1867 Budget Speech

8/13/2019 1867 Budget Speech

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HOUSE OF COMMONS

Saiurday D.c.mb.r 7 1187The Speaker took the Chair at 3 o'clock.The General Committee on ElectioIU reported that they had lXed the following daysfor choosing Select Election Committee:Kamouraska Wednesday, l8th DecernberYam88ka, Thursday 26th December.

ESTlMATESA mel 8age WBS brought down from is

Excellency, transmitting estlmates of thesurns required for services not otherwiseprovided for, for the nlne months endlng 31stMarch 1868, amounting t'a 5,264,239.On motion of Hon. Mf Rose, the messageand accompanying estimatea were referred tothe Committee on Supply.

THE FINANCIAL STATEMEKTThe Hon. Mr. Bo thenmoved that theHouse resolve i tsel f into Committee of Supply, and in doing so made his ftnancIal statement as Minis ter of Finance. In rising to laybefore the House a statement of the ftnanclalcondition of the Dominion, he asked the forbearance of gentlemen onboth sides. Inorderthat they mlght understand more clearly thestaternent he was about to make he wouldrefer to the order in which he proposed topresent - them:-First account of Canadaproper-ontario and Quebec-for the year

endin 30th June 1866, and accounts ending30th June 1867; seconcUy, obligations of theDominion assumed on the Ist July last; thirdly the ftnancial condition of the Dominion onthe 30th November last; and lastly, statementof income and expenditure fram lst July lasttm 30th June next. The public accounts fo rthe year ending 30th June 1866, were alreadyin the hands of members; but the accountsfor the year endin 30th June 1867, were notin a sufficient state of forwardness to bedlstributed-but he would see to it that theywould be forwarded to members during therecess. For the year ending 30th June 1866,the income and expenditure of Canada properwas as foUows: Total recelpts from aUsources, 12,672,880. There were howeverdebentures sold that year amounting to 400,

leaving the receipts on ordinary accounts12,672,480. The expenditure for the sameperiod WBS 12,418,105, but of thi SUIn335,979 was for the redempUon of the publicdebt leaving for ordinary expenditure fort ha t yea r 12,082,126, showing surplus on latJuly 1866, of 590,354. It wu to he remembered too, that severa1large items of expenditure for that year are of an exceptionalcharacter and would not llkely occur apln.For the year ending 30th June 1867, the totalrecelpts 16,400,1.39, and the total expenditure

14,729,090, leaving an apparent surplus of1 671 049-these receipts include 3,986,900as receipts for debentures iBsued that year;and the expendltures include 1,813,117 redemption of public debt-sothat the nonnaIreceipts for that year were 12,412,239 andthe normal expenditure 12,915,973, leav1n&an apparent deftdt of 503,733. his expenditure also Includes a large amount for exceptional accounts. The Milltla expendlturewhlch began on the previoUB year had to acertain extent to be continued thIa year tothe amount of 1,412,932; allo on publicworks which would not be likel . to occuragain. For instance the Parliament Buildings466,382; the dues re1unded in consequence ofthe new tarift of u session amounting to 270,427.These items were of exceptionaIcharacter and mlgh t fairly be deducted fromthe ordinary expenditure of that year. Hewould next enter upon a statement of theftnances of the Dominion sinee lst July laat.The House was aware that the Dominion, inassuming the revenue of the various r v ~inces, also assumed thelr liabilltieJ. wus tipula ted in the Union Act that the debtassumed by the Dominion was, for Ontarioand Quebec, sixty-two and one-half millions;for Nova Scotla six millions; and for NewBrunswick seven millions; it wu furtherprovided that the Dominion should pay interest on these three amounts. In addition to aUthese amounu the Dominion haB to payeighty centsper head of population of theseveral Provinces at the tlme of Union; and afurther SUffi to Ontar io of 80,000; to Quebec, 70,000; to Nova Scotia, 60,000; and to NewBrunswick 50,000. New Brunswick allo received in addit ion to these su ms an additionalsum of 53,000, for the consideration men-


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212 COMMONS DEBATES December 7. 1887tioned in the Union Act. The Dominion alsohas to pay the salaries of all the officers the Dominion, in the different Provinces. Hementioned these tacts that the House mlghtcorrectly understand the various items 01outlay for which it was a duty to sk votefrom them. He would not proceed with bisfinancial statement of the Dominion s inceits existence. Honourable. gentlemen wouldremember that the several i tems of revenuewhich were pla


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Dec:.mber 7.1867 COMMONS DEBATES 3of the fiscal agents-a further SUIn of 206,980,making the total floating debt of the Dominionon the 31st October last 6,911,901.

Mr. a r t w r i S J h t ~ s that exclusive of Provincial Notes and Debentures?Mr. Roa.-Yes. He would now state to theHouse the mode whlch Government proposedto deal with the floating debt. In the ftrstplace, there were certain assets of the Government of Canada whlch ought to realized in order to go in liquidation of that debt.There were 220,000 pound sterling bonds ofthe Province of Nova Scotia now in the handsof the tiscal agents in England. That one itemrepresented about a mUlion of dollars. Therewere due to the Dominion 1 Canada certainsums by various corporations, institutions,and municipalities, wbich, i ai l collected,

would reduce in a very considerable degreethe amount 01. floating debt e did notpresume it was possiblewith due regard toexisting interests to 1.0rce unduly or harshlythe payment of these large SUlJl. but a veryconsiderable portion 1 them he was satisftedmight be made available withln a not veryremote period.Hon. Mr. Holton asked if thehonourablegentleman would mention the nature of theseassets.Hon. Mr. Rose said the OTeat WesternRailway was due .a large SUIn, and severalother corporations, etc., were due considerable sums.Hon. Mr. HoUon asked whether he includedthe liabilities 1 municipalitiee under theMunicipal Loan Fund Act.Hon. Mr. Ro.e said he dld not allude tofuese. .Hon. Mr. J. S. Macdonald-You re1.er to theGreat Western and Northern liabillties.Hon. Mr. Roae--Yes.Mr. Mac:kemie--They will give you nearlythe whole amount.Hon. Mr. HoltoD-And there Js the llabilltyof the Bank of Upper Canada.Hon. Mr.Row-Possibly. He would now go

on to sta te wha t further provision heproposed to make 1.0r meeting this 1l0atlngdebt; and he would at once state that he didnot propose doing anything whJch would Jnterfere wt th the commercial and banking institutions the country. (Hear, hear>. He did9903&-15

not think it would be wise toat tempt todeplete the deposits which were in the banDby obtaining trom them a loan to Government of the very considerable sum which hehad mentioned as now due on the floatingdebt. He certainly much preferred a domesUcto a foreign .loan. Hear, hear). I t gave peoplea greater in terest in the stablllty of ourinstitutlons, and alter allowance was madefor commissions, exchange, etc., a domesUcloan at a higher rate of interest was probablycheaper than a foreign loan at a lower rate;but as he had said, he thought l t would beunwise to attempt at once and hastlly toabsorb, the 1l0ating debt by means of a loan.A laree amount of money now invested inmQrtgages and .other securit ies wouId gradually come in if Provincial debentures wereissued; but if debentures were issued ta theamount that would be necessary to wipe outthe 1l0ating debt, the .Government wouldnecessari ly come into competition with thebanks for money now deposited in them, andthis would compel the banJ to restr ic t thefacilities they wouId otherwise aJ ord to merchants for purchasing their Spring importations, which would be an untortuna te resultthat would react very injudiciously on theCustoms revenue 01. succeeding months. Butthere were other very considerable SUIDa inthe country whlch individuals, trustees, andothers would be glad to invest in Governmentsecuritles, and he proposed to ask power tacreate a Dominion stock ln which truateesand executors, corporations, Court of Chancery, and others entrusted with trust monies,might be able to make their investments. Hebelieved that a very considerable proPortionof our indebtedness might be gradual ly absorbed in that way. The Governmentproposed also to give facilities for the pur-chase of terminable annulties. The statisticsof insurance companies showed that therewas a considerable demand for that kind ofannuity, and that many individuals would beglad to purchase annuitles at a rate of interest somethin, like six per cent, either ontheir own lives, or those of thelr chUdren. Aconsiderable sum mlght be made avaiJable tothe Government in that way. There wa third source tram which a considerable summight be obtained-the extension of the principal of Savings Banks. there was anythingwhich the Government ought to encourage, ifit could, i t wa5 habits 01. economy and thrUton the part of the populaUon; and U therewas any class of securities which ought to beput beyond the reach of possible contingencies, it was the savings of the poor. We found


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214 CONNONS DEBATES December 7,1887that where Government had taken SavinpBanks under their protection, the number ofdeposltors and amounts per head hl proportion to population were very much increased.In Ontario and Quebec the Savings Bankswere generally bran


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Dece DbeI' I,1817' . COMMONS DEBATES 215they hoped te able to place ln the poasession of the House detai led estimatel of aUb ranches o f the service; but it wa s impossiblete do this t1ll appropriations had been made.He would now state what our wants werelikely to e For a right understandini ofthls, it wa s necessary that he should mentionthat in the Mar itim e Provinces there werelarge amounts of works going on, .contractedfo r p re vi ou s t o the date at whlch Dominionbegan. Sorne of these mlght be found to bemere local works, o th ers w ou ld forro part ofthose te b e i nc lud ed in the property of th eDominion. The rate of proareBB of these works, t wa s quite impossible to form anyaccurate estimate of. Existing contracts weregoing on, an d th e Dominion wa s bound tomeet the expenditlu-e either out of capitalaccount or ordinary expenditure and shouldendeavour to dlstinguish between what he cons id ered cap it al account and what was ordinary expenditure. Th e estimates 1 expenditure were as 1.o110ws:-Interest on the publicdebt $4,363,000; charges on manaiement n-cludini premium. discount and exchanie$150,000; s in ki ng fun d $206,980; civil government includini salaries of judges in LowerProvinces $324,926; administration 1 justice$439,000; poUce, river harbour and frontier$55,000. Penitentiary and Rockwood Asylum$176,500; legislation $575,000; Observaterles,Toronto and Quebec, $7,200; geololical survey, $30,000, $10,000 b ein g a dd ed to th e former grant so th at th e Lower Provinces mighthave th e bene6t or th e service 1 th e ablehead survey. The next item for militia n-cluding marine an d defensive expendlture alarge sum was on capital account, and wouldno t have to be met in subsequent years,$1,600,000. The o rd in ar y e xp en di tu re was$744,240 including Nova Scoa and NewBrunswick. But there were other items whichthis year had to be met, for instance, $150,000fo r barrack accommodation. Stores purchased, $200,000. These incidental itemsamount to $543,490; and would no t come intosubsequent years; but he did no t be1ievethere wa s a man in the House who wouIdgrudge any sum necessary for the defence oftheir homes.


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216 COMMONS DEBATE8 Decembel 7. 1867

50,0007,000

10,00018,00025,00040,00043,00060,00050,00020,0002,0004,000100,00050,00065,00014,600

Making a total of . . . . . . . . . 14,457,400[Mr. Rose (Huntin,don)]

The resuIt of these details was thl that theordinary estimated expenditure for the cur-rent year, up to 30th June next, wu 14,-301,301; and the estimated revenue 1 4 4 5 7 4 0 ~ l e a v i n g a surplus of 156,090.Hon. MI . Hollon B u t on the whole ac-

countB of the year there will be a deflciencyto be met in some way.Hon. r Rose denied that. They had toprovide undoubtedly for the amount neces-sary to construct those railways in the LowerProvinces, but that amount might be found tobe within the 7,000,000 and 8,000,000 to beassumed respectively by Nova Scotia andNew Brunswick.Hon. l b . AnsrUn asked whether in estimat-

iog the amount to be paid to the LowerProvinces, the Finance Mlni ster included theinterest on existing debtB.Hon. MI . Rese said he had. Hia honourablefrlend (Mr 0 Holton> hadasked for the subsi-dies payable by the Government to the sever-al Provinces. They amounted to 2,797,446,from which, however, had ta be deducted theinterest payable by Ontario and Quebec onthe capital of 8,700,000, the est1mated sumby whlch the debt of these WO Provinces

exceeded 62,500,000, the debt with whichthey came into the Union. He hoped that theHouse would understand that ln speakln, ofthe Itetml of permanent worka was notintended by that amount to increase the debtof the Dominion, for it might be, and hetrusted it wouId be, within the debt withwhich these Provinces entered the Union. Inthe statement which he had thua en-deavoured, as brieny as possible, to laybefore the House, the sums dealt with wereconsiderable, but the resources, means andenergies of this country, were, he believed,ample to meet the demands upon them. Hewould state a few acts with reference to theprogress of these Provinces durlng the laatelght or ten years, which would i llus tra tethelr resources and capabillties. In NovaScotia, in 1856, the revenue from Customsand Excise waa 377,270. In 1866 ft hadincreased to 1,231,902. (Hear, hear). The lmportJ of the Province rose from 8,3.9,160 in1856 to 14,381,008 in 1866, while the expor tsrose in the same time from 6,86.,790 to8,043,095, exclusive of ships sold. Then therehad been an increase in shipping from 4,-594,000 in value in 1856 to 13,749,000 in 1866.He was satisfled this evidence on the part ofour eIder sis ter would be re,arded with areatsatisfaction by all the Western Provinces. He

9,121,9003,000,000569,00050,000837,00035.00030,00030,00012,00020,00018,00025,00010,500100,00040,000

estimated at 10,000. These items togethermade a total possible expenditure for theyear of 16,226,801, tr which, however,wu to be deducted 1,925,000. for itemswhich he had stated to the House properlybelonged to construction or capital account,leaving the ordinary estimated expenditure ofthe year 14,301,301. He would close t sbranch of his s tatement by saying that of thisexpenditure the items which the auditorsaccording to the best information he had beenable to get, found were not provided for byaccounts of Parllament, amounted to 7,019,-039, threefourths of which, 5,264,279 wasthe amount mentioned in the message homHis Excellency as necessary to be provided,to carry on the Government 31st MarchoHe then stated the probable revenue of theyear. They estimatedRevenue from Customs at Froni Excise .Postage o.. Ocean Postage . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .Public Worles, Including llght . . . Provincial Steamers , .Ordnance lands . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .Casual and miscellaneous . . . . . . .Interest on investments .Premiums and discount . . . . . .Bank Interests . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .Law fees . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .Fines and orfeltures . . . . . . . . . .Bill stamps . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .Law Fee Fund, U.C . . . . . . . . .Tonnage, duUes, Quebec RiverPolice . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .Tonnage duty, marinera Fund . . .p.assengen duty, immf.gration and

quarantine 0 Railway and steamboat inspec .Fisheries . , .Cullers fees . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Penltentiary . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .MUitia . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .Sundry special receipts . . . Copyright duties .Indian fund . . . . . . 0 Great Western Railway Int. C . .Receipts rom sales Public WorluNorthern Railway Interest C . .Consolidated Fund InvestmentAccount .Montreal Harbour Commissioners


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December 7,1887 COMMONS DEBATES 217al50 gave figures showing the increased productiveness of the coal and gold mines of thatProvince. Then coming to New Brunswick theprogress had been equally gratifying. In 1856,the Customs dut ies realized 596,994, and in1866, 1,186,751. The imports in the formeryear amounted to 7,505,890, and in the latterto 10,417,495; while the exports rose from5,366,755 to 6,639,275, exclusive of vesseIssold. Then the vessels owned in the Provinceincreased from 133,669 tons in 1857 to 233,945in 1866. In Canada, the imports in 1858amounted to 29,777,852, trom which theyrose to 52,637,675 ln 1866, showing an in crease of 81; per cent in nine years. Hear,hear). In 1858, the exports amounted to 23,472,609, from which they increased to 53,930,789 in 1865 and 1866. In the last year,however, thcy were increased by consequenceof the demand caused by the Amerlcan warand by the threatened abrogation of theReciprocity Treaty, so that fo r his comparisonhe would take the year 1866- 67 when theexports amounted to say 45,570,109, an in crease since 1858 of 94i per cent, showingthat the productive powers of the countrywere more than sufflcient to meet i ts engagements abroad. Hear, hear) . The Rouse wouldsee that the large exports of 1865- 66 wereowing to exceptional causes, and the decreasein 1866- 67 might at first glance seem unsatisfactory. In the former year, however , therewas an unusual demand trom the States forhorned cattle, so that the falllng off in1866 67 in this article of export aloneamounted to 3,121,343. In flour aIso therewas a talling off of 1,506,904 compared with1866. In the exports of sheep, swine , beef,there was a falling off of 325,000 comparedwith the previous year. This was a seriouscondition of alIairs, but t was gratifying toknow that tpough trade had fallen off withthe United States, new channels of trade hadsprung up with other countries, and that ourto tal exports in 1863- 66 and 67, as comparedwith our exports of 1863- 64 and 65 showedan increase of upwards of 5,000,000. Compa re the present year with the ten preceedingyears, and it would be seen that there wasincrcase of 107 per cent. Re would now reterto our Intercolonial trade. t was gratitying toknow that commercial intercourse had increased among ourselves. The exports in 1863to British North American colonies tromCanada proper was to the amount of 935,000; but it had increased in 1867 to3,480,OOo-almost double the amount of exports the year previous. The imports from theLower Provinces are increasing enormously.

There were now three lines of steamers plying between the Lower Provinces and Mont real , coming up freighted with coal, etc., andcarrying back flour. He concluded by referring to the difflculties to be met in comingdown to details the expenditure for thecoming year, and he thought it would not beasking too much to ask the forbearance andassistance of this House to equalize our revenue and expendi ture , and place the financesof the country upon a sound basis. In this hewas quite sure he would receive trom sides the House the hearty co-operation ofevery man who wished to see the prosper ityof his country. Applause).

Hon. Mr. Hol ton would take this opportunity to congra tu late h is honourable f ri end theMinister of Finance, upon the ability w ithwhich he had discharged his difflcult duty.


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2 8 COMMON8 DEBATES e c m ~ r 7 87Province was in 50 prosperous a condition. Atthe time of the passing of the ConfederationAct bonds of Nova ScoUa in the hands of theflnancial g n ~ in England stood in themoney market two if not three per centhigher than those of Canada. They never hadimy trouble with their bonds. With reprd tothe future he rather liked the announcementmade by his honourable friend the countrywould not rush too fast into reckless expendi-ture i the expenditure was kept withinreasonable lfmit. he belleved it naturalgrowth and prperity would soen rel ieve uain a great measure trom our ftoatiI1l debt. Hetrusted for the honour of the country i twould be 50 and i the honourable gentle-man while he holds bis present positioncomes down as he bas done to day conceal-ing nothing but deaUng candidly and fairlywith the House he would always rece1ve thatconsideration without which no FinanceMinister could weil perfonn hiI duties.Hon. J. S. Macdonald was happy to see thatthe policy had been accepted of raising thenecessary funds among ourselves and notbeen obliged to go to England to sell ourdebentures. He had supported the currencyAct last session and was glad to see that itMr Howe Han t l ]

worked so well that we were relleved framthe painful exhibit ion of attemptlDg to ra1aemoney in England by a sale of our deben-tures.Mr. Young wouId like to ask the onMinister of Finance how he propOled to meet

the deflciency he had just announced to ezJst.H o ~ Mr. ROI. said the amount must beraised by increasina the debt.The House then went into Committee the Whole on the Supply Bill and Immediate-ly after rose and reported progreSl.In answer to Mr. HoltonSir John A. Macdonald said that elther theresolutions on the North West or the ques-

tion of supplies would he taken up Arat onMonday.EDUCATION REPORT

Hon. Mr. LaDgntD presented the annualreport for 1866 the Superlntendent ofEducation for Upper Canada.The House then adjoumed at 8 p.m. t l l lMonday.

1867 Budget Speech

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Transcript of 1867 Budget Speech