually came from, and sixty three thousand, thirty

three, and twenty, which is the amount they didn't--- M&M

didn't turn over to you two in 2003.



Q That does not include the thirty five thousand dollar

commission that---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "No lo incluye."

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Is that inclu---?

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: No.


Q This does not include the thirty five thousand dollar

commission that M&M collected, right?


Q The--- the two numbers that you state at the end, as

stolen, sixty two thousand five hundred, and sixty three

thousand thirty three and twenty, that does not include the

amounts you say that they should return, because they are not

entitled to a commission?

A Well, at the time, I mean, they did collect it.

Q Yes.

A I probably didn't put it in here.

Q No, no. I'm just trying to clear up the numbers---

A There were monies that were not paid---

Q Yes.


138


A ---and there were monies that I don't think that

they--- they deserve, so---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Got it.

THE DEPONENT: You know---


THE DEPONENT: And there, I put in the promoters

claim, and accepted the credit--- to credit the sixty two

thousand five a payment, and--- ah--- and this was never

mentioned to us. And it didn't appear in the contract that we

saw.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Let me show you this document.

When you had a chance to--- seeing it, and you're ready to be

questioned at it, let me know.

(Long pause.)

THE DEPONENT: Oh, boy. Forgotten about this thing.

That they paid it in disbursements, the sixty two?

MS. GONZALEZ: To you?

THE DEPONENT: Uh-huh. I didn't remember that.

Uh-huh.

THE DEPONENT: "¿Estas son las dos únicas..." These

are the only two pages on this thing?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Well, I don't know, because---

THE DEPONENT: Well, it seems like it didn't--- wasn't

finished.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Well, and it doesn't have


139


consecutive Bates numbers, or I--- I'm---

THE DEPONENT: No, it does. It has a 2 on the top.

"Pero..."

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. We'll try to figure this

out, and---

THE DEPONENT: OK.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---we'll come back to it after

lunch---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---because I notice that it

goes from page 83 to 101.

THE DEPONENT: From--- Aha. "Ah, yo no sé esto qué

es." "Estas `pages'..." Who put these pages?

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: I put the numbers on it from the

photocopies that she gave us.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Yes. So there--- I mean,

there's like twenty pages in between that.

MR. MORGALO: No, but if you notice, on the--- the

documents, a, b, c, d, and it continues to e, f, g, h, i.

THE DEPONENT: Yes.

MR. MORGALO: So it does continue. There's a

continuance, but the question is, at the bottom of that page,

it says 1, and then, it just stops there. Doesn't go beyond

that.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Actually, it was marked by


140


counsel--- by your counsel at the Martínez's deposition. She

introduced it as an exhibit.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Like this?

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Yes. Exhibit number 8.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK., but during the lunch

break, we'll try to figure out this. Because it's unfair, based

on this confusion, to---

THE DEPONENT: But I have to--- Also, what it says,

what Morgalo--- Mr. Morgalo says is true in that--- in that it

does follow from d to e.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: It seems to be a complete

document, yes.

THE DEPONENT: Aha. I don't--- I just see that there's

only "mis argumentos", 1, and then, there's nothing else.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: That document was produced by

your---

THE DEPONENT: I know, I know.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: ---attorney. I just don't know--

-

THE DEPONENT: But I'm just trying to figure out if

this is--- ah--- this was something that I was working on.


Q Do you recall seeing this document?

A Yes, I think I--- I--- I typed this.

Q OK. When you say typed, you mean on a typewriter?


141


A Yes, sir. Or, like I said before, I came in late to

this computer age.

Q Aha.

A I typed everything.

Q And would you---? Would this have been done in 2003?

A Yes.

Q OK. Do you---? Even though there's this confusion as

to the Bates number, do you feel comfortable that this is a

document that you typed? Because it appears to be---

A That is my---

Q Page 1 and 2 of---

A Yes.

Q OK.

A Yes.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: So, let me ask a few questions

on it, and then, we'll break for lunch.



Q What is this document about? What does it do?

A As I continue to try to understand what happened, I--

- I think--- ah--- this is more based on the reception from the

promoters of all the documents that proved that they had made

the payments. Remember, at one point, I said to Tuti Bou--- not

Bone, Tuti Bou--- ah--- She showed--- ah--- She said: "These

guys are serious", and I think those are the things--- the


142


documents I saw on that Wednesday, that I received that

Wednesday, and I started to type a relation of all the

documents that I had received, that proved that they had sent

the money.

Q OK. Section A of the--- of this document simply makes

a reference to the amount---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---of the contract---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---right? And section B of the document, capital

letter B---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---states the way the payments should have been made,

in accordance to the engagement contract.

A Yes, sir, and corresponds to what the contract---

Q Correct.

A ---was that we saw.

Q Right. And then, subsection C, capital letter C, says

that you don't have to perform if you haven't received the

money.

A Uh-huh.

Q Correct?

A Uh-huh. Yes, sir.

Q OK. Then, there's a different heading that says about

the present situation. It starts, right, saying that the


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promoter of the event alleges that he made payments of two

hundred and eighty seven thousand five hundred dollars between

February 27 and April 30, to the office of Martínez Morgalo in

New York, as proof of the allegation, the alleged payments, the

promoter presented--- or presents the following documents from

Banco Popular de Puerto Rico, "as I am told by Jaime Torres"

Torres, El Nuevo Día reporter?

A Uh-huh.

Q Does this mean---?

A And--- and Tuti Bou.

Q And Tuti Bou. Does this mean that they are telling

you that they saw that, or did they actually show you that?

A No, what--- what--- The word--- ah--- "presenta",

I'm--- I'm--- it sounds like it's in present, but it's really--

- I'm saying---

Q Showed.

A ---he--- he showed, and presented these documents to

these people--- ah--- which, then, were sent to me. You follow?

Q Yes.

A I--- I received word of this via Jaime Torres Torres,

and Tuti Bou. They said: "I--- we saw the documents, the

payments were made, these guys are real", and I said: "Well,

send them to me". And then, they send them. And that's when I

see them, and I start putting them all together in this line.

Q And these are money orders?


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A Ah--- yes. "Giros."

Q OK.

A I think they're tran---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: No, wire transfers.

THE DEPONENT: Wire transfers.


THE DEPONENT: Not money orders.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: And--you know--specific

amount, specific date---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---from Banco Popular, in a

total of two hundred eighty seven thousand five hundred

dollars.


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Then---

THE DEPONENT: And actually, look at this here.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---section 3, these are---

alleges that the amount owe--- I mean, the remaining amount---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---sixty two thousand five

hundred dollars were already paid in the year before.


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: And again, they--- Well, I'm

not going to say again.



145


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: And they list four payments---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---with specific dates.

THE DEPONENT: Yes.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: But there's no reference here

to wire transfers or money orders.

Q Do you recall seeing that?

A No.

Q This is just a list they gave in this same way?

A I'm sure that they must have had--- Like I said

before, those guys are very thorough, so they probably had---

Maybe we should look and--- at our record--- ah--- and find---

Because they--- I don't think that they could have remembered

it without a--- a--- a backup document, the date that they sent

them.

MS. GONZALEZ: They're right here.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "Ah, ¿tú los tienes?"

THE DEPONENT: They're over here.

MS. GONZALEZ: Here.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. Now---

MS. GONZALEZ: "Hay más documentos en esta... Pero..."

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Now, Mr. Blades---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---let's go back to exhibit 3.

THE DEPONENT: Exhibit 3?


146


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "A ver si está acá."

THE DEPONENT: "Ya, aquí está".

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. This is the Ecuador

document.


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I understand you don't

remember ever agreeing to this concert, you don't remember

anything about it, the document reflects a date for the concert

of November the 23rd.



Q Correct?

A Yes.

Q And it says--- talks about some monies to be paid on

certain dates. And this is for November 23rd, 2002, and we have

payments that we're looking at, on this last document we're

examining---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---where they claim that they had sent sixty two

thousand five hundred dollars in 2002, and the payments appear

to end on October 28, 2002.

A Uh-huh.

Q Isn't that---? That's correct, right?

A That's what it says, yes.

Q And earlier, we saw the whole thing about the Richie


147


Ray, Bobby Cruz, Cheo Feliciano concert being somewhere around

February. Again, just trying to put the pieces together. Could

these payments be in reference to the exhibit 3 engagement that

you stated that you knew nothing about?

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection, speculative.

A I really don't know, because like I said, there were-

-- First of all, I must confess. Even though I wrote this, I

didn't remember that the payments had been made in segments. I

always, for some reason, thought that they had been made in

bulk--you know--the whole sixty two five--- ah--- I really

don't know, because we're talking about a concert that I didn't

know about, and I can't--- in--- I can't right now figure if

this is something that was supposed to happen in November---

ah--- or if this is something that, then, didn't happen.

Remember also we're talking about--- If that--- in

this bill, we're talking about a hundred and twenty thousand.


THE DEPONENT: So, that would have meant that--- And

the date here is November 23rd, and the last payment down here

was October. Which mean--- which means they would have had to

come up with another sixty in three weeks, or something, to

cover the total. So, if at some point, it was canceled, then---


THE DEPONENT: ---then--- If this happened

effectively, then, it was canceled somewhere around this---


148


before this time---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Uh-huh.

THE DEPONENT: ---and forgotten about, and then,

another deal started, what--- "Why don't you---? Instead of

doing this show, why don't we do this other show? It's more

money, it's better", and then--- "And what about my money?"

"Oh, no, we'll apply this money to the other show."

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: And it---

THE DEPONENT: That's the only thing I can think of,

that that's how they--- this is how they did it. I--- I have no

idea.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: And in this document that you

typed up, it does say that--- the promoter indicated that this

was for a concert that was canceled on two occasions, December

and February---

THE DEPONENT: I'm sorry, which document? Which of the

two---? Oh, this one? OK. Sorry. Aha?


Q Indica---

A "Sí." Yes.

Q The pro--- That this was in relation to a concert

that was going to be done on December of 2002---

A OK.

Q ---and then, on February---

A Right.


149


Q ---of 2003.

A That means---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: No, no, that was canceled. That-

--

THE DEPONENT: Canceled.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: ---was canceled in December---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: On both occasions.

THE DEPONENT: Right. It probably was canceled on both

occasions, with two different artists, meaning probably was

with Cheo, and probably was with Richie, or--- I don't know.


MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: You and---


Q And then, when you say---

THE DEPONENT: Yes, the--- both of us.


Q OK., then, when you say "mis argumentos,..."

A Uh-huh.

Q "...sólo he recibido veintiocho mil..." "I've only

received twenty eight thousand from Martínez Morgalo, related

to this concert---"

A Uh-huh. I think we're talking about the Siembra

concert, or---

Q The Siembra concert.

A Yes.


150


Q Would that allow us to put a date on this document?

I mean, you're saying that you had only received twenty eight

thousand dollars.

A What date was this?

Q It's undated.

A Uh-huh. I really don't remember exactly what it was--

- ah--- and what date would this be? What date do you--- we

think this is?


MS. GONZALEZ: It's undated.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: If you look at exhibit 14---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Let's mark this one. This

would be marked as exhibit---?

THE REPORTER: 16.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: 16. "Vamos a coger la de él,

para marcarla `16'."


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. Look at 14, exhibit 14.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "Es una hoja de un... Este. Este

es `14'".

THE DEPONENT: Aha.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "Y el 16..."

THE DEPONENT: Aha.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: On 14, you're stating that, as


151


of May 16th, you had received wire transfers to Rubén Blades,

sixty eight thousand a hundred and twenty five, and on this

undated document---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---which is 16, your statement

at the end is you've only received twenty eight thousand

dollars related to this concert.



Q Is there an explanation as to the difference?

A Ah--- what I don't know, if it--- what--- what the

twenty eight was related to at this--- in this--- ah---

Q Could it be related to the sixty two thousand five

hundred dollars---?

A No. No.

Q You're sure of that?

A Absolutely.

Q OK.

A Absolutely.

Q But you have no other way to explaining why---?

A I think I didn't finish the thought.

Q OK.

A I didn't finish the thought. That's why I'm saying,

why was that there? I mean what--- what--- where was I going

with that?


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MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Fair enough. So, let's take a-

-- You said thirty minutes?

MS. GONZALEZ: Forty five minutes, to lunch?

THE DEPONENT: I'm fine--you know--I---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: I'm a diabetic. I have to eat

something.

THE DEPONENT: No, please, do. I mean---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: So, let's do it--- Let's take

a forty minute---

THE DEPONENT: Yes.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Forty minute break.

(Off the record.)


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Mr. Blades, just to get back

on track after the break, I want you to look at exhibit 14

again. It's the one that looks like this.

THE DEPONENT: "Ajá, sí, aquí está."

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. I know we've already

discussed this, but just to refresh my memory.

Q When this was made, it says as of May 16---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---they declare--- or the accounted for expenses were

seventy three thousand zero zero seven and fifty five cents,

correct?

A Uh-huh. That's what I wrote.


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Q OK. Of which twenty nine thousand and seventy five

cents were expenses paid by Colón and yourself, in whatever

proportion that was, and forty four thousand six dollars and

eighty cents were expenses called by Martínez and Morgalo,

including their commission, right?

A That's what it says.

Q And their commission would be thirty five thousand.


Q Ten percent, right?

A Yes, sir.

Q OK.

A There was an extra nine thousand something that I

can't remember what it was for.

Q These figures here, do they include the amount owed

to Gilberto Santa Rosa?

A I would think that they were part of what it says

expenses. I'm not sure.

Q OK.

A But if this is the number, I think it was seventy

three. I think it would have included it.

Q Uh-huh.

A So it should have been included in the twenty nine.

Q So--- OK., it should have been included in the twenty

nine.

A I would think so.


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Q OK. So, when you got---

And this one is what? 16?

THE REPORTER: 15.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: 15?

Q When you got exhibit 15, I mean, the check---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---and the amount left in the account---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---which was close to fifty thousand dollars---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---you received ten thousand dollars in cash, which

you used to pay expenses?

A No, I think that--- I--- I'm--- I don't quite

remember. I think that, from the forty nine eight three five,

which was the wire---

Q Yes.

A ---transfer of--- reflecting in the balance. This is

what we received from--- from Arturo's wife. It was sent to---

It was sent by wire, which means I think it was received by

Víctor Manuelle's office, and then, from that, I think we asked

for a portion of it to be given in cash, so we could pay the

musicians--- ah--- and what--- whomever needed to be paid in

cash. And then, the rest was this--- ah--- this check that

appears there.

Q Plus nine thousand dollars that he kept as a


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reimbursement.

A That--- Those were nine thousand dollars that were---

that were--- a re--- a reimbursement, correct.

Q And what was done with the thirty thousand dollars?

A The thirty thousand--- the--- ah--- there was twenty

thousand, I think, that--- Ten thousand I think were sent to

Willy, ten thousand something.

Q OK.

A And the rest, to pay for stuff that--- you know, I

don't know. Air fare, hotel--- ah--- reimbursement for me, for

my--- use of my Visa card--- ah--- what--- what not. It must be

all--- Everything has--- should me in the--- ah---

reconciliation--- ah--- all the--- the receipts.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. Let me show you this

document.

(Pause.)

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: 17. It will be 17.



Q Have you had a chance---

A Yes.

Q ---to look over the document? Do you recognize this

document?

A No.

Q You've never seen it before?


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A I don't remember it.

Q So you don't know who prepared it?

A It wasn't me.

Q Do you know what Montana Studios is?

A Yes.

Q What is that?

A It's a recording studio.

Q And where is it located?

A New York.

Q And you know what--- who was Waldo Meléndez's air

fares is? Or is Waldo Meléndez? Is that a musician?

A No. I--- I--- Osvaldo? Yes.

Q Yes.

A He was, I think, with Willy.

Q José Dávila?

A I think they're all musicians.

Q All the ones that are listed here, all the way down

to---

A That says air fares?

Q Yes.

A Yes.

Q Do you know who Walter Flores is?

A Yes. Piano player. He worked--- ah--- with me. I

think he was--- ah--- was--- ah--- working in the band.

Q Did the---? Did you---? And by you, I mean you, and


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Willy, and M&M---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---incur in hotel expenses in New York---

A Yes.

Q ---in relation to this---

A Yes.

Q ---concert?

A Yes, because there were some guys who traveled from--

- ah--- tra--- guys who traveled from--- ah--- Costa Rica.

Q OK.

A There were several musicians, and the sound guys, who

came from Costa Rica.

Q What, if anything, would Montana Studios have to do

with this concert?

A That's where Willy rehearsed the band.

Q That's where he rehearsed the band. OK. So, this

looks like expenses incurred in relation to the concert?

A Yes. Except that I see here money sent to Rubén

Blades--- Aha, is that me? A hundred and seventeen thousand---

That I---

Q Do you have any idea where that number comes from?

A Not--- No, I mean, unless they added the--- I

received sixty eight, it said, in one--- in one thing, sixty

eight, one twenty five, and you take one seventeen, nine six 0,

and you have--- forty nine eight three five, which is the check


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that we received from the moth--- his--- her--- ah--- Arturo's

wife.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Oh, so---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Oh, OK.


Q So this---

A Arturo's balance---

Q ---they've added this to that?

A I'm sorry?

Q So they've added this---?

A Somebody did, yes.

MR. MORGALO: Hold on a second. I don't think those

numbers are--- I don't think those numbers are correctly

reflected, because if--- if--- if Arturo Martínez's wife

received those--- those funds into the company account, which

I don't know if she had access to it, or not, those monies are

sent from the promoter. It's not in addition to; it's part of

the wires that were originally sent.

THE DEPONENT: The monies were sent back from her

possession to Víctor Manuelle Ruiz's, or whomever---


MR. MORGALO: Then, they should be deduced from---

THE DEPONENT: ---and then---

MR. MORGALO: ---the amount---

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection to Mr. Morgalo---


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THE DEPONENT: The monies---

MS. GONZALEZ: ---testifying.

MS. GONZALEZ: ---the monies--- Whoever--- whomever

did this---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Uh-huh.

THE DEPONENT: ---added the sixty eight thousand

dollars that I allegedly received, plus the forty nine eight

thirty five that correspond to the monies that Arturo's wife

returned by the exercise of Juan Toro. And that's how you get

the one seventeen nine sixty.


THE DEPONENT: And--- Because it's--- if you--- if you

subtract it, that's exactly the number.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: So, the reason I'm asking is

that I believe that we got this---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---as part of the documents---

MS. GONZALEZ: Yes. This a document generated by Mr.

Colón.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: From Mr. Colón?

MS. GONZALEZ: Yes. It's his font.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: His font?

MS. GONZALEZ: Yes.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: The Colón font?

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: It's your lower case number---


160


MS. GONZALEZ: Yes. But it's a Willy Colón document.


THE DEPONENT: It's not---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I just wanted to figure out

what---

THE DEPONENT: Yes---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---what it meant.

THE DEPONENT: ---me too. Thank you. Because I've---

Now, I--- you know, I went--- I saw one seventeen, and I say:

"Where the heck is that coming from?"

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. I--- Well, I had a chance

to examine--- If you take a look at the exhibit--- "¿Cuál es

éste?" 16.

THE DEPONENT: I'm sorry?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: 16, the one you have right in

front of you.

THE DEPONENT: Aha.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Page 2, the list of payments

made for the--- in 2002---

THE DEPONENT: Aha.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---and your counsel, I

believe, provided some copies of the wire transfer originating

documents---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: We'll make copies, but I only


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have one right now.

(Pause.)

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. I'm showing them to you.

I draw your attention to the middle of those pages.

In the first--- In the one that says page number 1,

handwritten---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---it makes a reference to---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: There's a number of the lower

right hand side.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: No, no, the lower--- up---

up---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "Sí, pero abajo, en el nombre."

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "No, pero..." I'm referring to

the upper left---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Oh, the handwritten number.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: That one. That page.

Q It makes a reference to a concert with Cheo

Feliciano, correct?

A "Ahí dice concierto Rubén Blades Puerto Rico 2002,

con Cheo Feliciano."

Q And it's set by Rompeolas--- That's a César Sainz

company, right?

A I don't know.

Q You don't know.


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A Uhm-uhm.

Q To M&M.

A Uh-huh.

Q OK. And then, on the other pages, it simply says that

a 2002 concert.

A The--- "Segundo depósito", I guess it's eg--- dep---

Concierto Rubén Blades Puerto Rico 2002, "¿eso?"

Q Yes.

A Uh-huh, uh-huh.

Q And the dates, I believe, coincide with the ones that

are in the document that---

A Aha.

Q ---that you showed, that's exhibit 16.

A Uh-huh. I guess.


(Pause.)

Q Now, the first one, which is dated--- It says here---

A "El primer pago o el primer documento en la lista."

Uh-huh.

Q Well---

A "Es que el primer pago fue el 27 de junio y está de

cuarto."

Q Yes.

A I'm sorry.

Q Yes. It says six--- I think it says six--- It might


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say six twenty seven, or it might say six twenty one there.

A 27 of June of 2002.

Q Yes.

A It's twenty thousand dollars.

(Pause.)

THE DEPONENT: I'm sorry. That would be the 27. The

other one is twelve thousand five hundred, from 21st of June.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: This is the twelve thousand

five hundred. Yes.


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: The one that says twelve

thousand five hundred---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---says it's for---

THE DEPONENT: 21st of June.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Deposit for ten percent,

second deposit, third deposit--- Oh, I see. It's because the

dates here are not in---

THE DEPONENT: They're not in sequence.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Yes, they're not in sequence.

That's fine.

Q Now, after seeing this, you still don't recall the

thing about this concert?

A No.

Q Any issues regarding this concert?


164


A No. What I remember is that it was talked about, and

scratched, because conflicts of some kind. Was talked about.

Q OK. And I see that, in the concert with Willy

Colón---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---Martínez and Morgalo made some advance payments to

Willy and yourself, during the course of those months. I mean,

the--- each one of you received, at least, sixty two thousand

five hundred dollars---

A Yes.

Q ---from Martínez and Morgalo in two payments.

A Ah--- yes, I think it was two payments.

Q And you mentioned that--- I think you mentioned---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---but I'll ask again, isn't it customary to be

receiving advances as the booking agent is receiving the money?

A It depends. Sometimes--- ah--- Yes, sometimes you

figure you're going to be--- They were supposed to be paying

expenses, as they came along, so there was some money, I mean,

you expect to receive a bunk--- a bunch--- you know, twenty

something here, or twenty seven over here, and then, the--- the

lump sum.

Sometimes you get money in the middle, you call and

you say--you know--"Can you send me something?" Or where they

decide they're going to send you something, and--- it--- I


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don't recall how--- how it was originated, but it's not---

ah--- it's not unheard of to have an--- an advance in the

middle of the---

Q And---

A ---of the--- of the--- ah--- period.

Q And you don't recall if, at any time between June of

2002, and October of 2002---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---as M&M is receiving money from Rompeolas, or César

Sainz, d/b/a---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---Rompeolas, M&M was advancing money to you?

A No.

Q You say no, you don't recall, or you---

A No, I don't---

Q ---say that---?

A ---have any information regarding that. And like I

said before, my accountant is very, very good at keeping

records, so if it's not in there, it didn't happen.

Q And as it stands today---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---it is your understanding that Rivas and Sainz---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---did disburse the full three hundred and fifty

thousand?


166


A Yes, because I'm looking at the--- at the--- "¿cómo

se llama?", wire transfers. I don't think they made that--- for

what--- You know--- I don't think it's a bogus---

Q Yes. And---

A ---wire transfer.

Q ---and that--- those three hundred and fifty thousand

dollars include the sixty two thousand five hundred dollars

that they paid sometime during the course of 2002.

A That's what they said. Yes. That's what they said.



Q Now, Mr. Blades, of those--- As of today, all

expenses have been paid?

A I--- I'm pretty sure, 'cause I never had--- I'm

not--- anyone called me for money.

Q If you were able to track the sixty two thousand five

hundred dollars---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---how much of this money belongs to Willy Colón?

A Half.

Q Half?

A Absolutely.

Q OK. "Ah, bueno", and if the M&M commission were---

A Half.

Q And any outstanding amount---


167


A Half. Willy--- Willy--- Look, Willy gets half of

everything, you know? That's the deal. That's what we talked.

And that's the deal.

Q Is it your understanding that M&M is not entitled to

any commissions on this concert?

A My feeling in this thing, with all due respect to

everyone, and they can say: "Well, we worked, and--you know--we

deserve money", but my feeling is that we were all--- ah---

done a very huge disservice, so my feeling is you--- they

shouldn't get anything. But that's my feeling. They should not

get anything. You know? That's my feeling.

And I'm sorry, because you can argue: "OK., we

worked, and--you know--part of it, yes, we worked", but I mean,

I--- I don't think he--- I don't think either of us is

satisfied with what happened. So, under those conditions, they

should relinquish whatever amount they think they should have

earned, because this is a horrible scenario.

MS. GONZALEZ: Let the record reflect that Mr. Morgalo

is agreeing---

MR. MORGALO: Oh, I agree---

MS. GONZALEZ: ---nodding with his head.

MR. MORGALO: ---I--- I do agree a hundred percent. I

mean, I don't know if I'm allowed, but I--- I agree a hundred

percent with that statement.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. I'm going to mark--- I


168


don't have any more questions. I'm going to mark those last---

I'm going to get a copy of the last---

THE DEPONENT: Yes.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---set of documents that I

showed you, and have it marked as an exhibit.

I need to ask the other parties if they have any

questions for Mr. Blades.

MR. MORGALO: I do. I have a series of questions. Can

I get five minutes to get my thing together?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Absolutely.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: And we should let the record

know that, after this deposition, sister counsel and I will be

reviewing some documents that Mr. Morgalo has brought, that we

intend to review, photocopy, and any questions arise from there

for Mr. Colón, you're welcome to make any such questions later,

after you review them.

MR. MORGALO: And I would like to add, I would like to

invite both, Willy and Rubén to examine---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: And I'm going to ask you to

sit here---

MR. MORGALO: While I do the---?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: To establish some---

MR. MORGALO: Some space?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Some space.

THE DEPONENT: Can I say something off the record.


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MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Sure.

MS. GONZALEZ: Go off the record.

(Off the record.)


MR. MORGALO: OK., this is Robert Morgalo, "pro se",

with my questioning of defendant and cross-plaintiff, Rubén

Blades.

CROSS-EXAMINATION

BY ROBERTO MORGALO:

A Mr. Blades, do you believe that I stole money from

you and Willy Colón?


MR. MORGALO: I'm asking---

MS. GONZALEZ: That's not within the scope of the

examination---

MR. MORGALO: It is, because---

MS. GONZALEZ: ---that counsel made.

MR. MORGALO: ---it pertains--- it pertains to

everything that we're asking questions off here.

MS. GONZALEZ: No. It pertains to your lawsuit against

him for defamation.

MR. MORGALO: Which is consolidated---

MS. GONZALEZ: And for that, you need---

MR. MORGALO: ---which is consolidated---

MS. GONZALEZ: But you need to depose him for that,


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because that's not the scope of this examination.

MR. MORGALO: Well, the--- the objection---

MS. GONZALEZ: If you want to ask questions about

that---

MR. MORGALO: ---is noted, correct?

MS. GONZALEZ: The ob--- If you want to ask questions

about that, you need to schedule a deposition for the purposes

of your lawsuit.

MR. MORGALO: I ask him a question. The objection is

noted. I just want to know if he can answer the question, if he

believes that I stole money from him.


MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Yes, but you're not going to

instruct your client not to answer. I mean---

MR. MORGALO: It's noted.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: ---'cause I'll call the judge.


MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Yes, the objection is noted.

MR. MORGALO: The objection is noted.

MS. GONZALEZ: I don't believe you use this deposition

to depose him on the substance of your claim---

MR. MORGALO: Well, I'm going---

MS. GONZALEZ: ---against Mr. Blades.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Counsel, your objection is

noted.


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MS. GONZALEZ: He does not need to answer that.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: You want to call---?

MS. GONZALEZ: It's not relevant. It is not relevant

to this.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: OK. The objection noted.

MS. GONZALEZ: You can ask a question about the scope

of his examination.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Quite frankly, I don't know

the answer to this, whether--- I mean, to be honest, because he

is a what? A cross? There's a cross-claim here?

MS. GONZALEZ: Correct.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Yes, and it's consolidated. It's

all consolidated.

MS. GONZALEZ: It's a claim that he initiated in the

Southern District of New York, it's a separate, different

claim---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Oh, it's a separate case.

MS. GONZALEZ: Yes, it is.

MR. MORGALO: No, it's consolidated to this case.

MS. GONZALEZ: It's a--- But it's a separate case.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Pamela---

MS. GONZALEZ: It's a--- The cases are separate---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Pamela---

MS. GONZALEZ: ---for the purposes of trial. Counsel,


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let me finish.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Oh, I thought you had finished.

MS. GONZALEZ: Your case against my client is a

separate and distinct matter, that is not going to be tried

together with this case.

MR. MORGALO: Well---

MS. GONZALEZ: It will not.

MR. MORGALO: ---just so you understand, the numbers

and the figures that Rubén Blades is addressing here--all

right?--are the same numbers and figures, and he said, in this

particular case, in this statement, and--- and as of my

rebuttal, he said that we stole from him.

THE DEPONENT: Yes.

MR. MORGALO: He said it in this--- Hold a second. He

said it in this particular deposition. Forget about the other--

-

MS. GONZALEZ: No, he did not.

MR. MORGALO: Yes, he did. And we can---

MS. GONZALEZ: Not in---

MR. MORGALO: ---go back to the record.

MS. GONZALEZ: ---this deposition.

MR. MORGALO: In this deposition, he said it several

times.

MS. GONZALEZ: Secondly, it's immaterial.

MR. MORGALO: And it's in--- it's in---


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MS. GONZALEZ: What he believes---

MR. MORGALO: It's in the record.

MS. GONZALEZ: ---after--- Excuse me. What he believes

about what you did, or what your partner did, or the

corporation did is immaterial to the---

MR. MORGALO: It's---

MS. GONZALEZ: ---to this case.

MR. MORGALO: It's immaterial, but in all the---

MS. GONZALEZ: Because---

MR. MORGALO: ---exhibits--- I heard you.

MS. GONZALEZ: ---the defenses--- the defenses---

MR. MORGALO: Hold on a second. In the---

MS. GONZALEZ: ---are stated.

MR. MORGALO: ---exhibits that are presented here as

evidence--all right?--it sates on---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Let's call the judge.

MS. GONZALEZ: What he believes is immaterial.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "Sí, pero es que me molesta el

abuso."

MR. MORGALO: I appreciate that.

Look, exhibit 13, which is part of this---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: That might be the solution.

MR. MORGALO: Exhibit 13, which is part of the record

here, of this deposition, it says: "I also want Arturo to

clarify the extent of Robert Morgalo's involvement in this


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situation, and because so far, Arturo is the one we all have

focused on, but it seems to me, it's obvious, Morgalo had a

hand as well in the embezzlement, and it's in Arturo's personal

interest to explain what the role the latter played in this".

This was not just entered into evidence, but it was stated

verbally---

MS. GONZALEZ: That's fine. You may ask a question

about that exhibit.

MR. MORGALO: Well, I just did. I just---

MS. GONZALEZ: Ask the question.

MR. MORGALO: The question that I have for your client

is:

Q Mr. Blades, I want to repeat it one more time. Do you

believe---?

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection. You may refer to the

exhibit, and ask him about the exhibit.

MR. MORGALO: OK. Thank you very much.

Q Mr. Blades, in exhibit 13---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---on paragraph 1, towards the middle, where it

starts saying: "I also want to clarify the extent of Robert

Morgalo's involvement in the situation".

A Uh-huh.

Q As you continue to read the end of that paragraph, do

you believe that Robert Morgalo stole money, and embezzled


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money from you and Willy Colón?

A Yes.

Q OK. Thank you very much. Based on this statement

right here, from the same evidence, do you believe that if it

is proven that Robert Morgalo stole money, and embezzled money

from both you and Colón, that Robert Morgalo should be held

accountable for it?

A I think Morgalo and Martínez should be held

accountable for it.

Q OK. But you do believe Morgalo---

A I believe---

Q ---should be---

A ---Morgalo---

Q ---if found---

A ---Morgalo and Martínez office should be accountable,

held accountable for the monies that were not paid to Willy

Colón and myself.

Q If it is proven---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---that there was embezzlement going on, or that we

stole money, correct?

A That the office of Martínez and Morgalo stole, or---

Q Well, I'm ask---

A ---did not report the amounts--- Yes.

Q OK. I'm asking specifically about Robert Morgalo.


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A I am answering you the office--- To me, Robert

Morgalo is one of the two people that were involved in this

issue. We're talking about the office of Martínez and Morgalo.

I'm not making this personal.

Q OK.

A As a member of that office, you are either solidary,

or you have a rep--- a responsibility in what happened.

Q OK.

A That's my--- that's my position.

Q OK. In the same token, if it's proven that Robert

Morgalo had no embezzlement, and Robert Morgalo did not steal

money, should Robert Morgalo, in the same token that he could

be held responsible and accountable---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---can Robert Morgalo be exonerated?

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection. It's a legal question.

A I have no idea, 'cause that would be up to a judge---

MR. MORGALO: OK.

THE DEPONENT: ---I mean, not to me.

MR. MORGALO: All right. Now, I'd like to present into

evidence--- Now, these are the only copies I have.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I'll make copies.

MR. MORGALO: Thank you very much.

Counsel for Colón submitted into evidence a wire

transfer, or documents of wire transfer regarding monies that


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were sent to Rubén Blades and to Willy Colón. I'd like to

present that as exhibits, all of them. And just to--- for the

record, there's two wire transfers from Martínez, Morgalo and

Associates to El Malo, Inc., and two wire transfers to Rubén

Blades Productions.

THE REPORTER: Exhibits 19 and 20.

MR. MORGALO: How you--- You know--- No, I don't know

how the process---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: You can put them together in one

document.

MR. MORGALO: Yes.


(Pause.)

THE DEPONENT: What is the date of the second payment

of the forty? Can I see it? "Gracias."

(Pause.)

THE DEPONENT: I'm OK.

MR. MORGALO: You're good?

THE DEPONENT: "Sí."

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q OK. There are two wire transfers there for Rubén

Blades Productions.

A Uh-huh.

Q Do you acknowledge that you did receive that wire?

A No. Oh, I'm sorry.


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Q Yes.

A I would think so.

Q OK.

A Yes.

Q And your--- and your document, that's been entered

into---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: It's been marked.

MR. MORGALO: Exhibit marked 14.

Q You put in there received by Willy Colón or Rubén

Blades, and it's a wire transfer to Willy Colón and a wire

transfer to Rubén Blades.

A Uh-huh.

Q Total, sixty eight thousand one twenty five---

A Right.

Q ---to Rubén, and sixty two thousand five hundred---

A Right.

Q ---to Colón. Does that add up to the amounts listed

in this---

A Yes, I would think that's the--- that--- Yes.

Q OK.

A I think those two are the---

MR. MORGALO: Thank you. Now, counsel for Colón also

entered into evidence two of wire transfers submission from the

promoters of Siembra to Martínez, Morgalo and Associates. I'd

like to present into evidence proof of wire transfers received,


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which--- on our end, that--- the--- the same dates and monies

that were sent--- that are listed on this document.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: This document being---?

MR. MORGALO: I'm sorry. Number 16.


MR. MORGALO: Which, on that document, it shows the

dates of the wire transfers, from Puerto Rico. This is the

acknowledgment of the receipt of those wire transfers on this

end.

Now, I don't have copies, but I need this stuff to

them--- so perhaps, later on, we can make copies---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: We'll make copies for

everybody.

MR. MORGALO: So if we can just annotate what--- what

we started with, which--- ah---


MR. MORGALO: With which one we started? 17?

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: The court reporter will know it.

MR. MORGALO: OK., OK.


MR. MORGALO: The one prior to that was--- was what?

THE REPORTER: 19.

MR. MORGALO: 19, OK.


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: If you want me to make copies


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first, so that he can have a copy, while---

MR. MORGALO: No.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---you ask him---

MR. MORGALO: I just want--- I just want to make sure

that we're all clear on the--- on the amounts, of who got what,

who got when, and just to make sure that--- that it's all in

there.

THE DEPONENT: I'm OK., uh-huh.

(Pause.)

MS. GONZALEZ: Excuse me.

(Long pause.)

MS. GONZALEZ: For the most part, they're underlined

for certain subjects, so we would like a copy, just so that we

know---


MS. GONZALEZ: ---what he underlined.

(Off the record.)


BY MR. MORGALO:

Q Counsel for Colón presented into evidence exhibit 11.

On page--- I guess it's page 147, bottom, right hand corner, or

page 8, top, right hand corner.

A Yes.

MR. MORGALO: OK. The first part of that paragraph, if

you could read--- I mean, you can read the whole paragraph. I'm


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interested mainly in the first half of the paragraph, and in

the last sentence of that paragraph. Now, should I---? Can I

paraphrase it in English, to the best of---? Or should I have

the--- the---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: You can paraphrase.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: You can paraphrase, and

counsel for Mr. Blades---

MR. MORGALO: I mean, Mr. Blades, can---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I mean, he knows if it's

accurate or not. Yes.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q Can you tell me, in your own words, what the first

part of that paragraph states?

A Here?

Q I'm sorry, the top, page 8, or the---

A Top of page 8--- ah---

MR. MORGALO: Where it says: "Para el día 16".

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Page 7. No, "número" 7.

THE DEPONENT: All right, 7.

MR. MORGALO: Oh, OK. "Porque ahí dice... Ah, perdón,

OK., perdón. Disculpa, porque yo vi `page 8' allá arriba."

THE DEPONENT: Yes.

MR. MORGALO: OK. Where it says: "Para el día 16 de

enero".

THE DEPONENT: Right.


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MR. MORGALO: If you could read that, and let me

know---

THE DEPONENT: In English?

MR. MORGALO: Well, you could, if you want. I mean,

however you feel most comfortable.

THE DEPONENT: No, what is--- What should I do? It's

in Spanish.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Well, you should---

THE DEPONENT: Should I translate it?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: You should say in English what

it says.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q OK., can you tell me in English what---?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: It doesn't have to be---

MR. MORGALO: It doesn't have to be word per word.

Q Can you tell me what it means to you?

A In Eng--- It says: "By the 16 of January, I received

a call from Robert, where it indicates that he's going to the

Army, and that Arturo, from now on, is going to be in charge of

all negotiations. I called Arturo sad, because I had

established a professional relationship with Roberto, and we

had a little more--- developed more trust. Arturo says on

Saturday 18 January they would be making a farewell for Roberto

in his house, and I immediately told him I would like to go to

New York, and say good bye to Roberto, and thank him about all


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the other"--- ah--- "past months of conversations, and wish him

good luck, and so it was, traveled to New York with my wife

18th January, and I remember, if not badly, that Arturo comment

that you were around, in that same day you went to Los

Angeles", meaning", I guess me.

"We handle about---" No, "we drove about two and a

half hours to give Robert a surprise that I had gone to Puerto

Rico to say good bye, and from that moment on, all the

conversations following that were with Arturo Martínez."

Q OK. So, for the purpose of establishing the timeline-

--

A Uh-huh.

Q ---regarding to the questions of the monies that came

in for the Siembra show, and the alleged monies that came in

for the 2002 shows, can we---? I mean, would you say---? You

OK.?

THE DEPONENT: Go ahead. No, no, it's OK.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q Would you say that that day---? Would you ask

earlier, if you knew at what time, or you had commented

earlier, on the record, that you were not clear as to at what

point, whether it was January or February, that was no longer

operating the company.

A No.

MR. MORGALO: OK.


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THE DEPONENT: I should answer?

MS. GONZALEZ: Yes.

THE DEPONENT: No. What I meant was it was obvious to

me--- My concern right now, and I think this is the main issue,

I think, for all of us, is what happened with the sixty two

thousand five hundred dollars.

MR. MORGALO: Correct.

THE DEPONENT: And that, when I said that, I wasn't

sure what had happened, including yourself, has to do with fact

that those monies were paid, and those monies were used as a

backup, as an advance for a concert that we were having, that

had nothing to do with that gig. And the fact that I'm sure

Colón thought I had received the money, and I had pocketed it.

And that money was never given to me, and that money was

received by you guys, at the time when you were there, and

then, the question is why wasn't I told about this money, and

howcome that money, then, later on, shows up as an advance

against a concert that has nothing to do with Willy Colón or

myself.

And then, I went: "Where's the money? What happened

here?" And Arturo--you know--his position was, by then, they

were already having trouble, and the money was being used to--

you know--pay for stuff that didn't work, and that--- So, I

thought: "OK., we have to clear this part. This is the part

that I wanted to cle---" And that's when I--- when I mention


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you---

MR. MORGALO: OK., well---

THE DEPONENT: ---because I was very careful, always,

with this thing, until I started getting information, and then,

I started making harder questions.

MR. MORGALO: OK. Now, can we go back to that same

page? I just want to---

Q The question that I have specifically---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---is this: based on this conversation with--- or

this statement from Ariel Rivas, as of the 16th of January---

A Yes.

Q ---he was informed that all negotiations, from that

point on---

A Yes.

MR. MORGALO: That's the same one that we're not

supposed to be writing on.

THE DEPONENT: Oh. Yes, take it away.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Your attorney---

MR. MORGALO: There you go.

MS. GONZALEZ: ---has a copy.

THE DEPONENT: It's OK., it's OK. Sorry, sorry.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q Basically, what I want to get at is that, based on

this letter from Ariel Rivas, we can determine that, as of---


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You can determine--- It can be determined that---


MR. MORGALO: What?

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Let him finish the question.

MR. MORGALO: Yes, I'm not--- I'm not finished.

Q Based on this letter that's in evidence, from Ariel

Rivas to you, can it be established that, as of the 16th of

January, Ariel Rivas was clear that all negotiations for this

particular show, Siembra, was to be done through Arturo

Martínez?

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection. Argumentative.

A Well, that's exactly what it says.

MR. MORGALO: Thank you very much. That's what I

wanted to know, OK.?

Q So, from the 16th of January forward, all

negotiations for Siembra is in the hands of Arturo Martínez,

correct?


A I don't know that, because you could have been

addressing it through phone.

MR. MORGALO: OK., all right, that's fair--- that's a

fair answer. OK.

You have made allegations, and it's in here, in the

statement, and I hope I could find it, expeditiously.

In exhibit 14--OK.?--exhibit 14, in the bottom of the


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page, it says here: "The amounts the promoters claim they paid

in 2002 for a show I was to do, and that was canceled twice by

them, due to conflicting schedules---" Now, you typed this up,

and used the word promoters claim. OK., and this was dated May

16th. All right?

Q As of May 16th, were you still not sure that the

claim was a fact, or just a claim?

A No, that's what they--- they stated. That's what I

meant. I didn't--- When I said--- when I wrote claim, it

doesn't mean that I doubted what they were saying. We had

already seen the--- I think by that date, I had already seen

the--- the wire transfers.

Q So, let me ask you a question. At the--- Your

determination that those funds---

A Which funds?

Q The sixty two thousand five hundred. That's what I'm

going to get to right now.

A OK.

Q The sixty two thousand five hundred dollars that is

being claimed was authorized to be applied towards that Siembra

show--all right?--where--- what gives you the impression that

those sixty two thousand five hundred dollars were to be

applied towards the Siembra show? Where do you get that from?

A I get it from the promoter.

Q From the promoters. So basically, your entire


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knowledge of that sixty two thousand five hundred dollars being

applied towards that show comes from the promoter?


A And your partner.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q And who's partner?

A Yours.

Q OK.

A Arturo Martínez.

MR. MORGALO: Arturo Martínez? OK.

(Pause.)

MR. MORGALO: I want to enter into evidence. This is

the only copy that I have.


THE DEPONENT: And may I add something also? You

received--- you just showed--if I'm not wrong--receipts for

the--- for all the amounts received.

MR. MORGALO: No.

THE DEPONENT: Not those?

MR. MORGALO: No. The ones that I showed were the ones

that were listed out here. We're going to get to all of it.

"Luego..." By the time this is all over---

THE DEPONENT: All right, all right.

MR. MORGALO: ---there's going to be clarity here.

(Pause.)


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MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: I think we should make--- Let

me---

MS. GONZALEZ: Can you, please, make few copies?

We go off the record for a second.

(Off the record.)


BY MR. MORGALO:

Q Mr. Blades, I just handed out exhibit number 21. Can

you, please, tell me what this looks like to you?

(Pause.)

A It's a contract.

Q Contract for who?

A Rubén Blades, featuring Editus Ensemble.

Q OK. To perform where?

A At the Coliseo Roberto Clemente.

Q On what date?

A December 7, 2 0 2 (sic.)

Q What's the date of this contract?

A The date of the contract?

Q Of the contract. Top--- top right hand corner on the

document.

A 30th May 2002.

Q OK. So, it's a contract for the 30th of May, 2002---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---for a show---


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A That's what it says.

Q ---for a show--- Yes. For a show in Puerto Rico,

September--- December 7, 2002.

A Right.

Q Correct?

A Uh-huh.

Q It says: "Deposit in the amount of six---" Can you

tell me what the deposit breakdown is?

A Sixty two thousand five hundred dollars---

Q Uh-huh.

A ---due no later than June 7th, 2002.

Q Uh-huh. OK. The second page of that---

A Yes.

Q ---what is the company for this presentation?

A Martínez, Morgalo and Associates, and then, it says:

"FSO Rubén Blades".

Q OK. Who's the promoter?

A César Sainz.

MR. MORGALO: OK. For the services of.

THE DEPONENT: FSO---

MR. MORGALO: FSO is for the services of.

THE DEPONENT: All right. OK.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q Have you ever seen this contract?

A No.


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Q OK. Are you aware what this contract is for?

A It's for a show in December, with an advance in June-

-- in May.

MR. MORGALO: In May. Correct.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: In June.

THE DEPONENT: The advance was in June?

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Well, the deposit.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: The contract there is 30th of

May, the first payment should be---

THE DEPONENT: OK. Sorry. The contract was allegedly

made on the 30th of May, 2002, and the deposit was supposed to

be paid no later than June 7, 2002.

MR. MORGALO: OK. Now, back to---

(Pause.)

MR. MORGALO: Back to exhibit 16, please.

On exhibit 16, a paragraph 3, page 2, can you read---

or translate in English, clarify paragraph 3 to us?

THE DEPONENT: Basically, it says that "Promoter

Dissar Productions alleges that the sixty two thousand five

hundred dollars that were missing from the three hundred and

fifty thousand dollar contract were paid the year before"--

meaning 2002--"this way, and I have ten thousand, on 28 of

October, two thousand into twenty thousand 3rd of October,

2002, twelve thousand five hundred, 21st of June, 2002, and

twenty thousand dollars on 27 of June of 2002.


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MR. MORGALO: OK. Now---

(Pause.)

MR. MORGALO: OK. I want to submit to evidence the

only copies that I have of the wire transfers that came in to

Martínez, Morgalo and Associates, from that list that you just

listed, on exhibit---

MS. GONZALEZ: On the four--- those four?

MR. MORGALO: Yes, this is money that--- received by

Martínez, Morgalo and Associates, from---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Let me make copies.

MR. MORGALO: OK., thanks.

Is an objection there, counsel?

MS. GONZALEZ: No.

(Off the record.)

(Whereupon, exhibit 22 was marked off the record.)


THE DEPONENT: Twenty, ten and twenty. So there's a

twelve five, that's the one that is not--- Is this yours? Is

this the---?

MS. GONZALEZ: Yes.

THE DEPONENT: OK., so that's the one that is not---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I'm just saying for the record

that Mr. Morgalo has presented, as exhibit 22 to this

deposition, three documents that appear to be the receipts of

some wire transfers--- October 3, 2002, for twenty thousand


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dollars; October 29, 2002, for ten thousand dollars; and June

27, 2002, for twenty thousand dollars.

THE DEPONENT: I also want to say something, state

something for the record. I never heard of--- ah--- And my

memory doesn't help me, but I never--- I don't remember ever

seeing a contract in June for a gig in December. I don't--- I

don't ever remember anyone making contracts that far ahead in

advance.

(Pause.)

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q Have you ever instructed Robert Morgalo, or Arturo

Martínez, or Martínez, Morgalo and Associates to hold funds

sent on your behalf?

A Have I ever authorized you to hold funds sent on my

behalf?

Q Instructed us to hold funds on your behalf.

A Not--- not--- not in so many words.

Q Have you ever specifically told us not to send money

to Jerry Shustek?

A No. Not that I can remember. On the contrary. I would

say that you would have to do that.

Q OK. Have you ever---? You were asked earlier today if

you have ever paid us consulting fees, and you said no, right?

A Consulting fees--- consult about what?

Q And you've also been asked have you ever paid rent---


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A Right.

Q ---at---

A At your office.

Q At our office.

A And---

Q And you said no.

A No.

Q OK.

A They also asked me if I had paid for an employee, and

I said no.

Q OK. Now, do you have any medical condition that--- or

history of---? Yes, I say this respectfully.

A No, it's OK.

Q I don't mean to--- Of absent mindedness, or

forgetfulness? Or forgetfulness?

A No.

Q Do you have a history of forgetting things?

A No, I don't.

Q OK.

A Well, I--- I forget things, but to have a medical

condition, no.

Q OK. All right. But you acknowledge that you are

forgetful in some things.

A I could be---

Q OK.


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A ---and I have been told so.

MR. MORGALO: OK. I want to present as evidence--OK.?-

-to rebut the statements made---


MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: No, no, no, no.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: You don't have to say what it

is for.

MR. MORGALO: Oh, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. My apology.

OK.? I'm going to enter into evidence whatever you want to call

this. These--- well, let me---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Let me make copies of it.

MR. MORGALO: OK.

(Off the record.)

(Whereupon, exhibit 23 was marked off the record.)


MR. MORGALO: Mr. Blades, I just have admitted into

evidence exhibit--- exhibit 23?

THE REPORTER: 23.

MR. MORGALO: 23.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q OK. Can you, please, tell me what exhibit 23 is?

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: The--- "Ese es el que tiene que

mostrarle."

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: But he should have a copy.

A These are papers that say consulting fee for January,


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for eleven hundred dollars, sent to--- It says here Jerry

Shustek, and the're several amounts, invoices, from M&M to

Jerry Shustek, Rubén Blades Productions, care of Jerry

Shustek---

Q Can you list the---?

A ---for different amounts.

Q Can you list the dates of each one of those, please?

A Ah--- 8.23.2000, 9.26.2000, 11.21.2000, 8.11.2000---

And there's a band payroll, and ground transportation, and

reimbursement or tickets---

Q Uh-huh.

A ---I don't know what that is--- Sixty--- sixty two

hundred.

Q Uh-huh.

A There's another invoice for consulting fee for June,

2000---

Q Uh-huh.

A ---for eleven hundred dollars, there's something

tour, for two thousand, but--- The consulting fee of April of

2000.

Q OK. Do you know what that is---

A No.

Q ---what's that for? Do you recall---?

A No.

Q Do you recall that when--- ah--- Martínez, Morgalo


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and Associates and Rubén Blades Productions opened up the

office---?

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection, you're testifying.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Counsel, let him finish.

MR. MORGALO: I'm asking a question.

Q I'm asking if you recall something, to clarify what

this is.

A Uh-huh.

Q Do you recall that Martínez, Morgalo and Associates,

and Rubén Blades Productions, when they opened their office,

that we shared, based on that document that was already

admitted into evidence, with the authorization of Martínez,

Morgalo and Associates, and Rubén Blades Production had the

same address, and same fax number, and same phone number,

right? Do you recall that, when we went looking for---? Do you

remember that we went looking for office space together?

A No, I don't.

Q You don't. Do you recall that you paid--- agreed to

pay rent at 350 Broadway?

A No, I don't.

Q OK. Do you recall that Jerry Shustek advised you

that, instead of calling it rent, we should call it consulting

fees?

A No, I don't.

Q So, why are we getting consulting fees every months


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for eleven hundred dollars?

A I think that you're getting the eleven hundred

dollars for some reason, that's for sure, and I'm going to ask

Jerry what it is.

Q OK. Is it possible to reconcile that with some

payments from Rubén Blades Productions for that same timeframe?

A I have no idea. I would have to ask Jerry.

Q OK. Would you be able to produce those later on, if

needed?

A If he has them, I'll make sure he gives them.

Q OK. You also stated that you never told--- instructed

me, or anyone at Martínez Morgalo not to send money to Jerry

Shustek?

A No, I didn't say that. That I instructed you never to

send money to Jerry?

Q To not send money to Jerry.

A I never said that. And if you check the record,

that's not what I said. I--- I said that I would think that you

would send the money to Jerry.

MR. MORGALO: Well, let's go back---

THE DEPONENT: If you received money that was supposed

to go to me, those monies should be reported to my accountant

office.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q The question I asked you earlier---


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A Uh-huh.

Q ---if you ever instructed Robert Morgalo---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---Arturo Martínez, or anyone at Martínez, Morgalo

and Associates---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---to hold your money, and specifically, not send

money to Jerry Shustek?

A I don't ever remember saying that.

MR. MORGALO: OK.



THE DEPONENT: To not send any monies to Jerry

Shustek's office, without my permission or approval. It's time

I check a first answer approach in matters concerning my

finances.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q What's the date on that?

A April 12, 2 0 2 (sic.)

MR. MORGALO: OK. Can we make copies of that, please?


THE DEPONENT: That's different than saying that I

told you never to send money to Shustek.

(Pause.)

(Off the record.)


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200



BY MR. MORGALO:

Q Mr. Blades, do you recall writing that letter?

A I'm sure it was me.

Q OK. You had mentioned earlier that Arturo Martínez---

excuse me, Martínez, Morgalo and Associates only represented

you in matters of music and bookings. Did Martínez, Morgalo and

Associates do anything beyond the scope of booking for your

career?

A It might have happened that, at some specific

scenario, I would have said: "Could you help me with this?"

Q OK. Fair enough. Now, based on exhibit 24, regarding

your statement, or letter, and exhibit 23---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---your invoices to---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---and other statements that you have made throughout

the course of this deposition, where you do not recall, or do

not remember, specifically statements when you said you do not

recall, and you don not remember---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---this particular show for sixty two thousand five

hundred dollars---

A Right.

Q Is it possible---?


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MS. GONZALEZ: Objection, what show for sixty two

thou---?

MR. MORGALO: I'm sorry. The deposit for sixty two

thousand, five hundred--- The show with just you, with Ariel

Rivas---


MR. MORGALO: ---or the Dissar productions for the

December 7 show---


MR. MORGALO: ---that was going to be just you---


MR. MORGALO: ---OK.? You have mentioned---

THE DEPONENT: Talking about the one in May?

MS. GONZALEZ: Uh-huh.

MR. MORGALO: I'm speaking right now specifically

about the one in 2002.

THE DEPONENT: The contract made that began that

deposit from June to--- when I---

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q Right. Do you agree---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---that there's a huge question regarding the sixty

two thousand five hundred dollars?

A Yes.

Q OK. That's where I'm trying to get at right now.


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202


A Uh-huh.

Q I'm trying to clarify this right now---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---OK.? You had stated earlier that you were not

aware of this particular show.

A That's correct.

Q OK. Is it possible---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---just as you have forgotten all these other things-

--

A Uh-huh.

Q ---is it possible Rubén---

A Uh-huh.

Q I'm sorry, Mr. Blades.

A Uh-huh.

Q I'm sorry about that.

A OK.

Q Is it possible---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---that you---? Is it possible that you may have

forgotten this?

A No.

Q OK. Why?

A Because when I--- Remember that I--- my--- I don't

make my own tax declaration. I send all of this to Shustek.


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203


Q Uh-huh.

A So when I ask him to check, he checks everything.

Q Uh-huh.

A He doesn't just check his--- ah--- records for monies

that go to him. He would have checked my records, and seen my

bank account, and see if---

Q OK.

A ---I, all of a sudden, got a twelve thousand dollar--

- ah--- statement, or whatever it is that those amounts were.

Q OK.

A So--- And I never got any word on them--- on that,

and I, personally, don't remember ever receiving those monies.

Q OK. But you don't remember.

A No, I--- I--- See, I'm telling you. I mean, I---

other than to say no, no, I have not received---

Q OK.

A ---those amounts.

Q Oh. I'm not asking you about the amounts.

A Uh-huh.

Q I'm asking specifically about the date itself, OK.?

A The dates?

Q The show itself.

A No.

Q This particular show.

A No.


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204


Q OK.? All right. There is a contract---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---for--- that is presented into evidence here, for

Rubén Blades, at El Coliseo, for December 7th, correct?

A That's what it says there.

Q OK. You do not recall my speaking to you about this

particular show?

A No, I don't.

Q You don't recall my speaking to you about the

cancellation of this particular show?

A No.

Q Is it possible that you're forgetting that we had a

conversation about these shows?

A Is it possible?

Q Rubén---

A No.

Q Yes, is it possible?

A No. I don't think so.

Q So, when you're saying it's not possible that you

could be forgetting this, but it is possible that you could

forget all the other stuff that you have forgotten?


THE DEPONENT: You're asking me very, very com--- you

know, very specifically do I remember this, and my question to

you is no. Do--- could have we talked about this thing, I'm


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205


telling you--- Well, you're asking me could have we talked?

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q Did we talk about this, Rubén Blades?

A No, I don't remember this concert at all.

Q OK. So, "I do not remember", does that constitute it

did not happen?

MS. GONZALEZ: What did not happen? The concert?

THE DEPONENT: The con--- the conversation.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q The question I'm asking--- You just said--- Your

answer, Mr. Colón--- Mr. Blades is this, that you do not recall

that we spoke about this.

A Yes, I'm telling you, I don't.

Q OK. So the question I have in follow up to that---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---is you not recalling, does that mean that it

didn't happen? Your not having memory of it---

A It--- I can tell you it doesn't mean that it happen.

Q I--- I agree.

A So, there you have your answer.

Q But does it mean that it didn't?

A It means that---

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection, asked and answered.

MR. MORGALO: OK. Thank you very much. OK.

Q What is the date of this--- of exhibit 21?


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A Date--- The date of--- Which date, Mr. Morgalo?

Q The---

A The contract described below, May--- this 30th day of

May---

Q Right.

A ---2002.

Q What is the date of the show?

A The date of the show is Saturday, December 7th.

Q December 7---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---correct?

A Uh-huh.

MR. MORGALO: All right.

(Off the record.)


BY MR. MORGALO:

Q Now, based on this contract, what is the fee there?

A A hundred and twenty five thousand dollars.

Q And what is the commission to Martínez, Morgalo and

Associates, based on that fee?

A What is it?

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection, what would be?

THE DEPONENT: I don't know.

MS. GONZALEZ: If there was a show for---?

THE DEPONENT: Ten percent, fifteen percent.


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207


BY MR. MORGALO:

Q What do you know if they--- ah---?

A I don't remember. It used to change. It was ten,

fifteen, I don't know. I don't remember what was it.

Q OK.

A Sometimes it was a certain amount, it would be more,

sometimes a less amount is less--you know--I don't remember

what the fee was.

Q You don't remember what the commission was to

Martínez, Morgalo and Associates?

A I just told you. Sometimes it changed. Sometimes it

was fifteen, sometimes it was ten. No?

Q Do you---? I'm asking the questions.

A And I'm answering you.

Q Do you recall of any time that Martínez, Morgalo and

Associates charged you fifteen percent?

A Absolutely. I think that when you guys started,

that's what you used to charge.

MR. MORGALO: All right. I'd like to submit this into

evidence.



MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: 25?

MS. GONZALEZ: 25.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: OK. Then, I have a mixup here.


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Oh, I have two--- OK.

MS. GONZALEZ: Yes.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I have two copies---

(Off the record.)


BY MR. MORGALO:

Q Mr. Blades, I just handed out exhibit 25---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---could you, please, tell me what that is?

A It says "we debit your account for payment for twenty

five thousand dollars".

Q "We debit" who's account?

A I'm sorry? Me, Rubén Blades Productions. Bank of

America.

Q Can you clarify that?

A What do you mean?

Q This is a wire transfer, correct?

A Yes.

Q OK. Who is the---

A It says---

Q ---beneficiary---?

A ---it says: "we debit your account", so I---

Q OK.

A ---guess that's it.

Q OK. Who's the beneficiary on the account?


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209


A Rubén Blades Productions Incorporated.

Q Who sent you the money?

A Martínez, Morgalo and Associates.

Q What's the date of that---?

A February---

MS. GONZALEZ: 2000, 2002---

MR. MORGALO: No, no, no. 12, December, 10---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: It's a---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: 2002.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Well, just for the record, it

says 02/12/10.

MR. MORGALO: OK.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: The year in front, then, the

year, and then, the day.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Is that February or---?

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: No, it's the year---

MR. MORGALO: No, if we look at the wire trans--- at

the exhibits that are presented prior to, the other wire

transfers, and you can see the dates on those, you'll be able

to clarify what the dates are on this one. We have sent--- we

have given some other exhibits earlier with dates on them.

MS. GONZALEZ: Is exhibit 25, which consists of two

pages, the same page reproduced twice?

MR. MORGALO: No, you look at the top corner of the

page, it's going to have some transaction on the top, left


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210


hand. It's going to have a zero---

MS. GONZALEZ: 070000344FO, and---

MR. MORGALO: You have those. These are the originals.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: IMAD; I-M-A-D.

MR. MORGALO: Right here, up here. 08---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "Y aquí, mira."

MR. MORGALO: Yes, well, here you have 08267 and

07268.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: And the IMAD here.

MS. GONZALEZ: OK.

MR. MORGALO: Oh, an IMAD? I've never--- I don't know

about that. So, what is that--- that number---? OK., OK.

OK. You see that?

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Sure, yes.

MR. MORGALO: Now, if we can---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Fifty thousand dollars.

MR. MORGALO: And if you could see in--- Whe're the

other---? Where's the other exhibit that presented earlier with

the wire transfers?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: The wire transfers? This one?

MR. MORGALO: The other ones. No, the ones that--- ah-

-- that were sent to El Malo, Inc., and to Rubén Blades

Productions.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Oh.

(Pause.)


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211


MR. MORGALO: OK. I just want to do it, so we could

cross-reference the dates, so we could be clear. We already

established, on the other ones, the dates were---

THE REPORTER: 19.

MR. MORGALO: ---the dates were---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "Ay, yo no tengo copia de

`19'." 19 hasn't been--- "Sácale cuatro copias ahí."

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: It's definitely the year.

MR. MORGALO: It's the year, so the first--- Can we

give that to Rubén Blades, so he can let us know---?

THE DEPONENT: So, what is the date here?

MR. MORGALO: All right.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Yes. The first number 02, means

the year.

THE DEPONENT: OK.

MS. GONZALEZ: And then---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Then, the month, and then, the

day. If you compare it to the prior wire transfer---

THE DEPONENT: So, December 10, I got---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Yes.

THE DEPONENT: ---twenty five thousand dollars?

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Yes, sir.

THE DEPONENT: On December 10?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: You're not asking the


212


questions.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q On 2002, you recei--- Those are two wire transfers,

for twenty five thousand dollars each, totaling---

A The same day.

Q ---totaling fifty thousand dollars, that's correct?

A The same day.

Q The same day, yes. OK.?

A OK.

Q Now, the---

A Make notes of that.

Q ---the---

MS. GONZALEZ: December 10---

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q Based on the commission---

THE DEPONENT: December what?

MS. GONZALEZ: December 10th, 2002.

THE DEPONENT: OK.

MR. MORGALO: 2002.

Q Now, the contract--- the engagement contract number

21, exhib---

The engagement contract, exhibit number 21, says

there would be a deposit in the amount of sixty two thousand

five hundred dollars, correct?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Exhibit 21?


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213


MR. MORGALO: Exhibit 21.

THE DEPONENT: Where is that?

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Is the contract.

THE DEPONENT: OK.

What--- what is the question?

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q The deposit amount on that contract.

A Two--- sixty two thousand five hundred, due no later

than June 7, 2002.

Q OK., OK. Sixty two thousand five hundred dollars is

the deposit amount on that contract, correct?

A No later than June 7, 2002.

Q I got that. The question that I'm asking is this: the

amount is sixty two thousand---

A Sixty two thousand five hundred.

Q ---five hundred.

A Yes.

Q Which is fifty percent of the hundred and twenty five

thousand dollars, correct?

A Yes.

Q OK. Now, assuming, for the moment, because you're not

clear on what we charged--- Martínez, Morgalo and Associates

charges ten percent---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---or whether they charge fifteen percent.


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214


A Uh-huh.

Q So, assuming, for the sake of this particular

question---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---if the commission is ten percent---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---of the hundred and twenty five thousand dollars,

how much is that?

A It would be twelve thousand five hundred.

Q If you subtracted twelve thousand five hundred from

the sixty two thousand five hundred, what does that leave you

with?

A Fifty thousand.

Q How much were the amounts of that wire transfer?

A Fifty two thousand five hundred.

Q The wire transfers sent to Rubén Blades Productions.

A Were twenty five thousand each.

Q For a total of?

A What alleged. Fifty thousand.

Q OK. All right, now, what are the dates of---? This

canceled show was December 7th, correct?

A Yes, that's---

Q December 7 was the date---?

A The contract says Saturday December 7th, yes.

Q OK. And you received the funds December 10th.


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215



BY MR. MORGALO:

Q There's a wire transfer there, there's two of them.

A Right

Q Wire transfer was sent---

A The wire transfers---

Q ---to Rubén Blades Productions.

A Those wire transfers that we're going to check state

December 10th---

MS. GONZALEZ: Exhibit 25. You're referring to exhibit

25?

MR. MORGALO: Yes, exhibit 25.


MR. MORGALO: OK.


BY MR. MORGALO:

Q Was dated when? December 10th?

MS. GONZALEZ: Or October 12.

A No, what--- whatever. December--- Let us, for the

sake---

MS. GONZALEZ: December 10.

THE DEPONENT: ---sake of argument, yes.

MR. MORGALO: All right. I just want to get to the

bottom of this---



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MR. MORGALO: ---just like you do---


MR. MORGALO: ---Rubén, OK.? So, we need to be clear.

Now, if we can--- Give me a moment--- We can stay on

the record, we can go off the record, while I look for what I'm

looking for.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Let's take a break.

MR. MORGALO: Yes.

(Off the record.)


MR. MORGALO: OK. Can you ask that question again?

MS. GONZALEZ: No, no, no, no, off the record--- It's

not supposed to be the other way around.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q OK. Did you---?

MS. GONZALEZ: Off the record.

(Off the record.)


BY MR. MORGALO:

Q OK., Mr. Blades---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---on exhibit---

MS. GONZALEZ: That is not an exhibit.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "No, no, la carta."

MR. MORGALO: "La carta `itself, yes'."


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THE DEPONENT: That's WAC. The letter from "maestro"

Blades to "maestro..." "Esto, el 12."

MR. MORGALO: "El 12." OK. Exhibit 12.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "¿Este? No, mentira. Mala mía,

mala mía, mala mía. Ya lo confundí to'."

MS. GONZALEZ: 13.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "¿13? Gracias. La carta de

maestro Blades a... Ese es el 13. ¿13? ¿Willy Colón?"

MR. MORGALO: Yes, "ése mismo es, ése mismo es."

OK. All right. In exhibit--- Are we on the record?

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Yes.

MS. GONZALEZ: Yes.

MR. MORGALO: OK. Exhibit 13, first paragraph, where

it says: "I also want to clarify to the extent of Robert Mo---"

Can you read that out loud, please?

THE DEPONENT: Which?

MR. MORGALO: Where it says: "I also want to clarify

the extent of Robert Morgalo's involvement", from the--- from

that point---

THE DEPONENT: "I also want Arturo to clarify the

extent of Robert Morgalo's involvement in this situation."

MR. MORGALO: Keep going until the end of---

THE DEPONENT: "So far, Arturo is the one we all have

focussed on, but it seems to me, it's obvious, Morgalo had a

hand as well in the embezzlement, and it is in Arturo's


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218


personal interest to explain what role the latter played in

this."

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q When you say it's obvious---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---Morgalo had a hand as well---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---what makes it obvious?

A It makes, to me, the fact that you're responsible,

solidary with the company. The fact that you never said

anything. I don't care you were in Iraq, or you could have been

at the end of the world. It's your name, it's your company, th

is whole thing was very public, the scandal was wide, and---

and never heard anything from you that said: "I had nothing to

do with this, this is not me---" ah--- "how dare you connect

me, I denounce Arturo for--- How could he do this to us, ̀ blah,

blah, blah'." So--you know--that's one issue.

The other issue is all of these things that we're

talking about now, about monies that were sent, the sixty two

thousand five hundred dollars, and nobody knew what--- where

they went, and we still don't know. So, all of those things,

But most--- mostly, the fact that my observation of you, and

how you ran the company, you were the one who really was making

decisions and doing things--- Arturo was more of the guy who

went out with the band, or the guy--- You were the guy who were


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negotiating it, the deals, and that is very obvious also in the

testimony of Ariel Rivas.

Q Uh-huh.

A So, the fact that you--- That Arturo conned you, and

you had no idea of what was going on---

Q Let me ask a question, Mr. Blades, let me ask---

A ---that's hard for me to believe, Mr. Morgalo.

Q OK., Mr. Blades, you're a very accomplished man,

correct?

A Yes, sir.

Q OK. Were you conned by Arturo Martínez?

A We were all deceived, yes.

Q Well, the--- You find it hard to believe that I could

be conned---

A No.

Q ---but it's OK. for you to be conned?

A No, no, no. Not--- I think that there's a big

difference between conned--- my--- are being conned, and you

being conned. You were---

Q How so?

A You were in the responsibility area, sir. Your

company was the one who was providing us with a service.

Q Uh-huh.

A OK.? And your argument is you never knew of anything,

you didn't notice--- It's very interesting that I was asked


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before whether or not I knew that the company was in financial

trouble. Obviously, you had a problem inside. And my

information coming from Arturo is that you were both in

trouble.

MS. GONZALEZ: Oh, really?

THE DEPONENT: Yes.

MR. MORGALO: OK. I'd like to present into evidence---

Hold a second. Can you just--- off the record, while I find

this evidence?

(Off the record.)


BY MR. MORGALO:

Q What knowledge do you have, Mr. Blades, of the

financial statements, or the financial positions of Martínez,

Morgalo and Associates?

A None.

Q None. Your basing that Martínez, Morgalo and

Associates had problems, based on who, or what?

A Based on several issues. One, most importantly, the

testimony of Arturo Martínez.

Q OK. Now, Arturo Martínez was communicating with both

you and Willy Colón, and Ariel Rivas---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---based on testimony that's already on the record,

up until a few days prior to the Siembra show.


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221


A Yes.

Q And up until a few days prior to the Siembra show---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---OK.?--no one knew, according to testimony, that

there was a problem, correct?

A That's what I believe, yes.

Q So, up until that moment---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---Arturo Martínez had been lying to everyone

involved, correct?

A Yes.

Q OK. So this same person, who has lied to everyone---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---who has admitted to spending the money, based on

evidence already presented---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---OK.?

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection to the tone, counsel.

THE DEPONENT: Yes, but it's OK., I don't care.

Go ahead.

MR. MORGALO: I apologize for the tone. Well--you

know--I do.

THE DEPONENT: Well, good.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q The same Arturo Martínez, who has lied to everybody--


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-

A Uh-huh.

Q ---apparently, and who has admitted, on the record,

to have spent the money---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---while I wasn't here, while I was in Iraq, and I

know you don't care about that, OK.? That same person, that

same person is the one that you're ta--- You're taking his

testimony on the financial situations of the company?

A The fact that a person has lied, or the fact that a

person is lying doesn't mean that the testimony that they

present is not truthful. That's going to be determined by the

tribunal, not by me. And one of the biggest cases in the mafia

are made with people who are hitmen, people who are cheats,

people who are killers, and they come up with testimony, and

it's all a matter of how strong the testimony may sound to the

jury, and the jury's going to make a decision. Not me.

Q OK.

A I have to go by what I--- you know---

Q All right.

A ---what I'm hearing directly from your partner.

Q OK.

A And excuse me, and word from the street, comments.

Q Words from the street. Do people in the street know

the financial--- internal finances---


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A No.

Q ---of Martínez, Morgalo and Associates?

A No.

Q OK.

A Not in detail, I wouldn't think.

MR. MORGALO: OK. I'd like to enter into evidence---

Let's start with--- Let's start with this one.

Are we on the record yet?

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: No, it's just that my daughter

stepped into the---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Oh, OK. You want to stop a

second? You want to---?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: She was asking for a key, but

I would---

MR. MORGALO: Oh, OK.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Let's go off the record.

(Off the record.)


MR. MORGALO: OK. I want to enter this as evidence.

This is the only copy I have. We're going to have--- Oh, is

that the case?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: We'll make copies.

MR. MORGALO: Make copies of all of this, if you don't

mind.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "Déjame hacerlo rápido."


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224


MR. MORGALO: Let me put it in order first, so you can

make copies.

(Off the record.)


MR. MORGALO: OK. I'm going to be presenting into

evidence exhibit 26.


MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: You got the original, and three

copies.

MR. MORGALO: I have the original, and I passed out---

How many copies?

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Three copies.

MR. MORGALO: Three copies.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "Quédate con una y dale otra..."

MR. MORGALO: OK.

MS. GONZALEZ: Thank you.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "Allí."

THE REPORTER: "¿Es una página nada más?"

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: "Sí, una página."

MR. MORGALO: Yes, one page only.

(Pause.)

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: OK., and that's exhibit what?

MR. MORGALO: This is exhibit--- what? 26?

Rubén--- or Mr. Colón--- I mean, sir, Mr. Blades---

THE DEPONENT: It's OK. Hey--- Aha, go ahead.


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225


BY MR. MORGALO:

Q OK., Mr. Blades, what is this that I just passed out?

A It's a hundred thousand dollars, advise of credit.

Q OK. Do you know what this is?

A No.

Q Are you aware that this is a grant from the

government to Martínez, Morgalo and Associates? It's a hundred

thousand dollar grant.

A OK.

Q OK.? How much is the amount on that?

A A hundred thousand.

Q OK. What's the date on that?

A Again, what? December 18th?

Q Yes. What year?

A 2002.

Q OK. So, there's a hundred thousand dollars into the

company, on December 18th, 2002, correct?

A Yes.

MR. MORGALO: OK. I want to pass out this one now.

(Pause.)

THE DEPONENT: "¿Y esto es otra cosa?"

MR. MORGALO: Yes, "eso es otra cosa."

THE DEPONENT: OK.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q What is that?


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226


A Ah--- I don't know.

Q Is that a wire transfer?

A Advise of credit.

Q Is it a wire transfer?

A I don't know. It's--- ah---

Q Does it---?

A ---advance of credit---

Q Does it look like the other wire transfers we've been

looking at all day?

A Not really. I would imagine it is. Is it? Yes, I

guess.

Q OK. It's a wire transfer. What is the amount of that

wire transfer?

A What is the what?

Q The amount of that wire transfer.

A One hundred and forty nine thousand dollars, and nine

hundred and seventy dollars. One hundred and forty nine

thousand nine hundred and seventy dollars.

Q That's correct.

A OK.

Q And the date of that wire transfer?

A It's--- ah--- January 12--- I'm sorry, December 12,

2002.

Q OK. And who received these funds?

A This was received by Martínez Morgalo.


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227


Q OK. So, on December 12, 2002---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---at Martínez Morgalo received a hundred and forty

nine thousand nine hundred seventy dollars.

A Yes.

MR. MORGALO: OK. Hold on a second. Now, I'm looking

for---

THE DEPONENT: And these other---?

MS. GONZALEZ: What is Prestige Capital?

MR. MORGALO: No, I ask the questions here.

I'm sorry.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Getting the hang of it, huh?

MR. MORGALO: OK., but I'm going to go ahead and do

it. I just had to do that, 'cause I'm getting--- I am getting

the hang of--- I'm sorry about it.

MS. GONZALEZ: I'm glad you find this amusing.

MR. MORGALO: Well, the thing is I don't mean this---

But when I mess up, they tell me right away. And I don't have

the training.

(Long pause.)

THE DEPONENT: You're waiting for me?

MR. MORGALO: Did they pass that one out yet?

MS. GONZALEZ: Yes.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q OK. What does that look like to you?


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228


A It looks like a slip, a bank slip, deposit, checking.

Q Oh, you can't see the back of this, can you? 'Cause

it's a copy.

A For fifty thousand dollars.

MR. MORGALO: Yes. We're going to make copies of the

second page, but that's what it says there.

THE DEPONENT: This is---

MR. MORGALO: 'Cause I made a copy of---

THE DEPONENT: OK. And it's a deposit, two deposits,

or one deposit for fifty thousand dollars.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q From?

A From Pernod Ricard.

Q OK. All right. What date is that?

A November 8.

Q November 8, so---

A I think. I don't--- Is that what it is?

MR. MORGALO: Yes, that was November 8. So, on

November 8, Martínez, Morgalo and Associates deposited fifty

thousand dollars into the account, correct? So, so far, between

November 8th, and December 12---


MR. MORGALO: ---there's three hundred thousand

dollars that went into the account. OK.? Let me take this one

now.


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229


(Pause.)

MR. MORGALO: So just so far, in the last quarter of

2002, we have three hundred thousand dollars going into the

bank account.


MR. MORGALO: OK.?


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Yes. You made a reference to

November 8?

MR. MORGALO: Yes.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I think the document says

November 14.

MR. MORGALO: Yes, but behind it--- Because you can't

see it on that side, and it's because of the way the copy was

made, all right? Behind it, and you made a copy---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Oh, sorry.

MR. MORGALO: It's OK. We can---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: I'll make another copy.

MR. MORGALO: OK. Just of the second page, that would

be good.

THE DEPONENT: So, what date is it? It was---?

MR. MORGALO: No, you were right on the date.

THE DEPONENT: The 8th, or 14th?

MR. MORGALO: The 8th.

(Pause.)


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230


THE DEPONENT: And like you said, getting close to it,

to--- The more arguments we have, the clearer it is.

This is yet another one?

MS. GONZALEZ: That's another exhibit, yes. The next

one.

MR. MORGALO: Are we still on the record, or---?

THE REPORTER: We are on the record.

MR. MORGALO: OK. We are on the record.

THE DEPONENT: We are? So this is another one for---?

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q For how much?

A A hundred and twenty five thousand dollars.

Q Uh-huh.

A And it's dated--- ah--- January, February, March---

March 13, 2002.

MR. MORGALO: OK.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "Esto es página 2 del exhibit,

aquel que..."

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q And who is it from?

A It's--- Who's it from? From--- from--- Wing Latino

Group.

Q Yes. OK. And it was for how much, again?

A A hundred and twenty five thousand.

Q A hundred and twenty five thousand dollars. And that


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231


was dated---

A March 7, 2002--- Oh, March 13---

Q Yes.

A ---2002.

MR. MORGALO: And this is the next one, right here.

(Pause.)


MR. MORGALO: OK., this is number 30?

THE REPORTER: Number 30.


THE DEPONENT: Are we on the record?

THE REPORTER: Yes.

THE DEPONENT: This is another one, for two hundred

thousand dollars--- ah--- January, February, March, April---

April 3rd, 2002, from Pernod Ricard, check for Latin Nights,

2002 sponsorship.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q OK. For how much? Two hundred thousand?

A Two hundred thousand.


(Pause.)

MR. MORGALO: OK. I've got actually more, that I would

like to submit, but I don't even know if I need to. I guess

what I'm trying to show--- I mean, I could, if you want, 'cause

you're going to turn them all in, if you want. It's up to you.


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232


MS. GONZALEZ: We have asked for all of the financial

record of Martínez, Morgalo and Associates.

MR. MORGALO: OK. And I have them all, OK.? All right?

I do have them all. As a matter of fact, give me the rest of

them, I'll just go ahead--- I'm going to submit the rest of

them as just one exhibit, instead of going back and forth with

all--- Is that OK.?


MR. MORGALO: OK. So just for the save of time.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Sure. I think sister counsel and

I want to see the rest of the documents that you have--- I hope

you're not going to introduce the rest of the---

MR. MORGALO: No, no, no, no.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: ---pack. You just want to---

MR. MORGALO: No, no. This is---

MS. GONZALEZ: We also want your answers under oath to

the interrogatories that went with the document production

request.

MR. MORGALO: You'll have that tomorrow. You'll have

that tomorrow. Here you go. OK.

THE REPORTER: Exhibit 31st.


THE REPORTER: Exhibit 31st.

MS. GONZALEZ: 31?

THE REPORTER: Uh-huh.


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233


MS. GONZALEZ: Two pages?

THE REPORTER: Yes.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "Que no necesariamente `are

related', pero se lo están preguntando..."

THE DEPONENT: "¿Este no fue el que ya vimos? Oh, éste

es otro?" Two thousand--- two hundred thousand, and forty five

thousand?

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "Sí, el primero, aparece el

`deposit slip' del cheque..."

THE DEPONENT: "De Pernod?"

MR. MORGALO: "The Pernod." Yes.

THE DEPONENT: "¿Del que ya vimos?"

MR. MORGALO: "Sí, yo creo que eso..."

THE DEPONENT: Supplemental business W--- World Trade

Center Business Recovery Grant?

MR. MORGALO: Yes.

THE DEPONENT: You applied for that?

MR. MORGALO: Yes. I got--- I got a bunch of grants.

THE DEPONENT: All right. Good.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q So based on the information I've just presented---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---OK.?--it adds up to roughly somewhere be---

Because I haven't added it all up here---

A Uh-huh.


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234


Q ---but I just want to make sure we have it all or not

have it all---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---it's roughly eight hundred thousand dollars.

A OK.

Q OK.? That the company, in 2002, aside from bookings,

aside from Rubén Blades, or anybody--- any other artist in

booking, just in grants, and sponsorship, and--- ah---

factoring, received almost eight hundred thousand dollars in

operational money---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---OK.? The--- Does--- And almost four hundred

thousand of which came in in the month of December---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---OK.? Does that sound to you like a company that's

having financial problems?

A I would have to know what the money was done for. I

mean, you can have four hundred thousand dollars and spend

eight hundred thousand dollars.

Q Correct.

A So I don't---

Q But the point I'm getting is this: you don't know for

sure that the company was in any kind of trouble.

A I have to look at your books. I mean, it's not about

the money that comes in. It's what--- what's the money that


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comes out.

Q OK.

A You can get all the money in the world, and---

Q Well---

A ---and spend it all in gambling, or spend it all in--

- in bad shows, and be broke the next day. I mean, I don't

know.

Q But you're basing the--- the statement that the

company was in trouble, based on what you heard.

A Why did the company go down? Because you left.

MR. MORGALO: I think--- Well, you're asking

questions.


MR. MORGALO: Yes, I know, I know.

THE DEPONENT: It's a rethorical question.

MR. MORGALO: I know, and that's---


MR. MORGALO: And that's--- I'm---

THE DEPONENT: I'm not asking for an answer.

MR. MORGALO: OK. Now, let's go back to---

THE DEPONENT: And it's just making a comment on the

fact that you say that the health--- the company was healthy,

and all of a sudden, it's not. It doesn't work that way.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q Well, let me ask you a question. Do you find it


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236


strange that, up until the time that I was in the company,

there was no problems with the company, but the moment I left

the company, there was big problems?

A I don't know if the company had no problems when you

were there.

Q Well, do you find it strange---

MS. GONZALEZ: I also--- Objection.

MR. MORGALO: Hold a second.

MS. GONZALEZ: Assumes facts not in evidence.

MR. MORGALO: OK.

MS. GONZALEZ: We don't know when you left the

company.

THE DEPONENT: In--- in---

MS. GONZALEZ: That hasn't been established.

THE DEPONENT: In all due--- with all due respect,

like I said before, it--- and that is, again, something that

needs to be--I guess--cleared at some point--you know--you can-

-- you can be--- You don't have to be inside of the office to

be a part of the office. And I know this.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q OK. Let me ask you a question. Do you---? Is it your

belief that, although I was deployed to Iraq---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---that I had the ability---?

A I don't know.


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Q But are you making that assumption?

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection. They are---

A I don't know. I don't know, Robert Morgalo. I have no

idea what you did or did not do. I don't know.

MR. MORGALO: OK. So we're going to go back to the

statement that you made just a little while ago---


MR. MORGALO: ---to clarify, OK.? Where it says: "But

it seems to me, it's obvious---"

THE DEPONENT: Right.

MR. MORGALO: "---Morgalo had a hand as well in the

embezzlement, and it's in Arturo's personal interest to explain

what the role the latter played in it."

THE DEPONENT: And I go back to what I said to you

before. The problem did not begin in January 16th. The problem

began before that.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q OK. So now, what you're saying is that the problem

here---

A Yes.

Q ---for the entire mess that we're sitting here right

now started prior to the 16th of January?

A The problem, as far as I'm concerned, had to do, in

part, with the inability to answer to some of these arguments

that this man Rivas also made in his statement.


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Q Which is?

A When he said that you negotiated the Siembra deal,

that you were in front of the--- that you were the guy in

charge, that you were the guy that did all the stuff, whereas

you say that you had nothing to do with the deal.

MR. MORGALO: I didn't say I had nothing to do with

the deal.

Q Mr. Blades, did I present a contract to you, to look

at, that states that, as a show, a concert for December 7th,

for Rubén Blades in Puerto Rico. Did I present that as

evidence?

A There was a contract there, yes, that I didn't

recognize.

Q I understand.

A Uh-huh.

Q Now, that contract that I'm submitting in evidence---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---is it your impression I submitted it into evidence

to deny that there's such a concert?

A Which concert?

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection. Unintelligible.

THE DEPONENT: Which concert?

MR. MORGALO: OK., OK.

Q I presented to you a contract---

A Uh-huh.


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Q ---which states December 7th Show for Rubén Blades in

Puerto Rico---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---with Rompeolas.

A Uh-huh.

Q I presented it as evidence.

A Yes.

Q You deny any knowledge of that contract.

A Yes, I'm saying---

Q OK.

A ---that I'm not---

Q Do you---?

A ---I don't recognize that---

Q Do you believe that I introduced that contract into

evidence---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---to deny the existence of that contract?

A I don't know why you presented it.

Q OK. Is it possible that I presented that contract

into evidence to show that there was, in fact, a contract for

that date?


BY MR. MORGALO:

Q Is Ariel Rivas claiming that there was a contract for

a date December 7th?


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240


MS. GONZALEZ: Objection. Ariel Rivas is not here.

MR. MORGALO: It's in the record.

THE DEPONENT: What is on the record.

MR. MORGALO: OK. We're going to go back to here.

February---

(Pause.)

MR. MORGALO: Exhibit 14. And that, on the pa--- it

says: "The amount the promoters claim they paid, claim they

paid in 2002 for a show I was to do, and what--- was the---

canceled--- and what was canceled twice".

Q What promoters are claiming that? Ariel Rivas?

A I don't--- I--- Let me--- let me find the--- the

paper, so I can look at it, please. 14?

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: It's exhibit 14.

MS. GONZALEZ: Do you have exhibit 14 there? It's not

over here.

(Pause.)

THE REPORTER: This is 14.

MR. MORGALO: No, I'm sorry. This 14.

THE REPORTER: 13, then.

MR. MORGALO: I'm sorry.

Oh, yes, yes, that was the 14, yes. It's that form,

on the bottom.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "Es el mismo 14 que tú

tenías."


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MR. MORGALO: "Sí, sí."

THE DEPONENT: "No, pero entonces..." Where is that?

MS. GONZALEZ: Oh, this?

MR. MORGALO: Yes.

MS. GONZALEZ: Oh. OK.

MR. MORGALO: Down at the bottom, where it says "The

promoters". "The amount the promoters claim they paid in 2002

for a show I was--- I was to do, and that was canceled twice by

them, due to conflicting schedules."

THE DEPONENT: Yes. What's the question?

MR. MORGALO: OK. And then, on number 6, exhibit 16,

in the bottom, exhibit 16---

THE DEPONENT: I don't have that. Yes.

MR. MORGALO: All right? In the bottom of page 2---


MR. MORGALO: ---this is from you---


MR. MORGALO: ---where it says: "Indica el promotor".

Q Can you paraphrase that in English with---?

A "Promoters state that--- that such amounts"--that's

the sixty two thousand five hundred--"corresponds to the

concert--- of a concert to be realized in Puerto Rico that was

canceled in two different occasions; December, 2002, and

February, 2003.

Q So, Ariel Rivas is claiming---


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242


A Uh-huh.

Q ---and had claimed, and has brought into question

sixty two thousand five hundred dollars that they sent, that

was received by Martínez, Morgalo and Associates for the

purposes of a show in December, correct?

A Yes, that's what it says here, December---

Q OK.

A ---and February.

Q OK. Now, that contract that I presented to you for

December, with Rompeolas--all right?---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---was for December 7th. It was of Rompeolas. Is

there anything in writing that represents an agreement to

transfer the funds from that show to the Siembra show?

A Not that I--- I've never seen that.

Q So that it doesn't exist?

A I don't know.

Q OK. All right. So, now we're getting some place. Do

you belie---? To your knowledge, did Robert Morgalo agree to

transfer those sixty two thousand five hundred dollars---?

A That's what Ariel says.

Q OK., so Ariel--- Ariel can say that your--- I don't

want to get disrespectful. Ariel could say anything. Because

Ariel say so, it's a fact.



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243


BY MR. MORGALO:

Q I'm asking you a question. Is an allegation by Ariel

Rivas, that that money was supposed to be applied to this show,

a fact?

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection, Mr. Morgalo. That's an issue

for trial.

A That's what the promoter is saying.

They presented every single amount of evidence

needed, except for the sixty two at one point, and then, they

gave me--- they gave us those slips.

MR. MORGALO: Correct.

THE DEPONENT: And then, your partner stated that they

received the monies.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q What slips? OK., let's go to the slips.

A The--- the four---

MR. MORGALO: OK. Let's go--- Now--- OK., now--- now

we're getting some place. We're going to go back to the wire

transfers---

THE DEPONENT: Yes.

MR. MORGALO: ---for the Siembra show, which are in

evidence---

THE DEPONENT: You're talking about exhibit 16?

MR. MORGALO: Yes. Now, let me stay on a second---

(Pause.)


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MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: The wire transfers for the

Siembra show, I think it was---

MR. MORGALO: Yes. We--- I presented them---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Ah, they're there. OK.

MR. MORGALO: Yes. I did present the--- all the wire

transfers that corroborate these dates, that Rubén Blades---

And you guys have presented it was well, the wire transfers

from Ariel Rivas.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: 22. No---

MR. MORGALO: Number 16, in the bottom of 16 is a

whole bunch of dates.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: I don't think there's any

question, if I may say, the--- I don't think there's any

question in this table that monies who per--- Sixty two

thousand five hundred dollars---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: No, no, he means---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: ---were---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: No, he doesn't mean that. He

means the ones sent afterwards for the Rubén--- Rubén Blades,

Willy Colón---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Oh, I see.

MR. MORGALO: OK. I want to go back to the wire

transfers that you have here. Look at the dates--- On number

16, look at the dates on the bottom of 16.

THE DEPONENT: Yes.


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245


MR. MORGALO: Look at all those dates.

THE DEPONENT: Yes.

MR. MORGALO: The contract for Siembra, according to

the record, is January 22nd is when that contract was--- was

written. According what evidence is on the record. January

22nd, 2003, exhibit 8, exhibit 7, exhibit 6--- January 22nd is

when the Siembra concert took place.


MR. MORGALO: I'm sorry. That's when the contract is

written.


MR. MORGALO: What?

MS. GONZALEZ: That hasn't been established.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q OK. The date on the contract is January 22nd,

correct?

A I don't know. Where is it?

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection. What contract?

MR. MORGALO: The engagement contract for Siembra.

MS. GONZALEZ: Well, we've seen a few versions of it.

MR. MORGALO: All three versions have the same date.

MS. GONZALEZ: Are they here?

MR. MORGALO: Yes, they're in evidence.

MS. GONZALEZ: But what's the exhibit number?

MR. MORGALO: 8, 7, and 6.


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MS. GONZALEZ: Exhibit 8.

(Pause.)

MS. GONZALEZ: 7 and 8---

THE REPORTER: Off record.

(Off the record.)


THE DEPONENT: "The engagement described below, made

this 22nd day of January, 2003, between the undersigned,

purchaser of music, herein called employer, and now, it is name

of artist, Rubén Blades and Willy Colón.

MR. MORGALO: OK., that's fine.

Q So, the document states that the document was made on

the 22nd of January, correct?

A That's what the document says.

Q All right. So, for the record, the 22nd of January is

the date of the Siembra show---

A OK.

Q ---OK.? Of the contract, of the engagement contract.

A Uh-huh.

Q OK.? Based on that contract, and your statements here

of the money, and the wire transfers that have already been

presented into evidence, the wire transfers from the promoters,

and the receipt of those wire transfers, that I've presented as

evidence as well, to confirm the receipt of those wire

transfers, all corroborate with these dates.


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A OK.

Q Correct?

A Yes, I guess.

Q OK. Now, when you look and add up all of dates, all

of the monies from those wire transfers, what does it add up

to?

A I don't know. What do they add up to?

Q How much the contracted amount for the show?

MS. GONZALEZ: For what show?

MR. MORGALO: For the Siembra show.

A Three fifty.

MR. MORGALO: Three hundred and fifty thousand

dollars.

THE DEPONENT: Yes.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q And those wire transfers for the Siembra show---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---is the three hundred and fifty thousand dollars

received, based on those wire transfers?

A I didn't add them up, but I--- you know, I guess we

can do that right now. Why don't we do it?

MR. MORGALO: Let's do it.


(Off the record.)



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248


BY MR. MORGALO:

Q Mr. Blades, on the deposits paid for the Siembra

show, based on your calculations of exhibit 16, what is the

total that you came up with?

A Two eighty seven--- Two hundred and eighty seven

thousand five hundred dollars.

Q So, based on the wire transfers that we presented in

evidence, that---?

A No, based on the wire transfers that I received from

the promoters. It's two hundred eighty seven thousand five

hundred dollars.

Q Did you receive the deposits from the promoters

directly to you, or through Martínez, Morgalo and Associates?

A No, they went to Martínez and Morgalo.

Q OK. So, these two hundred and eighty seven thousand

five hundred, does that constitute the deposits paid by the

promoters of the Siembra show, for the Siembra show?

A This is what the promoters inform me.

Q OK.

A This is what this paper says.

Q OK.

A I don't know what---

Q All right.

A ---you--- your--- your wire transfers say.

Q And what does that amount add up to, again?


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249


A Two hundred and eighty seven thousand five hundred

dollars.

Q How much was the contracted amount for the show?

A Three fifty. Three hundred and fifty thousand.

Q So, what is the difference between the three hundred-

--?

A Sixty two thousand five hundred dollars missing.

Q OK., so the sixty two thousand five hundred dollars

missing?

A From the total of the three fifty.

Q That what? That the promoter was supposed to send?

A That the contract amounted to.

Q Well, the question I have. You have proof of two

hundred and eighty seven thousand five hundred dollars that the

promoter sent for that show, correct?

A That is correct.

Q Do you have proof for the other sixty two thousand

five hundred dollars that the promoter was supposed to send for

that show?

A No.

Q OK. So there's no proof of that---

MS. GONZALEZ: Yes, there is.

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q ---of that sixty two thousand---

THE DEPONENT: Other than--- There is?


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BY MR. MORGALO:

Q ---five hundred dollars?


MR. MORGALO: OK., I'd like to see that.

THE DEPONENT: Take myself--- Oh, these are the four--

- I'm sorry, these are the four wires.

MR. MORGALO: Hold on a second.

Q What are the dates of those wires? Are these those

four wires that you have over here, that have listed here?

A I don't know.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Listed where.

MS. GONZALEZ: These are the---

MR. MORGALO: I'm sorry. Listed in number 16.

MS. GONZALEZ: Yes, they are---

THE DEPONENT: This is it?

MS. GONZALEZ: ---this one.

THE DEPONENT: Yes.

MR. MORGALO: OK. I want you to read, on number 16,

page 2, paragraph 3, number 3.

THE DEPONENT: "Promotor Dissar Productions alega

que... eh... claims had the amount that was missing to cover

the total contracted sixty two thousand five hundred dollars

were already paid last--- the year before, last year---"

MR. MORGALO: OK.

THE DEPONENT: ---meaning, I guess, 2002.


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251


MR. MORGALO: So---

THE DEPONENT: "The promoter alleges that Martínez

Morgalo received such amounts the following: ten thousand

dollars, on 28th of October, 2002; twenty thousand dollars,

October 3, 2002; twelve thousand five hundred dollars, 21st o

June, 2002; twenty thousand dollars, 27th of June, 2002."

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q For a total of?

A Sixty two thousand five hundred.

Q OK. Now, those deposits---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---were made prior to the contract for Siembra ever

being established?

MS. GONZALEZ: Objection. Ambiguous.

MR. MORGALO: Is that ambiguous? The dates speak for

themselves. You just write off a date---

THE DEPONENT: I don't know--- Excuse me. I'm no sure

when that contract of Siembra was finally discussed for the

first time. I don't know when was the first time this was

discussed.

This is what I know. These amounts were amounts that

were paid for a different type of show---

MR. MORGALO: Exactly, so---

THE DEPONENT: ---allegedly---

MR. MORGALO: Thank you very much.


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252


THE DEPONENT: And then, those amounts were applied as

an advance against the Siembra concert. Is that correct?

BY MR. MORGALO:

Q OK. OK. You just stated that those funds were not for

the--- originally, were not for the Siembra show.

A Not that I stated. I stated what the promoter says.

Q OK. And then, you stated that those funds are

allegedly applied towards the Siembra show.

A The promoter states that that--- those amounts were

applied to the three fifty.

Q So, because the promoter says that, that's what it is

then, right?


BY MR. MORGALO:

Q Is there any evidence in wire transfers specifically

to---

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Oh, wait a second.

THE DEPONENT: Are we going back to this?

MR. MORGALO: Yes, we are going back to this, because-

--

THE DEPONENT: But I--- No, I'm just saying---

MR. MORGALO: ---because---

THE DEPONENT: ---isn't this--- isn't this--- isn't

this a wire--- Am I nuts---

MS. GONZALEZ: No.


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253


THE DEPONENT: ---or---?


MR. MORGALO: Yes, go ahead, go ahead.

(Off the record.)


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Mr. Morgalo, are you done with

your questions?

MR. MORGALO: Yes, yes, I am. Thank you very--- Mr.

Blades, thank you very much.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: No, but you can stay.

MR. MORGALO: No, I'm just putting my pen away.

MS. GONZALEZ: On the record?

THE REPORTER: Yes, on the record.

BY PAMELA D. GONZALEZ, ATTORNEY-AT-LAW:

Q Mr. Blades, why did you not file a criminal or a

civil case against Robert Morgalo?

A Because I--- I got to say that, because I know Robert

has a--- a daughter, and--- that has a heart condition, and---

ah--- and I--- I wasn't going to punish his family.

Q Why did you not file a criminal or civil case against

Arturo Martínez?

A Because he was going to have a baby. And he has no

money.

Q Why did you not file a criminal or civil case against

Martínez, Morgalo and Associates?


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A They have no money. I'm not going to punish the

families. That's basically what I thought. The only way I

thought these guys would come--- you know, if they would have

come forward--- The only thing I thought was--- and I don't

know if I ever mentioned it to you, other than today, if I ever

said--you know--the only way these guys can come up forward is

to---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Let the record show that, when

he said you, he's referring---


MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: ---to Willy Colón.

THE DEPONENT: Is to--- to make them work for us for

free, until they pay us, you know? The fifteen percent of---

and until they pay us, and then--- You know? Because I didn't

see any other way. I swear to God. I know Willy got upset about

that, but so was I, but I'm thinking: "These guys, they don't

have any money--you know--we're going to grab them, the--- the

family's going to be broken---" ah--- "you know, and it's what

for?" You know, it's--- ah--- you know---

BY MS. GONZALEZ:

Q Did you ever instruct Mr. Willy Colón not to press

charges, criminally or otherwise, against Martínez, Morgalo and

Associates, or its partners?

A No. I don't think I did. Or maybe.

Did I, Willy?


255


MR. COLON: Can I talk?

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Off the record.

MS. GONZALEZ: Let's go off the record.

(Off the record.)


THE DEPONENT: You know, and I correct myself. If says

that, that's it. That's--- that's what happened. I mean, I---

I don't---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Well, it's the same. It's the

same.

THE DEPONENT: Huh? No, he didn't do it.


THE DEPONENT: The thing is he didn't do it. But my---

my--- my feeling was the only way we can make these guys pay

for what they did is to hire them--- And I know it doesn't make

sense, perhaps--you know--after what they did, but I--- I'd

say--you know--"so, make them work, and then, they--- they

don't collect their fifteen percent--you know--until they pay

us our--- ah--- whatever they took--you know--and then---

That's what I thought.

And then, I just let it go, 'cause I didn't think

that it was--- I thought that was going to punish the family.

And then, I thought: "We're going to be doing---" You know,

there were some gigs, you said, that we're going to do this

thing, and I figured: "You know, I'll give him the money out of


256


there, and then, that will be OK." And--- and that will be the

end of that, you know?

And these guys, once they--- you know, once they get

their--- their--- their--- their--- ah--- their punishment--you

know--then, you cut them off, you know? You let them go. That's

what I thought.

Q Mr. Blades, do you own any shares---

A No, I don't.

Q ---in Martínez, Morgalo and Associates?

A No, I don't.

Q Do you have any participation in the business entity

known as Martínez, Morgalo and Associates?

A No, I don't.

Q Have you ever been a partner of Robert Morgalo?

A In the sense of the financial sense? No.

Q Correct. From the partnership or other business

association.

A No.

Q Have you ever been a partner of Arturo Martínez in

any business---

A No.

Q ---association? Do you have any financial interest in

or of Martínez, Morgalo and Associates?

A As a firm, no. And--- and--- and again, in this---

Also for the record, I didn't collect, out of the--- whatever


257


it is, the forty thousand or whatever, whatever it was that the

amount of the---

Q The forty nine thousand?

A No, no, no.

MR. MORGALO: The sixty two thousand five hundred?

THE DEPONENT: No, no, no, no, no. The---

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: The forty nine thousand?

THE DEPONENT: The--- No, no, no, the--- "el..." The

fee, the commission.

MS. GONZALEZ: It's thirty five hundred.

MR. SAAVEDRA-CASTRO: Oh, thirty five thousand

dollars.

THE DEPONENT: Whatever. Yes. I don't get commissions

from--- you know, I don't collect from the commission. So--you

know--it's not my deal.

BY MS. GONZALEZ:

Q When was the decision to travel to Puerto Rico, and

perform the Siembra concert made?

A Ah--- I think that--- that--- that night, the

Thursday--- When I--- we're talking with Das, with the--- with

Willy and the lawyer.

Q When you were in Los Angeles, and Mr. Colón was in

New York?

A Right.

Q Would you have agreed to travel to Puerto Rico, and


258


to perform the Siembra concert in the absence of that

conversation with Willy and his attorney?

A I would--- I--- I--- My position at the time, as I

remember, was to say no, and not go. I mean, I was--- I--- I

felt terrible, I thought we had like three more days to tell

people--you know--"I'm sorry, but we got to clear this up".

But the argument--- Like I said, I'm not an idiot,

and I heard the argument, and the argument--- With the--- the--

- It was also very--- You have to understand the moment. The

moment was he was being threatened by some guy over there---

ah--- which I don't know if I knew that at that time, or I knew

how--- you know--- I made--- gauged its importance--- ah--- But

it was right there, in the moment, I don't know if the man did

it just in spite of it, I don't know what it was, but the whole

point that he was claiming that Willy hadn't--- ah--- you know-

-- he hadn't shown up for a gig or what not.

But the other thing was that, in lieu of the fact

that these guys had made the payments, the--- Das thought--and

he was right--that we were going to get sued. "You're going to

get sued, and he's going to get sued twice", basically. Because

the other guy's going to jump right away, and say: "See what I

told you? This guy doesn't show up on the gigs, and `blah,

blah, blah'."

Q Did you ever instruct or authorize Martínez, Morgalo

and Associates, or its partners to apply sixty two thousand


Robert

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Robert

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259


five hundred dollars, that was paid to Martínez, Morgalo and

Associates, for a different show towards the Siembra concert

funds?

A Never.

Q To your knowledge, did Mr. Colón ever instruct or

authorize application of that sixty two thousand five hundred

dollars towards the Siembra show?

A Absolutely not. We would have known. We would have

talked to him.

Q Have everything you testified to here this afternoon,

this--- today been the truth?

A Absolutely.

MS. GONZALEZ: No further questions.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: One quick question.

RE-DIRECT EXAMINATION


Q When you were saying that M&M should work---

A Uh-huh.

Q ---without a commission for a while---

A Uh-huh. For both of us.

Q ---"for both of us" performing together? Is that---

A Yes.

Q ---what---?

A I thought--- Yes. I don't think Willy was going to

use them individually. Although, again, in--- in the business,


Robert

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Robert

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Robert

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Robert

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Robert

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260


we work with different people. Here Maisonar (phonetic) comes

over, perhaps Mercado--God bless him--comes over, these guys

come over, David Maldonado--you know--nobody was signed to

anybody that I--- I don't--- I don't--- I never sign with

anybody.

So, but these guys, I'm thinking, well--you know--

we're talking about doing other gigs, I figured, you know---

MS. GONZALEZ: Based on your question, counsel, I have

one more question.

RE-CROSSEXAMINATION

BY MS. GONZALEZ:

Q Why didn't the Shea Stadium offer that had been

proposed after the Siembra concert didn't go through?

A I don't know. I don't know. I think--- ah--- I--- I

thought it could be done. I--- I--- I thought it was a good

idea, actually.

RE-DIRECT EXAMINATION


Q But right now, the Shea Stadium does not exist.

A Yes, that'd be something.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: Well, I have no further

questions. Does anybody have any?

MS. GONZALEZ: No.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: No one has any questions.

Well, thank you very much. Thank you for coming here,


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everyone.

THE DEPONENT: This has been painful as hell, but

I've--- But good.

MR. COLON: You should have been here yesterday.

THE DEPONENT: Why?

MR. COLON: 'Cause it was painful too.

THE DEPONENT: Oh.

THE REPORTER: Off the record?

MR. COLON: Yes, of course. Oh, yes.

MR. HERNANDEZ-MAYORAL: "Sí." Let's go off the record.

(Whereupon, the deposition was concluded.)

****************


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CERTIFICATE OF DEPONENT

I, Rubén Blades Vellido de Luna, the deponent herein,

do hereby certify that this is an accurate and complete

transcription of the testimony given by me at the time and

place of my deposition.

Dated this ____ day of _____________, ____, in

________________________, Puerto Rico.

____________________________


DEPONENT

****************


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CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER

I, Rosiris Miranda, E.R. Reporter, member of FASYO

Reporters, do hereby CERTIFY:

That the foregoing is a true and accurate transcript

of the recording of proceedings held at the time and place

hereinabove set forth; and;

That I am not related by blood or marriage to any of

the parties in the above-captioned matter, nor am I in any way

interested in the outcome of the same.

In San Juan, Puerto Rico, this 26th. day of May 2009.

_____________________

ROSIRIS MIRANDA

E.R. REPORTER

****************


264


CERTIFICATE OF NOTARY

I, Manuel San Juan, Attorney-at-Law and Notary

Public, duly commissioned and qualified in and for the

Commonwealth of Puerto Rico, do hereby CERTIFY:

That the foregoing deposition was taken on the date

and time heretofore mentioned;

That the reporter and the deponent were sworn by me

before the commencement of the taking of the deponent's

testimony;

In witness whereof, I sign these presents and affix

my notarial seal in San Juan, Puerto Rico, this ____ day of

________________________, ____.

____________________________

MANUEL SAN JUAN

NOTARY PUBLIC

****************


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